gazwad
Part of things
Posts: 202
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Dec 13, 2022 10:43:10 GMT
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I've been working on this project for the last few months so thought I would do a build thread now I have something to share. It’s a 1991 Alfa Romeo 33 S 16v cloverleaf(or quadrifoglio verde) Permanent 4. These are a development from the Alfasud with a new body (although a lot of the floorpan and bulkhead look very similar), the wonderful boxer engine stretched out to 1.7 litres and 16v heads added as well as individual throttle bodies from the factory so they sound incredible! The permanent 4 also has a 4wd system using a viscous coupling on the propshaft to a 5 link live rear axle. There is also an electromagnetic clutch to engage drive to the rear wheels. The P4 also got a unique patterned Recaro interior and some other nice bits. # First a little background, back in the early noughties my friend was loaned an alfa 33 permanent 4 from his uncle and after he took me out in it I knew I had to have one, one day. A year or two later I started looking for one but had to settle on a FWD alfa 33 cloverleaf 16v as the Permanent 4 was out of my budget, still it was a great car which I sold on for the next thing a year or two later. Fast forward 18 years and my daily modern car has been a 2011 Alfa Giulietta 1.4 turbo multiair - A very good, fast, economical car that I couldn't really fault and had been very reliable for the 6 years I owned it, but it wasn't fun to drive (like most modern stuff in my opinion) and I never really bonded with it. I didn't bother me too much as I have a modified classic mini for fun and a retro (1996) honda stepwagon for family duties. But work circumstances changed meaning I was now working from home most days and didn't need a modern car for commuting so decided to find something more fun to replace the Giulietta but that was more practical than the mini. After looking at various options I remembered my old 33 and started looking for one, prices were still reasonable compared to other 80's/90's hot hatches and after a while I found a project car in London. It was very solid and complete but a non runner due to head gasket failure and unfortunately had been stored carelessly so the paint was scratched and chipped badly, it wasn't my dream Permanent 4 version but just the FWD version (permanent 4's are incredibly rare now). I decided to buy it and arranged for it to be collected and on the way home I received a message from a bloke who is very well known in Alfa 33 circles saying he knew of a Permanent 4 which might be for sale. So naturally after having already bought the FWD car and having no room for another 33 I did what any of us would do and rushed down to Southampton as quickly as possible to look at it. It needed a lot more work than the other one including welding and mechanical work (also a non runner) as it had been sitting in a field for at least 4-5 years. Anyway a deal was done and I had it collected a few days later – it had to be dragged out of the field and still had brambles growing through it when it got here! Here it is after unloading: Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr This was back in march (2022) and as I only had the driveway to work on I wanted to try and get it back on the road before winter so I’m not working on it in the bad weather, but before that could start I had to move the FWD one on – but struggled to sell it so ended up breaking it which was a shame but most of it is being re-used and a lot of parts actually were needed on the Permanent 4. First thing to do is a quick wash of course: Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr# The photo’s are deceiving – the paint is really badly faded, scratched and peeling in a lot of places so the plan is a full respray after the mechanical and underbody restoration is done.
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gazwad
Part of things
Posts: 202
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Dec 13, 2022 10:44:09 GMT
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Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Despite the exterior being scruffy the interior was in exceptional condition – especially the seats. The only thing bad bits being a mouldy carpet and headlining from a leaky sunroof drain hose but these were easily cleaned up. When I was waiting to get started on the project I got hold of a wooden steering wheel (was an optional extra from the dealers) which I restored, I am missing the proper centre padded bit but it still looks good: Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr To make the project manageable with the little space I have to work on it and store parts I decided to work on it in sections, so the back half was first – I removed the rear axle and completely stripped down the back half of the underside before tacking the welding Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr 5 years in a damp field makes and alfa look like this underneath: Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Luckily a lot of it was just surface rust and was removed with a knotted wire wheel on the angle grinder (or death wheel as I call them as they are nasy bastards) then treated with rust remover gel, then rust converted to catch and last tiny bits and finally primer, stone chip and lastly bilt hamber UB wax. The welding was mostly contained to the jacking areas (all four corners) and the end sill closing areas as well as a few other small bits so not too bad considering. Finished result (this whole area is new metal) Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr And the rear end of the underside all welded, de-rusted and painted Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Next the rear axle was stripped, checked and re-built, the calipers rebuilt and refurbished, all new bushes, bearings, hoses, brake lines etc and every part stripped and repainted. The fuel tank was solid but rusty inside and being specific to the P4 it is not available anywhere so I filled it with Deox-c and left it overnight and when emptied in the morning it was completely rust free inside so I then coated it internally with por 15 tank sealer to protect it and painted the outside. The fuel sender was shot so had to be replaced but again are specific to the P4 so nigh on impossible to find but I struck got and found the only one available anywhere and it was new old stock genuine Alfa too but was in Greece so wasn’t cheap to get posted here. If fact I have had to source parts from all over the place including Spain, Greece, Germany, Italy, Crete, The Netherlands and Ireland. The rear end re-assembled: Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Calipers came up like new after soaking in Deox-c Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Rebuilt with new pistons and seals Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr
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gazwad
Part of things
Posts: 202
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Dec 13, 2022 10:45:34 GMT
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I then moved on to the front, the engine had to come out for rust repairs and paint but first I wanted to see if it would run. After a new fuel pump it eventually fired up and was running rough but no knocking etc so seemed usable. Engine out and stripped: Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr I decided to replace the piston rings and hone the bores as well as skimming and rebuilding the heads, I found one slightly bent valve and one cracked valve so was worth stripping it down as well as that most of the gaskets and seals were past their best so needed replacing. Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Gave the ports a little tickle as the are not very smooth from the factory Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Inlet manifold got some wrinkle red (which turns out to be orange so was dusted over with alfa rosso red) Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr The alternator was upgraded to one from the Alfa 145 boxer which required a new pulley and some fiddling about – the main reason was I got a brand new one for £20! Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr What a great looking engine: Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr I found some more modern Ev6 bosch injectors from a bmw which have the same flow rate and fittings as the original bosch ones which were knackered. They were a straight swap. Work continued on the front end rust repairs with some welding required on the floors and inner wings, all the painted in stone chip underneath and body colour in the engine bay – it’s not concours as this it meant to be a fun daily road car and my aim to just to restore it to a reasonable standard and prevent future rust. Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Steering rack inspected, cleaned, painted and refitted with new hoses etc Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Gearbox was also cleaned up and inspected, new universal joints on the propshaft (which I had to modify to fit as non are available in this weird size) and a new clutch. The big red wire going into the tail end of the gearbox is the power for the electromagnetic coupling which send power to the rear wheels. I think it would be fairly easy to convert it to RWD by locking the coupling in position, replacing the viscous coupling with a solid propshaft and removing the front driveshafts/diff etc… Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Engine & gearbox back in the car (note the individual throttle bodies!) – the easiest way is to lift it in as a complete assembly from below Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Front suspension and brakes going back on, again everything is either new or reconditioned etc Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Viscous coupling and propshafts Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Next I decided to make a stainless exhaust, the original one was past it’s best and it would cost me roughly the same to make a stainless one as it would to buy a standard replacement Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr 2” bore (which is what these engines like in standard or mildly tuned form) 2 straight through boxes and V-band clamps instead of slip joints All the bits are from profusion exhausts, I’ve used their stuff before on my mini and find the quality is good and prices are reasonable too. With the original mild steel manifold (which I welded on the v-band ring) for now – I may make a stainless one in the future Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Fitted up Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr by garrywadey, on Flickr Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Everything fitted up to the engine, new coolant hoses, fuel hoses, radiator etc etc. And it fired up first time (sort of- after I realised I hadn’t plugged in the ECU). Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr The fuel pressure regulator was making some funny noises and they aren’t available new so I replaced it for a universal 3 bar Webcon unit (1 inlet, 2 outlets like the original), it was pretty much a straight fit apart from drilling an extra hole in the mounting bracket. Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr The P4’s usually sit pretty low as the 16v cloverleaf cars have shorter springs than the standard 33’s and the P4 has even shorter springs as standard, the problem was the original springs were to corroded to use and looked pretty close to snapping and the only new replacements available are for the standard cars so I fitted some of them but the front in particular was way too high so I ended up getting some H&R lowering springs which are actually the same height as the original p4 spring and significanly lower than the standard 33 springs Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Before I even bought the car I managed to bag some very rare alfa speedline wheels, these are the wheels I remember on my friends P4 and are the ones I always wanted. They were very rough though so I bodged up a ‘wheel lathe’ to spin them up on and recondition them Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Painted centres, polished lip and some new stainless bolts (they are fake split rims) Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr And this is how it now sits, the grey wheel centres make them look a bit small but they look much better in the flesh Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr It seemed to be running ok so took it for an mot which it passed with flying colours, I’ve now done about 500 miles in it and have discovered a few little things which need sorting. Firstly an engine core plug was leaking so I replaced all of those (don’t know why I didn’t do it when the engine was apart!), next was a front suspension clonk which was the front spring seat pans fitted on the wrong sides (they are handed I now know). and the main couple of thing are a loud drone noise like a wheel bearing and poor brakes. I tracked the droning noise down to the viscous coupling – I suspect one of the bearings supplied with the new mounts is cheap Chinese rubbish so a new skf bearing is on the way. As for the brake, they are all new and reconditioned and beeded in by now (with decent mintex pads) and they work as they should but they are just so undersized compared to more modern stuff so I want to improve them. Luckily the P4 comes with rear discs so no need to do anything with them. There are no off the shelf brake kits for these but I had heard of some Vauxhall/opel calipers fitting, I bought some old Vectra B calipers and carriers(for the 288mm discs) and sure enough they bolted straight to the hubs, some alfa 155 284mm disc have the same pcd and centre bore as the 33 and fit perfectly even lining up centrally in the Vectra caliper! They size difference is obvious, luckily they still fit under my 15” speedline wheels 155 disc vs 33 disc Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Vectra Pad vs 33 pad Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Assembly fitted Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr Also as the calipers have a much bigger piston I changed the master cylinder to an Alfa 75 one as it is a larger bore and is almost a straight swap (pipes need swapping round). The bleeding was a nightmare and took ages to get a decent pedal – I think they was air trapped in the rear calipers due to the orientation of the hoses etc so I got a better result by unbolting them and turning them upwards a bit. They still need to bed in but so far seem pretty good. There’s a few little bits to tweak and adjust but its on the road and drives pretty well (the engine is fantastic!) and the noise is makes is incredible – people go on about the alfa busso v6 sounding great and I recon this is a close second to that! The bodywork is the last main thing to do, I have replacement wings and doors etc to replace the rusty ones on it but they will go on when it goes for a respray hopefully in the next few months My Odd little fleet (1991 alfa 33 permanent 4, 1996 Honda stepwagon RF2 4wd, 1971 mini with 180bhp rover k series) Untitled by garrywadey, on Flickr
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Last Edit: Dec 13, 2022 10:48:52 GMT by gazwad
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Dec 13, 2022 10:55:25 GMT
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That's a great job - well done. I hadn't even heard of this model but I bet it is perfect for the current weather.
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Dec 13, 2022 11:09:43 GMT
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Bloody hell you don't hang about! Awesome little car, great work, and a kickass 3-car fleet.
That sort of viscous coupling midway through the propshaft is the same setup LR Freelanders have. If yours does turn out to be duff I wonder if one of those is modifiable. Fingers crossed it's just the bearing.
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Dec 13, 2022 11:18:24 GMT
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The first car I bought myself was an Alfa 33 1.7 Cloverleaf (1989 pre facelift). Was a fantastic car, eventually got killed by a local bin lorry reversing in to it, denting the door and wing, then driving off. This was back in early 2000's when I had zero money, so took the insurance, which wrote it off ... if I'd known then what I know now .... *sigh* That flat 4 boxer makes a great noise, mine was Weber carbed and made a lovely crackle noise on overrun This looks like a lovely project and well done for taking on and turning out such a good car.
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Last Edit: Dec 13, 2022 11:18:50 GMT by HoTWire
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Dec 13, 2022 12:49:01 GMT
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Thats a great save. Id forgotten about these cars. Am I right that there were two different 4wd setups on these? Seem to remember there was an "l live in the mountains" spec one, where the 4wd wasn't a performance thing at all. Just meant to get you out of the mud or snow.
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gazwad
Part of things
Posts: 202
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Dec 13, 2022 13:50:04 GMT
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Thanks for the comments, yes it’s the forgotten alfa I suppose, there’s not many left now (only 2 permanent 4’s on the road including mine if you believe ‘how many left’). I have a spare viscous coupling which i tried (made no difference) and with it spinning but no load through it it still makes the noise so I believe the coupling itself it ok. Yes there was an earlier series 1/2 33 4x4 which had a manual lever to select 4x4 mode, it had no centre diff/viscous coupling so was only for mud and snow use. I think it was only with the 1.5 8v engine as well, the 16v didn’t come out until the series 3.
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drive
Part of things
Tired? Sleep faster!
Posts: 65
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Dec 13, 2022 19:46:00 GMT
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Great write up,great car and great little collection, even greater skills. Thanks for sharing with us!
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Dec 13, 2022 20:40:57 GMT
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Magnificent…
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Ich habe kein Geld!
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Dec 13, 2022 21:43:50 GMT
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Fab job you've done and quickly too. As an ex owner of two Suds one thing I always wanted was more power, I reckon that 1.7 16V engine would have been brilliant in them. Bookmarked.
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Still learning...still spending...still breaking things!
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Dec 13, 2022 22:16:04 GMT
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The first car I bought myself was an Alfa 33 1.7 Cloverleaf (1989 pre facelift). Was a fantastic car, eventually got killed by a local bin lorry reversing in to it, denting the door and wing, then driving off. This was back in early 2000's when I had zero money, so took the insurance, which wrote it off ... if I'd known then what I know now .... *sigh* That flat 4 boxer makes a great noise, mine was Weber carbed and made a lovely crackle noise on overrun This looks like a lovely project and well done for taking on and turning out such a good car. Same here.. my first car was a 1988 33 1.7 qv cloverleaf with the double carbies on the boxer. My dad adjusted them and we removed the rev limiter from the rotor. Turned it into a real fast car.had a lot of fun with it although it used petrol at an alarming rate..😅 sounded awesome with the modified airbox.
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Dec 14, 2022 16:42:53 GMT
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Never heard of this model before, quite interesting, The standard of your rebuilding / refurbishing / fabrication is first class, it should look brilliant when the paintwork and bodywork is completed, Looking forward to seeing future updates on this thread, Bookmarked, Nigel
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BMW E39 525i Sport BMW E46 320d Sport Touring (now sold on.) BMW E30 325 Touring (now sold on.) BMW E30 320 Cabriolet (Project car - currently for sale.)
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Dec 14, 2022 18:08:13 GMT
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Always loved/envied your mini, but really like this one too
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Dec 14, 2022 19:04:32 GMT
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Like many I was completely unaware these were a thing so good save of a rare one.
I would love to get my hands on one of those flat fours and a vw tranaxle, though not at the expense of a rare car.
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village
Part of things
Always carries a toolbox. Because Volkswagen.......
Posts: 567
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Dec 14, 2022 21:15:44 GMT
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My school chum Leo has 2 Suds (and a Stage 1 Landrover) and had a series 1 33 1.5 at one point too.
The exhaust manifolds are mental. Tubular and about 4 feet long. You can see where the epic noise comes from!
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"The White Van is strong with this one...."
Chris "Chesney" Allen 1976-2005 RIP
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Dec 16, 2022 17:15:00 GMT
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I enjoyed my time with Alfa Sprints and the Boxer engines were great - as was the Busso V6! Well done with yours.
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jamesd1972
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,921
Club RR Member Number: 40
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Dec 16, 2022 23:32:58 GMT
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Nice job sir. We had a ‘sud ti with a 1750 33 boxer engine in it which sounded great. Don’t miss the parts availability but do miss the noise ! James
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That is another car I'd not known of until today. Cool as heck and a neat wee resto. Do you have a flyby or a run through the gears video??
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So much want with this one...
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