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I believe that in the US in many contexts, the term "hot rod" can be applied to many post-49 body styles. I've seen US magazines refer to souped-up '70s muscle cars as hot rods, especially if they are involved in drag racing. The term "Street Rod" is definitely still limited to pre-49 bodystyles, but hot-rods and hot rodding are not in my opinion. As an aside, in Australia the Street Machining hobby and indeed Street Machine magazine are still alive and going better than ever, but interestingly street machining has readily accepted a move from the original '60s and '70s cars to modern cars all the way up to brand new. Of course it does help that we can still buy thundering 400hp V8 sedans in Australia for an affordable price, so the muscle-car mindset is still alive in the new car market, but nevertheless it's nice to see modified versions of new cars, old cars of every era, hot rods and even mini trucks all sharing space in the one magazine.
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I say leave the classic car and rod scenes to get on with their chequebook builds and long live Retro Rides ;D Er, My '82 BMW E21 323i cost me £1700, I do all the work on it myself, I can go to bona fide classic car shows and so-called 'r#tro' events. So where does that leave that car? There are loads of people that run classic cars (or rods) on a shoestring budget and do a lot, if not all of the work on their own cars, yet don't consider themselves part of a so-called 'r#tro' scene. Remarks like yours only serve to further alienate people and push mindsets apart. Stop pigeonholing.
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Thanks - that was what I hoped to hear! I shall continue my evil thoughts regarding a rodded Riley RM ;D This piqued my interest. Riley are so underpowered they *need* to be rodded, or led sledded, or customised in some awesome way. If ever I have the funds, a Riley RME is top of my wishlist... along with the V12 I'd want to squeeze into it.
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Rob M
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,915
Club RR Member Number: 41
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I decided, although ive really, really tried not to, read this thread. Good God!!! Get a grip! I don't think there is a living soul who didnt get into cars and modifying them and not understand pretty quickly that the UK Hot Rod "scene" was one of the most incestuous, anal and fawning (to the the good ole US of A ) "societies" in car modifying. Quite why there are five pages of a thread on its demise or not, when its patently obvious that 99% of the membership and contributors to this forum don't own a Rod and clearly don't want to, is beyond me. Rodding was only ever a small part of the British customising scene, christ, my dad and his mates were customising cars back in the late 50s and early 60s without the influence of Stateside Rodding publications! If it dies it dies, the Zodiac died, the Spacehopper died, Spen King died and 99% of Early mondeos have died. Its life, British Hot Rodding either stops being so anal changes or, it too dies. Granted, not the most reasoned, articulate nor expressive of arguments but, hey, shoot me. I don't care.
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Brian Damaged
West Midlands
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 9,555
Club RR Member Number: 33
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It's just human nature to pigeonhole, compartmentalise, label everything. It's also (regrettably) human nature for each faction to hang with their own, and to then consider themselves a cut above everyone else. That's why we have wars between religions, wars between fans of different football teams.....and hissy fits between various factions of our hobby. Which, wether it's a '32 Ford or a '92 Corsa, is basically the same thing, and the maxim upon which we ALL live our lives. 'Having Fun With Cars'
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'Having Fun With Cars' Isn't that what it's all about? We all need to lose the politics surrounding our hobby, It's getting tiresome.
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I decided, although ive really, really tried not to, read this thread. Good God!!! Get a grip! I don't think there is a living soul who didnt get into cars and modifying them and not understand pretty quickly that the UK Hot Rod "scene" was one of the most incestuous, anal and fawning (to the the good ole US of A ) "societies" in car modifying. Quite why there are five pages of a thread on its demise or not, when its patently obvious that 99% of the membership and contributors to this forum don't own a Rod and clearly don't want to, is beyond me. Rodding was only ever a small part of the British customising scene, christ, my dad and his mates were customising cars back in the late 50s and early 60s without the influence of Stateside Rodding publications! If it dies it dies, the Zodiac died, the Spacehopper died, Spen King died and 99% of Early mondeos have died. Its life, British Hot Rodding either stops being so anal changes or, it too dies. Granted, not the most reasoned, articulate nor expressive of arguments but, hey, shoot me. I don't care. you pretty much have that spot on.....and I am part of the most incestuous, anal and fawning societies going....BUT if you want to build a period perfect car you have to be. ..... If you don't understand the reasoning behind why a rod looks a particular way you just won't "get it". As you have pointed out 99% of the people on here don't have a rod of have any interest in getting one and so won't actually "get" what we do or why we do it, for some it's about speed, for some it's about looks and for some it's about having a car that apes a period in time...for me it's a 60s thing and my rod is morphing from a 50s style rod to a mid 60s style rod... and finally...a hot rod is a pre-49 body style.....the term hotrod is used to describe practically any modded car when the journo has nowt else to say...it's also become a style in which newer cars are built...white walls and red steel wheels mat black paint etc..Street Rod was a term used by the american rodding press in the 70's and 80s in a vain attempt to make hot rods seem more acceptable. It's now a tern used to describe the "softer" type of rod, usually those that don't fall in to a "era" and those that are at the cutting edge of rodding...like the blue roadster on last months CC cover...
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I say leave the classic car and rod scenes to get on with their chequebook builds and long live Retro Rides ;D Er, My '82 BMW E21 323i cost me £1700, I do all the work on it myself, I can go to bona fide classic car shows and so-called 'r#tro' events. So where does that leave that car? There are loads of people that run classic cars (or rods) on a shoestring budget and do a lot, if not all of the work on their own cars, yet don't consider themselves part of a so-called 'r#tro' scene. Remarks like yours only serve to further alienate people and push mindsets apart. Stop pigeonholing. I aplogise ive just read that and see how it sounds its not how it was supposed to sound i meant leave those who in the classic and rod scene to it who do chequebook restorations to it i didnt mean people should leave the scenes i think the more that do projects on a shoestring budget the better,i wasnt pidgeonholling honest just came out wrong So Sorry
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I aplogise ive just read that and see how it sounds its not how it was supposed to sound I meant leave those who in the classic and rod scene to it who do chequebook restorations to it I didnt mean people should leave the scenes I think the more that do projects on a shoestring budget the better,i wasnt pidgeonholling honest just came out wrong So Sorry TBH I didn't think you were at the time Jo..... and was a little surprised by the response, but going back can see how it was misconstrued. 'Back yard' builds as our american cousins or 'shoestring' as you referred to them, are the source of much innovation, and as said earlier..... was the original motivation behind hotrod building. To compete at the higher levels nowadays, it is probably fair to say that you need deep pockets and I think that that is the nub of the problem. These guys don't want to be upstaged by a back yard build if they can help it. Don't get me wrong I drool over some expensively built hotrods, as much as a lot of RR'ers do, but I still appreciate the work that goes into some of the less expensive builds you find on these pages. Occasionally, you come across a low budget build that beats the sh*t out of something that cost 10 times more..... and I just love it when that happens! It is a shame that money has devided the hobbies to the extent it has but I see a future for 'Modrods' (MODified MODern rod) in the same way as Waveman was talking about the use of the term 'Street Rods' for 70's cars. What we are seeing at the moment represents only a snapshot in time, and I'll bet in 50 years time rodders have totally different perspectives of the different types of rod, and are using different terms to describe them.
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Last Edit: Aug 1, 2010 17:37:05 GMT by arrocuda
'71 Arrocuda.... '71 Sunbeam Rapier Turbo (The Grim Rapier).... '63 Hymek D7076..... Audi GT5S
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mrbhp426
Part of things
It don't handle, but it sure as hell goes!
Posts: 398
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I was looking through pics from the Supernats and the majority of UK rods now seem to be done in a nostalgia style. When I was younger people were still building rods as a cheap way to go fast (most features seemed to mention "will blow a cossie's doors off etc"). It seems to me that the hot rod scene has given up trying to move forward/compete with the faster production/modified retro/modern scene and has gone back 50 years to avoid the embarassment of not being quick enough? I mean I could get the low flyers stuff, they were just mega cheap fun cars, but people are now spunking huge amounts of cash to build a car that is basically not very good (dynamically) This isn't a dig btw just an observation. Matt Ive noticed this, people are going for the period look rather than performance but i don't think its down to been shown up by faster modern cars. Alot of them like to live the whole 50's life style, and period cars are one of the main things to them! Alot of them are still quick though! it is a shame the whole drag race scene has turned into a big money game though, which it has! I'm sure thats killing off the whole cheap fun part of it all. The a40 me and my dad did (30 pound rover v8 engine off ebay!) was all about doing it cheap just like they did back then, and its the most fun ever on the strip got a 14.0 from it and it cost about a grand to build, it would be cool if people started doing it as a cheap way of going fast again!
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'Having Fun With Cars' Isn't that what it's all about? We all need to lose the politics surrounding our hobby, It's getting tiresome. We have... on here, at least we had for many years.. but people keep on wanting to re-introduce 'scene politics' it is like their safety blanket ... it evidences itself by people doing unbelievably stupid things like censoring the word Retro...!?
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Rob M
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,915
Club RR Member Number: 41
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Isn't that what it's all about? We all need to lose the politics surrounding our hobby, It's getting tiresome. We have... on here, at least we had for many years.. but people keep on wanting to re-introduce 'scene politics' it is like their safety blanket ... it evidences itself by people doing unbelievably stupid things like censoring the word Retro...!? And therein is the whole key to everything that is car modifying. You Sir are one of the most astute and incisive people in this wonderful hobby. You have taken a descriptive, juicy and dare i say, nostalgic bone and rebranded it, creating a "scene" just in the same way that "Hot rod" became a "scene" and every other niche within the business (because, lets not be in any doubt, all "scenes" are business ) became a scene. Censoring the word Retro would do no harm at all, a significant amount of human and vehicular traffic that ebbs and flows out of this forum is as far removed from "Retro" as an elephant is to a horse. When a group of people sat down in the late 70s to brainstorm the name of their new modified car publication, they came up with THE most appropriate of titles: Street Machine. It encompassed everything, no age limit, styling limit, no limits!! It catered for everybody and, as far as my old brain can remember, no mention of a "scene" to describe a style or a way of thinking. You did what you did and that was it. Paulatxntric, i understand implicitly where you are coming from. Your hobby, way of doing things hasnt changed and nobody within it wants to change. Thats fine, the secret of the hobby will die with its last members just as Esperanto died when the last speakers shuffled from the mortal coil. Scene politics? Thats a given when people pigeon hole their particular take on modfying and what they modify. The problem is scenes are constantly created because people CALL them scenes!! Its just modifying, a beautiful hobby that should be enjoyed. Should it REALLY be that difficult to grasp? PS: I'm not trying to be contentious, just logical, if thats possible
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We have... on here, at least we had for many years.. but people keep on wanting to re-introduce 'scene politics' it is like their safety blanket ... it evidences itself by people doing unbelievably stupid things like censoring the word Retro...!? Because in it's current guise it's just an ironic blanket term to cover just about anything over 15 years old (or thereabouts). Just because it's old doesn't automatically make it good. I don't consider myself a person who is dictated by so-called 'scene politics'. A 'scene' is just another word for 'clique', and I've seen too, too much of the clique mentality in my 25+ years of reading mags, going to shows and building cars. I remember a time when there were few boundaries between different so-called 'categories', now the classic/modified car landscape is so fragmented, people don't bother to look further than their own bonnet, figuratively speaking. Some erudite, insightful stuff +1 on your comments.
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Last Edit: Aug 1, 2010 19:25:32 GMT by e21meister
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Thanks - that was what I hoped to hear! I shall continue my evil thoughts regarding a rodded Riley RM ;D This piqued my interest. Riley are so underpowered they *need* to be rodded, or led sledded, or customised in some awesome way. If ever I have the funds, a Riley RME is top of my wishlist... along with the V12 I'd want to squeeze into it. Only the 1 1/2 RMs (A & E) are underpowered, due to the extra weight compared to the pre war 1 1/2 (12/4)* - the 2 1/2 RMs (B, C, D, F & H) were certainly not underpowered, and were fast cars in their day. *The 12/4 4 seater tourer that my father had in the early '90s would crack the ton on the motorway, and also did rather well at TLGPs in south London. Not bad for a 1937 car ;D
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I was at the super nats in what I think is the type of car you are talking about in the opening post. Modern turbo unit and running gear 30's style body Completely fabricated at home by me Passed BIVA test Used as a daily Driven like I stole it. All based on a Nissan 200SX Build up here if you are interested www.rodsnsods.co.uk/forum/garage/single-doner-coupe-943
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stealthstylz
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 14,926
Club RR Member Number: 174
Member is Online
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Yes that's what i'm on about. Funnily enough my brother gave me the latest Custom Car and most of the feature cars seem to be the sort of thing I was talking about (designed to handle and ride nicely aswell as go fast in a straight line). Thought that style of car was nearly dead over here never really saw pics of many in show reports.
Glad this has gone down (mainly) the way I wanted it to, can't beat a bit of debate.
Matt
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B-8-D
Posted a lot
down to one car!!
Posts: 4,038
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nuh hot rodding aint dead....
tbh most assume hot rodding is all about nastalgia rods but i would say that the ethos of hotrodding is just about buying an old car you can afford and making it go faster by taking off bits that are not needed to make it lighter and adding a newer more powerfull engine.. and relevent bits to otherwise upgrade it suspension/chassis wise to handle the more power...
bassically what we are all doing...
the pre '49 hotrod thing is just one very small part of it.. and there is not much new that can be done within the constraints of the unwritten laws that support that part of hotrodding...
even then there are a million ways one can make a rod new and unique buy how much the body maybe channeled, chopped sectioned, zed'ed chassis, painted..
a rod can look the same as all the rest to the untrained eye but there can be many new and exciting mods that push the current bounderys of rods without being immediately apparent...
i love ALL MODIFIED OLD CARS and really try not to put them in little boxes tbh... the categorys are there as a guideline but as pople look for new "crossover styles" the lines become more blurred exactly like music has become...
loads of cool cars out there if you look about..
si
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Brian Damaged
West Midlands
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 9,555
Club RR Member Number: 33
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I followed that build on R&S, EPIC motor, I love it.
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Stu_B
Posted a lot
Investing in rust!
Posts: 1,266
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Rodbuilder, I already linked to your build thread a few pages ago
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Guily of not reading all the posts
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