mrea
Part of things
Posts: 124 
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Hi RR!
So this is my second thread here, after almost finished the restoration of my W111 this is of my beloved Alfa Romeo 156, which I've owned since 2013-08-31. It has been parked for the past 5 years due to personal issues, which made me go buy my 2010 Alfa Romeo Giulietta.
Now this summer 2020 I was going to check it over and change the belts, fluids and do a once over and get a MOT and start to drive it (since I cannot afford to have 4 cars and a motorcycle in the city I need to get rid of at least one..)
The idea is to get a fun petrol-saving daily! 
So when I bought it (I was first a kid/teenager), it had horrible ACE 18" which rubbed and wobbled, also a broken CV joint (February 2014) and some other stuff (fake carbon side trimmings and so on) but on the plusside a lot of paperwork from Germany (since it was an import) a lot of papers from my country for inspections and so on. A stainless cat back system and Eibach springs with apropriate shocks, are also installed and a tune giving it around 210hp/230nm.
Also was named one of the most rustfree non-repaired AR 156:s which is true. Found around 2 quarters of surface rust. This is mainly due to not being driven at winter time at all.
Since the blinkers were worn out I bought new black ones and changed and sold the wheels to a pair of Kosei Sniper 17" with 10mm spacers which I started to paint black. Also bought a 330mm Big brake kit with 4/6 piston calipers which is about to get mounted (after 7 years..) a strut brace and a lot of other stuff. It is lowered so much already I cannot fit my foot under the front bumber. Which looks really good though..
Also I polished and toned down the rear lights, bought a OEM set if someone complains, also bought a pair of black aftermarket headlights (not sure and not mounted) an extra set of headlights to polish up and/or paint GTA style.
There is a lot of history with this one for me so I will probably keep this one.
One of the last pictures before parking it, beside a house I wanted to buy (but ended up not)
But now to the sad stuff, I was pulling it out of the garage after changing the oil and what the duck, it's fresh oil and water. Also a little less water in the expansion tank. The duck.
Uncovering it for the first time in many years (5-6)
Cleaned the interior a bit.
Sucking the oil out due to not being able to drain it even with the planks under the wheels.
Also put in fresh oil and some coolant.
That sadness, a it might be condensation, right?
 Checking the timing-belt which looked nice so at least I can start it to warmup and change oil. 
Checked and changed the accessory drive belt which was cracked.  
It was easy enough at least.    
Drove it out of storage and smoke started to come out the dipstick a bit, ah sure the duck. 
Changed the oil and filter again and started to think, what if it's the oil heat exchanger or headgaskets? Drove it back to storage and called my AR specialist. 
Sure they thought it was the headgasket, and to no suprise the work was quoted to 2200-3000 £ How about no. Called my parts guy and ordered a complete headset of gaskets and all the special/locking tools needed. That was also expensive but not as much of an expense as letting the garage do it. So currently I am studying my workshop manual in both book form and my eLearn manual and doing a "to-do when I am there" list.
As of now the list is as follows;
Change the radiator (already have a new one that might fit forgot to check part no) Change the headgaskets and all seals at the top (ordered a kit) Polish the headlights (started with that)
Best regards, MrEA
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Last Edit: Sept 1, 2020 13:25:42 GMT by mrea
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Have you done the usual 'quick' checks i.e. is there a milky coffee emulsion on the underside of the oil filler cap ... are there bubbles in the header tank when engine up to temp (thermostat open)... are there any petrol / exhaust fumes smell from the header tank does the coolant look 'oilly' ... re there any emsulsion type deposits in the header tank ?
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Last Edit: Sept 1, 2020 7:46:21 GMT by westbay
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Absolutely love a 156. My first proper car was a 156 and they're brilliant. Nice to see one in such good nick! This was mine before I gave it back to my dad:  The 2.5 V6 is such a great engine, and the chassis is willing enough. I put GTA SW anti-roll bars on mine which helps with the understeer a little (thicker front, and much thicker rear). Didn't get round to coilovers. Have you considered the 3.0l? Not sure what they're going for these days, but the 2.5 ECU will run them ok. A tune would be nice to get the most out of them, but that's true of any of them. |
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mrea
Part of things
Posts: 124
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Have you done the usual 'quick' checks i.e. is there a milky coffee emulsion on the underside of the oil filler cap ... are there bubbles in the header tank when engine up to temp (thermostat open)... are there any petrol / exhaust fumes smell from the header tank does the coolant look 'oilly' ... re there any emsulsion type deposits in the header tank ? Ah I forgot to mention it, I changed oil and filter 2 times just to see if the water would go away. But it indeed seems as if there is more water in the oil, even though it's not decreasing in the coolant reservoir (have just run it for 3 minutes at a time, just for the temp to rise) out of fear for starvation.
I will do a change again before teardown just to see, but run out of oil and filters..
As of your questions;
There is no smoke/smell from the exhaust at all. There is a steady/bubbling stream of water in the upper circulation tube to the coolant reservoir. The coolant is fresh looking and is okay with a tester. There is no fog or residue on the oilcap. There is minor bubbles on the dipstick (after the 3d oil change and 2nd filter change. 1st change just oil, the 2 other oil and filter) No deposits in the reservoir. There is water vapour coming from the oil dipstick when lifted.
The car wasn't pulling coolant before parked.
Thank you for your help, do you have more tips?
Best regards, MrEA
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Compression check ?
From your reply it's difficult to suggest what else to try / check ...
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mrea
Part of things
Posts: 124
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Absolutely love a 156. My first proper car was a 156 and they're brilliant. Nice to see one in such good nick! This was mine before I gave it back to my dad: The 2.5 V6 is such a great engine, and the chassis is willing enough. I put GTA SW anti-roll bars on mine which helps with the understeer a little (thicker front, and much thicker rear). Didn't get round to coilovers. Have you considered the 3.0l? Not sure what they're going for these days, but the 2.5 ECU will run them ok. A tune would be nice to get the most out of them, but that's true of any of them. Such a lovely motor!
I've been driving this car at top speed and revs for almost all of the km's that I've had it even though changing gears at 5,800 rpm instead of the 6,500 due to valve lift issues (which was only present at the earlier 3.0 engine, but didn't know that until recently) and serviced it at every 5000km's. It's such a stable car at speed and comfortable.
Due to regulations where I am at, I am not allowed to change the engine to a 3.0 or 3.2L but I am allowed to bore it out sort-of (as long as it looks stock). But there is issues with the gearbox and diff if you increase power too much, since the 6-speed is a fragile thing, I do have a 5-speed in reserve though which is supposedly stronger, I had it on my 2.0L Turbo 156 which I had at the same time.
I will post a picture soon!
I've been thinking about changing the runners and some other stuff in the future, but for now it's only to make sure it runs great enough to use.
MrEA
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mrea
Part of things
Posts: 124
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Compression check ? From your reply it's difficult to suggest what else to try / check ... Compression check is almost impossible without removing half of the upper engine side unfortunately, but will try hen I get the chance.
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mrea
Part of things
Posts: 124
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So for fun and as it seems we have a few Alfistis here. I'll post a few pictures of my 1999 156 with a turbocharged 2.0 TS, made the manifold and everything from scratch, bought a new bumber to cut apart and some stuff. I had to redo the whole engine due to the classic no3 cylinder oil starvation. So put in a new crank, new pistonrings, removed some weight from the pistons and lowered compression to ~8-8,5:1, new bearings everywhere, larger valves, made some deletion-axles for the balanceshafts and a lighter flywheel. (For what I can remember right now as I started that one in December 2012)
Did a lot of rust repairs as well, the floors and some other bit-bobs, but it got scrapped a few years back (2016 I think) due to lack of space and no-one wanting to buy it for that asking price, but still have the engine/gearbox and some other spares for the body which I bought brand new, they will go on to this V6 one.
The only engine picture I have currently 2.0TS (since I am at a coffee break at work); 
Intercooler and piping without bumber;
Mounted bumber; 
Completed, also those headlights might go on this one if I want to, or at least try them out. I have a few to choose from; 
Best regards, MrEA
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Sept 1, 2020 10:04:49 GMT
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Huh, I was under the impression the 6-speed was pretty robust. They certainly still use it unmodified in the AutoDelta 3.7 big bore supercharged things with 400ish bhp. Should be more than capable with just a warmed up 3.0l. Your right though, if the regs prevent a swap to a 3.0 then it becomes a bit mroe of an involved procedure. You can get it to 2.8 with 3.0l pistons/liners and 2.5 crank, but that is full rebuild type stuff which is a bit of an expansion in scope from just a headgasket! Man that T-Spark turbo was a cool car! Real shame that its not together, but I do understand the space issue. I'd have been inclined to just sell it to someone who wanted it regardless of the price! But then again I've always been a little less financially aware with car purshases than most seem to be  |
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Sept 1, 2020 10:11:40 GMT
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One of those cars that just upped and vanished, overnight.
Cool cars though. Almost no V6 cars were sold on Ireland as the annual tax was gigantic sadly.
Hopefully a gasket set will fix it for you.
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mrea
Part of things
Posts: 124
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Sept 1, 2020 10:59:47 GMT
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Huh, I was under the impression the 6-speed was pretty robust. They certainly still use it unmodified in the AutoDelta 3.7 big bore supercharged things with 400ish bhp. Should be more than capable with just a warmed up 3.0l. Your right though, if the regs prevent a swap to a 3.0 then it becomes a bit mroe of an involved procedure. You can get it to 2.8 with 3.0l pistons/liners and 2.5 crank, but that is full rebuild type stuff which is a bit of an expansion in scope from just a headgasket! Man that T-Spark turbo was a cool car! Real shame that its not together, but I do understand the space issue. I'd have been inclined to just sell it to someone who wanted it regardless of the price! But then again I've always been a little less financially aware with car purshases than most seem to be Regarding the 6-speed I might be wrong but have heard of 3.2 that blew diffs and gearboxes when put on track. But I can modify with cams, inlets and other "cheaper" stuff and so on if I feel inclined to make more noise!
Yeah it was a blast! Suprised it was holding on for all the time I was driving it, variable maps between winter 225hp to track 310-330hp depending on temperature.
Well I put a lot of money and time in that one, around 11,000£ in parts plus labour so I couldn't just give it away for 50£ as one of the offers where 
Best regards, MrEA
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Last Edit: Sept 1, 2020 11:02:31 GMT by mrea
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mrea
Part of things
Posts: 124
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Sept 1, 2020 11:02:16 GMT
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One of those cars that just upped and vanished, overnight. Cool cars though. Almost no V6 cars were sold on Ireland as the annual tax was gigantic sadly. Hopefully a gasket set will fix it for you. Oh wow that's quick!
They are pretty cool and suprisingly modern I even have an option for backward beeping Yeah the tax is a handful, since I got and extra yearly added import tax (due to sales tax for being sold new in my country, not being present)
I do hope so, or hope it's something lesser.. We will see in a couple of weeks!
Best regards, MrEA
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Sept 1, 2020 12:44:07 GMT
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Ah, looks like there's been a handful of issues with the spider gears in the diff on tracked GTAs. Not sure if they were the Q2 or non-Q2 versions (I'm assumoing non-Q2 as I didn't think they had spider gears) .
There's quaife options which would get rid of the spider gears altogether, if the Q2 isn't a fix.
Still, it's all additional work if all you were after is a headgasket!
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Last Edit: Sept 1, 2020 12:49:59 GMT by biturbo228
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mrea
Part of things
Posts: 124
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Sept 1, 2020 13:23:05 GMT
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Ah, looks like there's been a handful of issues with the spider gears in the diff on tracked GTAs. Not sure if they were the Q2 or non-Q2 versions (I'm assumoing non-Q2 as I didn't think they had spider gears) . There's quaife options which would get rid of the spider gears altogether, if the Q2 isn't a fix. Still, it's all additional work if all you were after is a headgasket! That might be true, I've only read on some forums on what to upgrade and that seemed as a weak point. But as of right now, I just need it to start and go safely, which it did before
It still sounds like a champ and runs good/no misfires so it shouldn't be an issue as soon as I find the water leakage.
And yes! But it's all fun and games to look for upgrades!
I hope in the future to be able to add more fun-parts also.
Best regards, MrEA
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mrea
Part of things
Posts: 124
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Sept 2, 2020 12:17:02 GMT
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2020-09-01 Short one!
Got my package with the spareparts and now I am waiting for my new set of camlock tools to arrive should arrive today 2020-09-02 or tomorrow.
Containing the following;
1pcs Headgasket set complete with every gasket for the heads, valveseals, intake manifold, exhaust manifold, intake tube etc. 6pcs of OEM Champion Sparkplugs (recommended by Alfa WM) 3pcs of MAHLE OE Oil filters 1pcs Cylinder seals kit (6pcs of O-ring)
3pcs of Oil drain plug seals
Also got a picture of my newly polished/refurbed headlight, thinking about taking it apart and do a GTA mod. But we will see, they are not expensive to buy either. 
Best regards, MrEA
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mrea
Part of things
Posts: 124
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Sept 6, 2020 19:17:12 GMT
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2020-09-05/06
Hi RR
Did a lot of work this weekend but couldn't get the drivepulley off the crank so I'll await more tools. But dropped everything out in front at least and checked cams and such so that's all good!
Do we remember how the car looked a bit ago? Well it's not looking the same.
That hinge though bothers me.
During teardown all the oil looked good even though it smoked a bit, not much water in it now, even though the coolant had dropped a bit it still looked OK.
The radiator had seen it's best days but I got a new one in stock so why not change it when I'm here.
Found some light surface rust which I am dealing with now.
Time to remove stuff. 
Poof and goodnight. Cams look good.
  
The PO did this "mod" because he couldn't be bothered fixing it properly, good thing I had these new as spares, even though they are painted in Cosmos Blue Metallic instead of Grigioro Africa. Meant for my 2.0TS but never got used. Both sides were busted and changed.
   
Time to polish the inlet tubes because why not. Before during and after.
  
Couldn't stand the look of the fanshroud either so started de-rusting it. No primer or zink of this one from the fabric just black paint? Why??
Will paint color after also but didn't have at home.
Cleaned the valvecovers a bit, it's better at least.
Got the left header off, surprisingly easy actually. Did not expect that!
 
As I left her for the night before going home.
Calculated a bit and in total it took around 14 hours (incl food) to get this far, which is basically nothing, we can remove 3 hours of trying to remove the crankshaft pulley.. and 1-2 hours more if we don't calculate the lathe work required for that.
But that hinge though, it followed me home and I gave it a bath and took it apart and cleaned it. I couldn't leave that out of my mind!
Before:
 
After:  
And now I am going to sleep and dream about 41mm sockets and removing the crankshaft pulley for a week...
Best regards, MrEA
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Sept 6, 2020 19:49:37 GMT
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I've always had an interest in 156's. Looking forward to more posts.
Bookmarked
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Still learning...still spending...still breaking things!
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Sept 6, 2020 22:25:59 GMT
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Nice work!
Yeah I remember having trouble with the crank pulley on mine. Pro tip, most impact 41mm sockets are too wide to fit into the hole for the crank pulley nut. I had to slim mine down quite a bit to get it to fit without binding on the outside.
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mrea
Part of things
Posts: 124
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I've always had an interest in 156's. Looking forward to more posts. Bookmarked Hopefully more will come! Thank you! MrEA
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mrea
Part of things
Posts: 124
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Nice work! Yeah I remember having trouble with the crank pulley on mine. Pro tip, most impact 41mm sockets are too wide to fit into the hole for the crank pulley nut. I had to slim mine down quite a bit to get it to fit without binding on the outside. Ah yes I do know that its a tight space, when pulling yesterday I broke a 41mm socket. So a new one is on order for the weekend together with a longer brakerbar, bended the earlier like a banana.. and the 450nm impact did nothing. Stubborn thing!
MrEA
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