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I'd rather pay road tax (as I did before the exemption came in) and be able to drive my car. This is what happens in Europe (or AFAIK at least in Belgium) . No road tax if registered as a historic vehicle and you abide by the rule of usage otherwise tax the same as any other vehicle if you want to use it as an everyday car with no restrictions. From what I remember one of the Belgian rules is limited distance (20 km ?) from registered address unless traveling to a pre arranged show etc. Any show travel must have written confirmation to stay within law. Paul H
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What I want know know is who is making these changes and when did they become boss?
seriously, I do want to know.
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1985 Bedford CF2 camper 1991 Volvo 240 Turbo
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But as per usual most (not all) people chose to ignore doing the reading of such an important subject and instead took the seemingly easier option of running around like headless chickens when news os possible regulation changes come up. Knowledge is your friend, people. I've been slowly working through all of the links here: www.the-ace.org.uk/links-to-consultations.htmlA lot to take in, but absolutely essential, in my opinion.
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Thanks. I see on your link that foreign registered historic vehicles are also exempt from the German emissions limitation zones. I don't speak German, so can't translate the further link, however am I right in thinking that a FIVA identity card is still necessary for Historic VED cars (as well as younger vehicles that classify as historic under FIVA's definition but not HM Govt's)? If the MOT does get stricter we'll just have to look after our cars better which is a good thing I think, restricted use for classics and what have you is a different matter. Agreed, on both counts. I'd rather pay road tax (as I did before the exemption came in) and be able to drive my car. This is what happens in Europe (or AFAIK at least in Belgium) . No road tax if registered as a historic vehicle and you abide by the rule of usage otherwise tax the same as any other vehicle if you want to use it as an everyday car with no restrictions. From what I remember one of the Belgian rules is limited distance (20 km ?) from registered address unless traveling to a pre arranged show etc. Any show travel must have written confirmation to stay within law. Do you know if they charge more for the pre-cat cars, or is it at the regular rate (whatever that may be, e.g. set by engine size etc)? A helpful / sensible precedent could be very useful should similar things be proposed in the UK.
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I can't see the emissions rates changing Dez but some of the new proposals ( I'm told there are over 50 proposed ) may be retrospective as in older cars also have to comply ie like when they introduced the chipped windscreen part of the test. I wouldn't really consider that issue to be retrospective, as it is just tightening up on acceptable levels of damage / degradation, rather than requiring modification from the original spec. However I take your point though. However, is there anything relating to the use of older (in particular, pre-cat) vehicles, as is seen in some German cities? Here in London, there is already more than enough infrastructure in place that could enforce restrictions on the use of older vehicles.... If you mean the systems used for the the Congestion Charge and Low Emission Zone enforcement, they go on ANPR cross referenced with what's recorded at the DVLA. If they were to be used to keep out higher emissions vehicles (or more likely to charge the registered keepers) how would they do this with pre 2001 registered PLG vehicles? Unless they just lump together and charge anything registered between 1972 and 2001, it would be impossible to police.....
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But surely if they limit the use of classic cars you just make a few small changes to the chassis/body shell, bung it through an IVA and it's then not a classic car. Matt ..and that is another reason why we worked with BIVA, always good to have a back up plan
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I'd rather pay road tax (as I did before the exemption came in) and be able to drive my car. Stealth, that works only if your classic has a hope in hell of passing a BIVA which most don't without a lot of work even if they can get new glass. I always thought that 'free' road tax was one of the worst thing sto happen to modifying. You are immediately in a special class where they give you something but can then dictate the terms and conditions.
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I wouldn't really consider that issue to be retrospective, as it is just tightening up on acceptable levels of damage / degradation, rather than requiring modification from the original spec. However I take your point though. However, is there anything relating to the use of older (in particular, pre-cat) vehicles, as is seen in some German cities? Here in London, there is already more than enough infrastructure in place that could enforce restrictions on the use of older vehicles.... If you mean the systems used for the the Congestion Charge and Low Emission Zone enforcement, they go on ANPR cross referenced with what's recorded at the DVLA. If they were to be used to keep out higher emissions vehicles (or more likely to charge the registered keepers) how would they do this with pre 2001 registered PLG vehicles? Unless they just lump together and charge anything registered between 1972 and 2001, it would be impossible to police..... You have to notify DVLA on LPG conversion and it is then amended on your V5C.
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What I want know know is who is making these changes and when did they become boss? seriously, I do want to know. Who? Well most fingers would point at the EU but in fact they are part of EUNECE which is the United Nations motoring framework, an institution set up in apprx 1949 from memory. We link from ACE to the working parties /papers of EUNECE and from that you can normally see what is being planned for 4 or 5 years ahead of it coming here. The changes to the MOT will be part of the EUWVTA regs that are due in full force in 2012 .
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But as per usual most (not all) people chose to ignore doing the reading of such an important subject and instead took the seemingly easier option of running around like headless chickens when news os possible regulation changes come up. Knowledge is your friend, people. I've been slowly working through all of the links here: www.the-ace.org.uk/links-to-consultations.htmlA lot to take in, but absolutely essential, in my opinion. Our general view when looking at stuff in Europes is ...we're next:( . Hence, as most of the EU have regulations preventing free use of Historic vehicles, we have been watching our little island with concern. When viewing proposed legislation we always look at how we currently cope with that situation. If it is by a method that could be closed to it then we need input to negate as much harm as possible.
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If you mean the systems used for the the Congestion Charge and Low Emission Zone enforcement, they go on ANPR cross referenced with what's recorded at the DVLA. If they were to be used to keep out higher emissions vehicles (or more likely to charge the registered keepers) how would they do this with pre 2001 registered PLG vehicles? Unless they just lump together and charge anything registered between 1972 and 2001, it would be impossible to police..... You have to notify DVLA on LPG conversion and it is then amended on your V5C. LPG is no longer an exemption for the Congestion Charge, and even when it was it had to be within 3 years of the vehicle's registration. Petrol vehicles of any kind are exempt from the LEZ. Remember my reply was only about the ANPR cameras used in London for the CC and LEZ charges.
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I wouldn't really consider that issue to be retrospective, as it is just tightening up on acceptable levels of damage / degradation, rather than requiring modification from the original spec. However I take your point though. However, is there anything relating to the use of older (in particular, pre-cat) vehicles, as is seen in some German cities? Here in London, there is already more than enough infrastructure in place that could enforce restrictions on the use of older vehicles.... If you mean the systems used for the the Congestion Charge and Low Emission Zone enforcement, they go on ANPR cross referenced with what's recorded at the DVLA. If they were to be used to keep out higher emissions vehicles (or more likely to charge the registered keepers) how would they do this with pre 2001 registered PLG vehicles? Unless they just lump together and charge anything registered between 1972 and 2001, it would be impossible to police..... No, it would be VERY easy, especially now that the DVLA & MOT system is computerised, to weed out for example, pre-cat vehicles, or any specific cut-off such as date, or emission standard that is recorded on the V5C.
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Last Edit: Nov 5, 2010 16:12:26 GMT by Paul H
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well, it's reassuring to know that people are aware of the situation and fighting the good fight.
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1985 Bedford CF2 camper 1991 Volvo 240 Turbo
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Our biggest problem is still getting people to read the site and take it all seriously . Part of the reason for the site is to show links to the TRUTH of whats' happening to dispel Internet rumours but also to be able to rally people quickly when needed.
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If you mean the systems used for the the Congestion Charge and Low Emission Zone enforcement, they go on ANPR cross referenced with what's recorded at the DVLA. If they were to be used to keep out higher emissions vehicles (or more likely to charge the registered keepers) how would they do this with pre 2001 registered PLG vehicles? Unless they just lump together and charge anything registered between 1972 and 2001, it would be impossible to police..... No, it would be VERY easy, especially now that the DVLA & MOT system is computerised, to weed out for example, pre-cat vehicles, or any specific cut-off such as date, or emission standard that is recorded on the V5C. I have to disagree. Yes, MOTs are computerised, but what your car currently emits is not recorded on the DVLA database. If it's post 2001, the CO2 reading shown on the V5C was recorded by the manufacturer when it was new. It's that registered reading the DVLA sets it's tax against, not what it was recorded putting out at the last MOT..... The DVLA only has recorded what the manufacturer says it was putting out when new. They would sink under the paperwork if they had to amend their records every time a car passes an MOT, it's done once only, at registration. Otherwise pre 2001 vehicles would have a CO2 reading on their V5Cs too.
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stealthstylz
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 14,835
Club RR Member Number: 174
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Do VOSA have emissions checkpoints? My mate's well into his diesel tuning. He currently runs a 206 Dturbo which are about 88bhp standard, mapped up to 140bhp. The map is just fed onto the stock ECU and he's kept the stock map on a CD. For MOT purposes it'd take 5 minutes to stick the stock map back on but at a checkpoint it'd be difficult unless he kept a laptop in the car.
Matt
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Dependent on the age of vehicle you have a set range of emmissions to meet as well. So the age immediately tells you what emmission spec it is, even on my SVAd truck I have the emmisions sisted even though it is '82 engine ( on a 2009 date of first registration).
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Page 1
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Last Edit: Nov 5, 2010 17:05:56 GMT by kapri
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Yeah but imagine the cheap hot rod base material that would be kicking about lol. Not sure. See when I was involved with some of the FBHVC people they didn't care about daily driver stuff with classics because they keep thiers off road in winter and daily drive a modern. The flat cap types mostly only use their stuff for summer weekends and shows as it is. When I bitched about daily driving I was told thats not what a classic car is for. This was some years ago and attitudes may have changed? But as a proportion of the remaining pre-1973 cars on the road how many do you think are daylies?
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1937 Austin Street Rod - 1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1976 Rover V8 - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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