Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,696
Club RR Member Number: 39
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Yesterday I finally managed to sit down with my list of wiring colours and gauges and enter them all into an online suppliers website. After inspecting the shopping cart at the end of the entry process I had amassed 97 items with a total value of 239 of my hard earned credit tokens. As much of it will be split reasonably evenly between 6 projects £40 a car sounds for more palatable.
I'm off to Itchy's place this afternoon after a flu jab, so if I remember the camera, and to use it, there may be something to report later on G32 works.
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Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,696
Club RR Member Number: 39
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It seems like an age of doing nothing ago that a box weighing rather a lot arrived containing many metres of colourful electrical conductors. It sat for quite a while and the only activity around it was our daft Cocker Spaniel Bella having fun taking the paper packing material out of it and shredding it in as many rooms as she could.
I did find sufficient motivation enough to make up two cables and add them to the dash. I then flipped it over and found the motivation meter was reading zero. Zero or broken - still not sure which.
Today with it warm and dry and the motivation meter getting some solar charge into it I cleared out all of the junk that had accumulated under the car - its up on stands - so that I could get the car clear enough for me to get started on it. Strange thing is that I cannot recall why I put it up on stands .... After I finish this post I will have to read back in this thread and see if I can find out.
I need to get this thing on the road for some summer evening runs out - something to aspire to.
Trouble is with trawling through 50's and 60's Doo Wop songs is that you cannot help coming across classics like this !
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Having just spent some time catching up, I can help you out with that! As the garage is rather cramped at the moment the first job was to get the car up in the air just enough to be able to create some under car storage - with that done I could actually move and empty the Gemini of an awful lot of accumulated "stuff" Being up in the air will also allow me access to remove my nice new fresh built 3.54 Diff so I can fit one of my Quaife ATB's Seems like you have a perpetual storage problem
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Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,696
Club RR Member Number: 39
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Feb 22, 2022 23:15:55 GMT
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Seems like you have a perpetual storage problem I am working on that - Having been handily reminded why I stuck it up in the air - which seems perfectly sensible - do I rip the diff out of it... The original idea was that I would remove the diff and then scamper down to my mates place and together we would do a quick swap over and rebuild. However, my diff expert mate is recovering from heart surgery and standing out in a cold garage rebuilding a diff is certainly not on the doctors list of things he should be doing. So if the diff comes out it's a self rebuild jobbie or its out for months. As the car is not going anywhere - the diff would just be yet another English diff pigs head I will need to find storage for so it may as well stay under the car in the axle casing rather than in a another box! So what to do - very little right now whilst its an alphabetical procession of roof rattlers outside. Until those bloody things sod off its just plotting and planning. And that's really not good. Plan - One of the originals (there have been many) was to get on with the wiring and the like and get it a position to be driven and then stored away from home so I can get on with the Strato's - Being stored in a drivable condition it could still be used on the odd occasion. As the plan list for this this car is extending somewhat the better route may be to just trailer it up the barn as is and do the work there. That way I can dig into the Strato's unhindered. The new plan on the Gemini now extends to fitting 40's to it - or 45's depending on a possible the purchase of another engine. I know someone with a full steel 1400 screamer race engine. Now the issue with this idea is that with the DCOE's DHLA's and associated manifolds is that the tandem master on the Escort pedal box stick out a bit far and gets in the way. This is also compounded by the fact that I have two manifolds a short one for the 45's and a mid length one for the 40's - Both of which will require the inner engine bay structure next to the carbs to be modified. So, a simple change of carbs needs a new pedal box and bodywork mods - the pedal box being semi built into the chassis adds to the complication as the bit of the chassis its built into is tucked up under the a dash a foot from the scuttle at the front and a foot from the dash. The structure of the car - and taking into account a few other jobs that are required to be done - means that the best route to complete the work is to remove the body ! The body then being off means that whilst the chassis is fully exposed a roll over bar may as well get made and fitted, the tank should get swapped out for an alloy one, we have to run new fuel lines anyway. As the pedal box is being removed and sorted its the ideal opportunity to move the steering column as it can be positioned better in the cockpit and also made to miss the bias pedal box and pedals that I will need to design and build. When I move the column I may as well reposition the steering rack centrally as that really bugs me . And whilst I am at it why not chop all the suspension mounts off and reduce the wheelbase 1 - 1.5" How difficult could it be to fit some new carbs ..... best just trailer it up the barn stick it under a cover and forget about it.
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Sounds like an awful lot of work just to swap a diff over?
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16grit
Part of things
Posts: 213
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So roll this one in the shed and spend more time on the Stratos build or...
1, xflow IDF manifold, this would allow you to use carbs or sidedraft-spaced/shaped bodies or individual throttle bodies, putting them into a vertical position . The Sherryberg Cheap IDF copies are currently less than 90 quid each, Yamaha or Kawasaki individual throttle bodies about the same second hand..Can't see from the pics what clearance you have vertically for all four. Example currently on ebay (with overly-tall throttle bodies not Sherryberg IDFs) (Edit think I have just recognised the logo on that manifold as TJ for Tecalmit Jackson, so ironically that could be an early injection manifold, "period correct, innit....")
2, If space is too limited for that, what about a Weber retroject injector body, that uses the same spacings - ignoring the other bits needed for an injection system dotted around the car, this unit would slip straight in and might offer a little injectin flexibility to a higher-tuned xflow www.webcon.co.uk/products/15299-retroject-3838-throttle-body/ Thats about the same cost as a pair used old 45s, but you would need a high pressure pump, swirl pot, wideband and a speeduino....
or 3..
Lynx type single sidedraft manifold with a weber or dellorto 40 0r 45 or whatever hung off it, in 3rd position here coz for many they seem harder to make work than some other options....(and the only real reason they SO became popular back in the day was as a quick fix to the banning of twin sidedrafts in road rallying in the mid-80s rather than any performance quality)...
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Last Edit: Feb 23, 2022 5:55:44 GMT by 16grit
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Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,696
Club RR Member Number: 39
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varelse - Yep... it grows exponentially from the point of being put on axle stands for storage. 16grit - I do have 3 Italian 40 IDF's from where I replaced the ones on the Strat with Spanish 44's - I also have a pair of 40mm Webcon DCOE IDF throttle bodies that would also do the task - However, - nail on the head - clearance - The current DGAV manifold is quite low line - unlike the up-swept IDF manifold that would be at the bonnet line before fitting the Carb/TB's on to it + filters. The reason for side-drafts is that I want to avoid stuff sticking through the bonnet as is required by the current DGAV when you put any sort of filter on it. There is already a hump in the bonnet that does not adequately align with the carb and although a reasonable size it only clears the present carb when there is no air filter on it. The Lynx single manifolds are still quite expensive for what they are ( as you say) due being the best thing available to meet a two choke rule in some rally classes. Unfortunately a single would not shift enough air to let the 1400 breath. It would offer a useful stopgap solution to a bonnet fitment issue and offer a small gain in performance but its a pricey compromise if I can find one. Besides I think there is a clear law that states that every Crossflow must have twin side-drafts. The weber downdraft TB thing is a lot of money to be able to bolt something to a curse word restrictive manifold and still have it poke through the bonnet - and any swirl pot stuff would need to be integrated into the tank really and that's a body off job. If going EFI I have the TB's and an OMEX spare. I think the best plan is to just stuff it up the barn out of sight.
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Last Edit: Feb 23, 2022 12:52:07 GMT by Darkspeed
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Feb 23, 2022 14:07:43 GMT
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From back in the day I seem to remember those Lynx manifolds weren't very good. The ones you really want to avoid are the ones which join ports 1&2 and 3&4. The firing order doesn't work very well with those. If you're going to get one, make sure it's a crossover one, i.e. ports 1&4 share one carb barrel and ports 2&3 share the other. That said about the Lynx manifold, I can tell you first hand that the VW Derrington one with the slight swan neck shape works VERY well. It's an excellent compromise over twin side-draughts. You avoid almost all the issues relating to twin side-draughts on a crossflow (access to distributor and engine mount, clearance on brake and clutch master cylinders, things shaking loose, going out of tune, no space for trumpets etc) with only a small hit to the top end.
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Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,696
Club RR Member Number: 39
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Mar 13, 2022 10:05:51 GMT
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As this post is about working in the garage and the Gemini is in the garage it follows that it should be in the Gemini thread. Things had not improved space wise and swinging a mouse was getting difficult never mind the cat. As it was a dry, and early on sunny, day I decided that some action was needed to redress the space issue. The biggest consumer of square feet that is not making a positive contribution to progress is the big red compressor. It needs to be rehomed. The only place for it is the shed outside the garage. Hopefully the worst of the winter storms and weather are behind us. Expect 6 foot snow drifts in Shropshire in the coming weeks...... The shed floor had composted itself many years ago when the roof gave up for a season but as it was just storing junk when I replaced the roof I did not bother about the floor, just put some more boards over it! It did not take much to scrape it up and stick it in the bin. After ripping up a load of damp particle board it all looked a lot more suitable for compressor short term storage. Man handled big red out there and covered it in junk Shed still needs some love and will get a new floor in the summer. With that done I had space to get to all the steel I had accumulated during the collection of the G15's - That was wrapped up ready to get loaded and driven up the barn. With Big red moved the G27 V8 and one of the G15 998's were moved into its place !!! The underside of the Gemini was cleared but during all this this shuffling about has now started to accumulate parts again. Those will very shortly turn up on the G15 thread. The upshot of all this I have access to the inside of the Gemini - To celebrate this success I trimmed the end of bit of alloy side panel with my new shears I got for Xmas. As it has now stopped tipping it down outside I am off to load the car and head up the barn.
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Last Edit: Mar 23, 2022 23:04:45 GMT by Darkspeed
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Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,696
Club RR Member Number: 39
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Mar 23, 2022 23:03:47 GMT
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Getting there... Almost clear... Also making a list on the whiteboard of the jobs that need to be done and the parts that need to be paid for. The Starter motor - Crank pulley and Battery are the main big ticket items that will to be paid for as well some Aeroquip hoses. Also put a new front to back brake line on the list as the original copper item is just..... Nope. No getting away from Jazz today.
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Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,696
Club RR Member Number: 39
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It landed - Requiring more trips up the barn with stuff. Started to strip out the interior as with all these projects the requirement is to go back until we we can start to go forward Just seems to have been a case of going backwards since I bought it. I will need to address this pedal spacing Definitely needs 40's Removed the expanding foam firewall seal and the very oversized wiper motor bracket I have an urge to weigh a wheel - should have done it when the car was in the air - Doh!
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Last Edit: Mar 29, 2022 9:45:55 GMT by Darkspeed
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Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,696
Club RR Member Number: 39
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Mar 29, 2022 11:16:42 GMT
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Weighed the wheels I wanted to compare the Ford steel 5.0J 13 wheel with the 165/13 Uniroyal to the Rocket Racing 5.5J 13 alloy wheel and 185/60/13 Toyo Steel = 14.1 Kg Alloy = 12.2 Kg 1.9 kg x 4 = 7.6 kg saved -Probably 8Kg as the Uniroyals are part worn. - I nice reduction in unsprung weight. The bracket for the wiper motor weighs 0.450Kg So far I have removed Fog light Reverse lamp Passenger wing mirror 20mm MDF boot flooring and wooded support frame Interior boarding matting carpeting etc Copper/steel radiator Steel wheels Brake disc shields Perforated mesh steel grille large steel seat belt brackets Heater complete with trunking vents and vent trims Full size battery Large steel oval silencer Small bits of unnecessary glassfibre Escort steering lock and ignition key assembly Escort steering column bracket and Gemini support brackets Windscreen seal supports Wiper motor bracket Padded MDF dash and Escort clock assembly The car was weighed during SVA at 642Kg - I expect now that I have managed to get under the 600Kg target - For the future - it will be alloy hubs and brake calipers - Lightweight alternator, Starter motor. As mentioned before the engine was dyno'd at 102BHP@6000 and I expect there was a little more to be had with the Kent 234 Cam which is good to 7500 - I would think that with the 40's it may be able to stretch to 110BHP. 110/0.6 = 183BHP/ton 200 would be a nice figure for this car and with some head work it could show 125 which would net 208BHP ton and lose another 10KG from the brakes hubs etc. 211BHP/Ton which would do very nicely. The brake master cylinder has also caught my attention whilst looking at the pedal box and its arrangement - It looks pretty long. A dual cylinder bias set up would be preferable but I am also wondering if I can find a shorter version that will allow the 40's and manifold to squeeze in. I am pretty sure that the Fury had a much shorter tandem from a Fiesta - may still have it the shed ......
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Last Edit: Mar 29, 2022 12:47:53 GMT by Darkspeed
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mylittletony
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,342
Club RR Member Number: 84
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Mar 29, 2022 13:58:50 GMT
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Ahhhh I love this car... Great to see some motivational progress!! Also slightly sad, a part of me was hoping you were going to stash it, get annoyed and then I could dive in with an offer
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Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,696
Club RR Member Number: 39
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Mar 29, 2022 14:51:41 GMT
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Ahhhh I love this car... Great to see some motivational progress!! Also slightly sad, a part of me was hoping you were going to stash it, get annoyed and then I could dive in with an offer I do wonder why you keep torturing yourself by visiting this thread - I am afraid that even if stashed, both my lad and my daughters fiancé have designs on it. The future Son-in-law asking me to keep an eye out for one for him to have alongside his G15 I had already sourced. The MC from the Fury turned out to be longer and 90 degree different mounting ! - close inspection and a bit of interwebbing on the one in the car shows it to be about the shortest one available. Decided to have a play anyway. The existing manifold was not on particularly tightly so came off very easily - the centre bolt being held on by on thread - the bolt being 1/4" too short. Looking at the state of the gasket and the manifold face I think it was probably weeping First off I tried the "long" manifold - Pretty tight for space with a DHLA 40 No problem with a throttle body Then I tried the short manifold No problem - and even room for a short KN filter - may even be room for the next size up - must remember to drop these back with bizzo And miles of room with the TB - Room for a plenum to an intercooler should a turbo option be considered in the future! It will not be doing much over 100BHP with those ports and by the look of that valve the head needs to come off. Hmmmmmm.
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mylittletony
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,342
Club RR Member Number: 84
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Mar 29, 2022 15:07:34 GMT
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I do wonder why you keep torturing yourself by visiting this thread It's no torture seeing it develop! Could you fabricate a forward slanted manifold, or would that clash with the distributor? Those TBs look to save you enough to be very useful
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Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,696
Club RR Member Number: 39
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Mar 29, 2022 17:41:52 GMT
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mylittletony
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,342
Club RR Member Number: 84
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Mar 30, 2022 14:50:43 GMT
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Blimey, that definitely needed some attention, can't believe it ran so well!
Hopefully the crack turns out to be inconsequential...
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bricol
Part of things
Posts: 285
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Mar 30, 2022 16:04:50 GMT
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I seem to recall an angled manifold for webers on a crossflow - I thought it was for a Caterham, but a google reveals nothing. I did turn up this: On a work PC, which fails to go to their website - so no idea if they, or it, are available
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Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,696
Club RR Member Number: 39
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Mar 30, 2022 19:33:18 GMT
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I seem to recall an angled manifold for webers on a crossflow - I thought it was for a Caterham, but a google reveals nothing. I did turn up this: ..... On a work PC, which fails to go to their website - so no idea if they, or it, are available Looking at the bolt pattern that's for a Pinto Also it has all moved on a fair bit to make the search for any options to fit around the existing M/C quite unnecessary. See how quickly I can progress this before I need to dump it up the barn and forget about it. MLT
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Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,696
Club RR Member Number: 39
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Mar 30, 2022 21:58:27 GMT
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The issue with the pedals and the positioning in the footwell is that the M/C is offset to the centre of the car too much - See image above - now compare that to the position in Gem 3 - offset in the opposite direction. Mission creep now well and truly set in .... what to do what to do.....
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