remmoc
Part of things
Posts: 926
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Jan 20, 2018 19:23:21 GMT
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How well does the plate slide on the input shaft splines? I've put a small amount of grease between the two before to make sure it operated smoothly. The thrust bearing spring being off I've found causes an annoying rattle but doesn't change how the clutch operates. Probably worth putting the pressure plate on a sheet of glass to check if it is 100% flat. Could always try a flat edge on the flywheel as well. Only other thought is how old is the clutch plate? It looks good but wonder if it has had a storage issue of some form. Apologies if I've missed you doing any of those already or teaching grandmother to suck eggs! Another slightly odd thought - are the gearbox mounts good? Wonder if them going could cause a similar effect? Ed Hi , it slides well on the input shaft but the splines on the shaft are very worn , the plan is to fit a new input shaft to the box , change the friction plate yet again if theres any bad high spots and also fit a flywheel ive had refaced , box mounts are new il try your sheet of glass idea - someone said use talc to see where it touches - or not as the case may be  |
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Last Edit: Jan 20, 2018 19:24:03 GMT by remmoc
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Just read the whole thing. Good journey you two have been on. Bery interested to see whats causing the judder. Keep us posted!
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Mk2 Golf 16V resto
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remmoc
Part of things
Posts: 926
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Jan 21, 2018 18:21:05 GMT
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Just read the whole thing. Good journey you two have been on. Bery interested to see whats causing the judder. Keep us posted! Thanks for reading , Box is going away in a few weeks for the input shaft change , need to check the flywheel with a dial gauge for run out as well . It wont be on the road for at least three weeks but stuff is happening |
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remmoc
Part of things
Posts: 926
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Jan 24, 2018 17:53:02 GMT
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Massive thanks to a good friend for sending me the flywheel . On another friends advise I slightly countersunk the bolt holes on it both sides and on the inner side of the dowel peg one , Uber cleaned the crank face and both sides of the flywheel mounting surfaces . Run out is almost non existent - maybe 1/2 thou if that Whatever is causing any future clutch judder it wont be this , Crank end float is 1/4 thou if that .    |
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Jan 24, 2018 18:29:08 GMT
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Having a look at the pictures of you clutch plate (never having worked on an Imp but other Rootes cars) Should there not be spring in the centre section of the plate connected to the drive boss rather than it just being solid, to take up any judder?
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remmoc
Part of things
Posts: 926
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Jan 24, 2018 18:34:41 GMT
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Having a look at the pictures of you clutch plate (never having worked on an Imp but other Rootes cars) Should there not be spring in the centre section of the plate connected to the drive boss rather than it just being solid, to take up any judder? No spring on any Imp ones , they are always solid like this one for some reason |
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Jan 24, 2018 18:44:32 GMT
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Ok are there two thicknesses of release bearing as if you fitted a thick one that would cause a very slight pressure on the plate and cause it to judder?
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remmoc
Part of things
Posts: 926
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Jan 24, 2018 19:06:53 GMT
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Ok are there two thicknesses of release bearing as if you fitted a thick one that would cause a very slight pressure on the plate and cause it to judder? its a carbon effort , there are various ones that are wrong but i have a NOS genuine one here to go in so hopefully this will be OK . Thanks for your interest BTW - Moral support does help |
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Jan 24, 2018 19:19:45 GMT
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An NOS one sounds like a good plan.
Looks from your pictures that the fly wheel could do with a skim, looks very uneven?
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remmoc
Part of things
Posts: 926
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Jan 24, 2018 19:40:45 GMT
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An NOS one sounds like a good plan. Looks from your pictures that the fly wheel could do with a skim, looks very uneven? they are just slight surface marks , i went over lots of places with the dial gauge and its all within 1/2 thou , i will clean it up though before it all goes back together - it came from a car that drove well with no clutch issues so I'm confident its OK , Wall fell on the car it came from and wrote it off  |
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Jan 24, 2018 19:46:58 GMT
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An NOS one sounds like a good plan. Looks from your pictures that the fly wheel could do with a skim, looks very uneven? they are just slight surface marks , i went over lots of places with the dial gauge and its all within 1/2 thou , i will clean it up though before it all goes back together - it came from a car that drove well with no clutch issues so I'm confident its OK , Wall fell on the car it came from and wrote it off OOPPS |
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raumer
Part of things
Posts: 137 
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There is normally a spring in the centre of the clutch to help take up shock loads when the clutch is engaged. In an Imp it is not necessary as there are rubber doughnuts between the gearbox and the driveshafts. These take up the shock loads. A friend was racing an imp engine davrian which had sold joints instead of doughnuts. He kept breaking things - engine or gearbox until I convinced him to put doughnuts back on. After that no issues, just replace the doughnuts at the end of each season.
Ed
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Mine: 1938 Scammell Pioneer R100, 1944 Scammell Pioneer SV2/S, 1959 Kraz 255b tractor unit, 1960 Unipower Industrial ballast tractor, 1960 88 Landrover Series 2 SWB, 1983 110 Landrover CSW
Look after:
1935 Scammell Rigid 6, 1951 Scammell Scarab, 1961 Landrover Prototype, 1985 Landrover 110
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jamesd1972
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,861
Club RR Member Number: 40
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What about immoral support ?
Right old faff, hope all this works out ok for you.
(Could always swap to minis....)
James
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Phil H
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,448
Club RR Member Number: 133
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Looking at the friction plate, it looks like it's been "over-riveted", pulling the material too much so you have a wavy plate? There's a low spot by every rivet head (but not the tails). I'd say it's a duff plate. You can get some slight difference in the plate thickness but not to that extent.
The marks on the (old) flywheel are likely effect, not cause.
From experience, poor/tired/worn mountings just amplify the judder rather than be the cause. Downside is there's usually some judder (especially if the splines on the gearbox are worn), just normally not enough to make any perceptible difference.
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v8ian
Posted a lot
Posts: 3,782
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One thing, that in my experience with clutches is the friction plate without radial spring damping are prone to juddering, the flexi plates do have a habit of breaking under the friction material, It could be worth trying to track down a sprung type, perhaps try Helix, thay make custom clutches for not much money, or as an afterthought, you did have the friction plate in the right way round???
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Atmo V8 Power . No slicks , No gas + No bits missing . Doing it in style.
Austin A35van, very different------- but still doing it in style, going to be a funmoble
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remmoc
Part of things
Posts: 926
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Jan 25, 2018 17:43:55 GMT
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One thing, that in my experience with clutches is the friction plate without radial spring damping are prone to juddering, the flexi plates do have a habit of breaking under the friction material, It could be worth trying to track down a sprung type, perhaps try Helix, thay make custom clutches for not much money, or as an afterthought, you did have the friction plate in the right way round??? Ive now got a helix clutch on its way - no springs in the centre as theres no room but these have been tried and tested and work well - given the cost i hope so , if you fit the plate the wrong way around on these the clutch doesnt work at all - |
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remmoc
Part of things
Posts: 926
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Jan 25, 2018 17:47:30 GMT
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Looking at the friction plate, it looks like it's been "over-riveted", pulling the material too much so you have a wavy plate? There's a low spot by every rivet head (but not the tails). I'd say it's a duff plate. You can get some slight difference in the plate thickness but not to that extent. The marks on the (old) flywheel are likely effect, not cause. From experience, poor/tired/worn mountings just amplify the judder rather than be the cause. Downside is there's usually some judder (especially if the splines on the gearbox are worn), just normally not enough to make any perceptible difference. Thanks for your reply and advise . Got a new plate coming from Helix - expensive but worth it . I think your correct on the over rivet part - its NOS so 30 years old at least |
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remmoc
Part of things
Posts: 926
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Jan 28, 2018 12:52:10 GMT
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Well a tiny bit of progress on this heaps ongoing saga of judder and fail . Ive fitted the clutch friction plate and cover . Ive fitted a new Helix clutch and a NOS Laycock cover , tapped out the flywheel clutch cover threads , cleaned everything with brake and clutch cleaner probably 4 times and put it altogether. Run out on the cover centre that contacts with the thrust bearing is 19 thou - no idea if thats good , bad or if it matters .     |
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Well a tiny bit of progress on this heaps ongoing saga of judder and fail . Ive fitted the clutch friction plate and cover . Ive fitted a new Helix clutch and a NOS Laycock cover , tapped out the flywheel clutch cover threads , cleaned everything with brake and clutch cleaner probably 4 times and put it altogether. Run out on the cover centre that contacts with the thrust bearing is 19 thou - no idea if thats good , bad or if it matters . Such a rare and cool wee car. I've still to see on in the metal so to speak. Thanks for sharing |
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Jan 29, 2018 10:06:56 GMT
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If when it's all back together you still find you have judder when you get it apart again get the fly wheel surface ground at an engineering company as that's one nasty finish on that fly wheel.
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