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Jun 28, 2006 14:56:51 GMT
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Just so you know, my comments are definately not a dig. To each their own, and all that.
BB
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Yesterday at 7:54, pogweasel wrote:
Nothing wrong with creature comforts. If I want masochism, I'll just go and slam my knackers in the fridge door for a bit.
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Jun 28, 2006 15:00:44 GMT
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Its not a fake or a fraud if you don't try and pass it off as one, if you build a 356 rep and tell anyone whose interested that it is indeed a rep that you have built, than surely it is just an improved beetle? No-one's being misled or disappointed.
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1972 Fiat 130 1985 Talbot Alpine 1974 Lancia Beta Saloon 1975 + 1986 Mazda 929 Koop + Wagon 1982 Fiat Argenta 2.0 iniezione elettronica 1977 Toyota Carina TA14 BEST CAR EVER!!!!!!!! 1979 Datsun B310 Sunny 4-dr 1984 Audi 200 Quattro Turbo 1983 Honda Accord 1.6 DX GONE1989 Alfa 75 2.0 TS Mr T says: TREAT YO MOTHER RIGHT! |
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Jun 28, 2006 15:00:47 GMT
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Just so you know, my comments are definately not a dig. To each their own, and all that. Of course not,... we're all adults here just having a discussion. This is what the internet is for  |
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Jun 28, 2006 15:26:36 GMT
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But I maintain a 356 replica is still a Beetle that looks like a Porsche ... it is not a Porsche and never will be ... If someone is happy spending all that time and effort to get something that isn't the real thing that is great for them, but for me it seems ultimately hollow... to me a gorgeous car is a gorgeous car - i don't give a fcuk about badges, it sounds to me that thats whats imporant to you? and as Mr B said, its never been suggested that these people try and claim their replica is an original. btw - you can only claim a replica 356 being a beetle if its built on a beetle floorpan  |
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Jun 28, 2006 15:29:17 GMT
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to me a gorgeous car is a gorgeous car - i don't give a fcuk about badges, it sounds to me that thats whats imporant to you? I care about 2 things,.. class and style,.. Replicas have style without class  Tell me this,.. every time you see a 356, Cobra or GT40 (to pick the obvious ones) do you immediatly wonder if its an original or a replica? |
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Jun 28, 2006 15:36:25 GMT
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Tell me this,.. every time you see a 356, Cobra or GT40 (to pick the obvious ones) do you immediatly wonder if its an original or a replica? the thought comes into my mind, but its far from immediate. Usually i'll look at a car and if its cool i'll comment. If the camera is handy i'll photograph it. Sometimes then i wonder if its real or not. It never bothers me enough to ask those who might know, and certainly not the owner. I photo'd a fair few GT40s when in le mans last week. I took photos of the ones i liked. I have no idea which ones were real and which were fakes. If somethings nice, and i like it, thats all that matters to me. Getting worried about badges and 'class' is mightily pretentious imho, and not something i care about. |
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Jun 28, 2006 15:50:48 GMT
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If somethings nice, and i like it, thats all that matters to me. Getting worried about badges and 'class' is mightily pretentious imho, and not something i care about. Ahhh but I am mighty pretentious when it comes to replicas... I was raised on a diet of genuine super cars at Brands Hatch and the AMOC meetings. As a side note as I've mentioned I'm aware my views can be percieved as rather irrational. I also reserve the right to build a replica in the future ... but what I really want to say is despite my irrational views there has been so far a fairly well meaning discussion going on, having just been reading the thread on VZi about Dez' beam on his very low bug, I'm rather glad this place exists. |
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Jun 28, 2006 16:23:36 GMT
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Tell me this,.. every time you see a 356, Cobra or GT40 (to pick the obvious ones) do you immediatly wonder if its an original or a replica? Thats the very first thing that comes into my head in fact; but i don't think 'oh gawd I hope its not a replica'. In fact in many cases I am not skilled enough to tell so it doesn't matter. But even if I then spend an hour inspecting it and trying to decide if it is or isnt a replica, if i decide it is one, to me its no less interesting a vehicle. |
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1972 Fiat 130 1985 Talbot Alpine 1974 Lancia Beta Saloon 1975 + 1986 Mazda 929 Koop + Wagon 1982 Fiat Argenta 2.0 iniezione elettronica 1977 Toyota Carina TA14 BEST CAR EVER!!!!!!!! 1979 Datsun B310 Sunny 4-dr 1984 Audi 200 Quattro Turbo 1983 Honda Accord 1.6 DX GONE1989 Alfa 75 2.0 TS Mr T says: TREAT YO MOTHER RIGHT! |
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Jun 28, 2006 16:25:58 GMT
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I'm all in favour of decent quality reps. Then you can build into them anything you would like to change from the real deal. Lets face it, if you turn up anywhere in a Cobra these days most people will asume its a rep anyway! This is my other point,.. Replicas devalue the original, not in financial terms, but in cultural terms. In many ways a GT40 or Cobra replica cheapens the originals ones out there. I disagree - surely immitation is the highest form of flattery? I'm familiar with the shapes of these gorgous cars because I see many replicas around of cars like the GT40 & Shelby Cobra, which raises mine & the publics awareness of these cars & the fame of the originals. So when you are confronted with a car which is actually the real McCoy it makes it all the more special. When I go to Goodwood & see all the 'original' race & road cars it is the familiar shapes - which get replicated which draws the crowds. On the whole subject of replica cars I can see where Hotwire is coming from but I think each replica car should be taken on its own merits - for example these MR2 based Ferrari 355 reps are tacky in the extreme since the sole reason for adding the looky-likey body kit is for external impact/posing only - its an image thing - only its fake. For cars like Westfield's D type replica its much more about the driving experience - conjoring up the thrills of motoring from a bygone era. TBH; I admire anyone who aspires and dreams to drive any particular car - obviously such a car is normally exotic, rare and expensive. For most of us mere mortals - the only way the get behind the wheel of something which looks & gives a similar driving experience of our dream car - the only option is the build/buy a replica. I mean even if I had a few million in the bank - it would still take me a while to find a decent Ferrari 250 GTO for sale It would seem that cars which 'work' as replicas are those which employed kit-car esque manufacturing techniques in the first place - a Bugatti Veyron replica is never gonna cut the mustard  Edit; I must admit this thread is very interesting - nice that we can air our personnal views in a dignified and adult manner |
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Last Edit: Jun 28, 2006 16:32:10 GMT by DerbyDan
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Jun 28, 2006 16:33:57 GMT
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1972 Fiat 130 1985 Talbot Alpine 1974 Lancia Beta Saloon 1975 + 1986 Mazda 929 Koop + Wagon 1982 Fiat Argenta 2.0 iniezione elettronica 1977 Toyota Carina TA14 BEST CAR EVER!!!!!!!! 1979 Datsun B310 Sunny 4-dr 1984 Audi 200 Quattro Turbo 1983 Honda Accord 1.6 DX GONE1989 Alfa 75 2.0 TS Mr T says: TREAT YO MOTHER RIGHT! |
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Jun 28, 2006 16:59:59 GMT
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to me that ^ is just disgusting yuk! it also seems pretty pointless, given that it is only a 1200 Beetle (although it does have a twin cam fitted) and yet the real thing is a PROPER supercar. I quite liked what VW Dan said about each case being specific. Its quite true. So, whats the general view then of the Chesil 355 Replicas which then have all the badges saying PORSCHE ?  |
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Nathan
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 5,649
Club RR Member Number: 1
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Jun 28, 2006 17:12:02 GMT
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I freaking love the chesil, only on the grounds that unless I get a serious cash injection I wont own the real thing. Plus my boss built one for his daughter |
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Jun 28, 2006 18:46:49 GMT
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agreed, i think chesils are extremely good kits. they are probably who i would go to if i build one.
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Jun 28, 2006 18:48:07 GMT
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i've been to the factory I do quite like them, but not sure i'd want one over a Beetle... |
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Jun 28, 2006 19:11:30 GMT
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If somethings nice, and i like it, thats all that matters to me. Getting worried about badges and 'class' is mightily pretentious imho, and not something i care about. Ahhh but I am mighty pretentious when it comes to replicas... I was raised on a diet of genuine super cars at Brands Hatch and the AMOC meetings. As a side note as I've mentioned I'm aware my views can be percieved as rather irrational. I also reserve the right to build a replica in the future ... but what I really want to say is despite my irrational views there has been so far a fairly well meaning discussion going on, having just been reading the thread on VZi about Dez' beam on his very low bug, I'm rather glad this place exists. I've lurked on VZi for a long, long time and I've posted regularly on here since I first stumbled across it; I think that says it all On topic; I have no problem with a Replica if that's what you want...As long as you're not pretentious about it; your pinto-powered FakeSnake is not a Cobra. *n |
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Top grammar tips!
Bought = purchased. Brought = relocated
Lose = misplace/opposite of win. Loose = your mum
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Jun 28, 2006 21:47:12 GMT
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I have been involved with building race cars and replicas, and TBH there is not a lot of difference, and many of teh GT40 Reps are Better cars from an engineering point of view because they have had the benefit of 40 odd years of engineering advancement. A guy at my last place of work has a Ford GT (And my current place designed and makes the gearbox for them) ;D It really is a Horrible car, the proportions are all wrong and it looks like a badly done Kit car..... A GTD or Dax on the otherhand is a far far better vehicle, on the whole better finished and better specced, closer to the original and a 1/4 of the price of the new one  A freind is building a Lola T70..... now I have been out in a Real one as well and the "Replica" is the equal of the original from an engineering perspective and much much better quality. You also have a far greater chance of owning a decent replica than an Original....... I would, one day like to build a Group 4 Stratos Replica, because the chances of me ever owning a real one and (even more remote) maintaining it in use are about as good as me shacking up with Kylie On the other hand, for £20k I could build a Proper group 4 rep with a decent reliable, more powerful Alfa 32v V6 which will handle better and be faster and less fragile than the original Having run these cars proffesionally over the years for other people they are incredibly fragile and temperamental, and there is no way you ever get decent use out of them..... For me a Car is for driving and not just 2-300 miles a year at selected Historic festivals/race meets, while I have the utmost respect for Steve Perez (Vodka Kick Boss) who rallies a real Stratos in anger, I would rather be driving something that interesting day in day out than a couple of events a year...... I like both the real ones and a lot of the reps, but I have to look at it as an engineer....... my money would go on the replica and many years of fun with it over the real one and being scared to use it because of its value Good debate though ;D |
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Snoozin
Posted a lot
Toyophile
Posts: 1,557
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Jun 28, 2006 22:03:47 GMT
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I'm gonna add my couple of cents to this raging debate (and it's great to see!)
Personally I can't stomach 99% of replica's either (not counting race reps but I'll get to that). There's just something missing, I don't know what it is, but that charisma, the soul, the class, the mystique that makes the original so special in my eyes.
The workmanship, the dedication to a lot of replicas I can definitely respect - I don't so much agree about the "not deserving to own the original" (or words to that effect) comment. It's just that missing "something" about a replica.
Race reps don't count as such either IMO, it's still based on an original car so I'll leave them be, as long as the go matches the racecar looks.
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Davenger
Club Retro Rides Member
It's only metal
Posts: 7,272
Club RR Member Number: 140
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Jun 28, 2006 22:07:02 GMT
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 I like replicas. They allow people to live thier dreams, admittely it's only half living but it's better than nothing at all. Each to thier own |
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Last Edit: Jun 28, 2006 22:09:01 GMT by Davenger
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Jun 28, 2006 22:29:47 GMT
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hawwwwwwwwwwwt
who wouldnt remove thier right arm for a GT-40....even a replica *drool*
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 once again rocking with 1117cc and 4 gears! |
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Jun 28, 2006 22:55:28 GMT
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(Random almost fame check) I've stayed over at Steve Perez' brother's house |
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