|
|
|
Interesting that they should say vehicles post-86 should be ok, rather than post-93 in the report in the OP. The year 1986 is singled out because in Australia, 1986 was the year when it first became mandatory for all new vehicles to run on unleaded fuel only, rather than leaded fuel. This also coincided with a whole bunch of other regulations which were introduced regarding emissions, noise, safety and other things such as a standardised VIN being required on compliance plates and recorded onto computers, etc. Around where I live, there are a couple of servos selling E10 for a few cents cheaper than regular unleaded, plus quite a few are now selling E85. I usually avoid the E10 for my old cars, but I have run a tankful or two through my carburetted VW and Holden and didn't have any trouble with them. I avoid the fuel based on the risk that it might deteriorate seals or lines, but in reality I don't think that the E10 is much different to regular unleaded, since they are adding ethanol to regular unleaded anyway!
|
|
|
|
|
CanMan
Part of things
Posts: 177
|
|
|
So when this annoyinly kicks in what are we going to do? Richen the mix (Worse ecomomy) and get hit in the pocket even more plus having to put up with rotten fuel tanks and f***ed carbs?
Who ever thought of this deserves a bl00dy good punch D:
|
|
|
|
10mpg
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,253
Club RR Member Number: 204
|
|
|
When I was in the states this summer I noticed that most pumps have an ethanol % figure on them, I filled up most days with about $150's worth of fuel so I had ample opportunity to consider it... It seemed with the greater the proportion of ethanol the fuel became cheaper and conversely the purer petrol often being more expensive, some gas stations were selling themselves on the 'no ethanol in our fuel' tagline.. The biggest % I saw was 35% and there was plenty of pure stuff floating around, I asked a few 'car guys' what I should be putting in my motorhome, and they all said 'just chuck the cheapest in, it makes no difference' so I did, tbh the petrol is far inferior to ours anyway even the premium stuff is barely up to our normal unleaded, couldn’t find any high octane stuff anywhere.. personally i'm not to bothered about it affecting my cars, if it goes in and runs I'm happy, if I have to have a fiddle with the carb so be it, or wack new lines and injectors in an efi system, then ok, the only place i'm worried about it is in MFI systems where the components are expensive and often rare, metering systems and the like on PI triumphs and old Mercs don't come cheap and may be very hard to tune/convert.. Even a new fuel tanks not a huge deal, we have to move with the times! Saying 'why cant it be like the good old days' whilst oddly satisfying gets you nowhere.. This I found stuck to a petrol pump in Maine, apparently when I asked because there has been such a huge outcry over unfair markups on fuel... they should come here for a bit if they think those taxes are bad
|
|
Last Edit: Nov 6, 2011 13:22:30 GMT by 10mpg
The Internet, like all tools, if used improperly, can make a complete bo**cks of even the simplest jobs...
|
|
|
|
|
Yeah, those taxes are nothing! Even in Australia we're paying 38 cents excise per litre on petrol, plus we have to pay 10% GST on the petrol AND the excise! Works out to more than triple the tax rate on that sign, but I would still say that our petrol is fairly affordable.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Experienced it first-hand here with my GTA. All of the older rubber seals, after being sat up for a while, had done one of two things: either turned to a sticky black goo or begun to expand into a jelly-like substance.
I since fitted some newer rubber (Viton) in the hope that it would be a bit more resistant to the alcohol in the fuel here (the pumps say up to 10% alcohol, but judging by how differently my truck runs on some brands compared to others, I'm not so sure).
Running problems seem to be minimal but the long term effects are definitely detrimental if the fuel system hasn't been at least checked to see if the flexible rubber compounds can handle it.
Given that there are already so many additives in Unleaded to try and stabilise it under all conditions, I'm surprised more doesn't happen, really.
--Phil
|
|
Last Edit: Nov 6, 2011 14:02:34 GMT by PhilA
|
|
|
|
|
we've had a lot of problems in the last year or so with the 50' and 60's Jags we work on. we mainly use super unleaded in them as most are tuned with higher compression etc. we now have to lock wire fuel unions because fibre washers tend to shrink and they come undone. we have had fuel pump/carb blockages due to huge amounts of rust in the fuel systems where cars have previously been fine for 50 years or so. there is definatly a change in the fuel. there are addatives that will counteract the affect of ethanol but it'll add ÂŁ15 to every fill up. some synthetic 2 stroke oils are supposed to help and iv'e been using a splash in my old '88 Integra and so far have had no problems. but until it fails i wont know if it works or not? i doubt there will be any scientific experiments of two identical old cars with/without addatives so only time will tell. have a couple of pics 49FXN E Type Lowdrag Coupe piston from said Lowdrag Coupe from when i rebuilt the engine a few years ago. i also purchased a model of it with a signed base signed by the bodys designer Dr Samier Klat
|
|
|
|
bortaf
Posted a lot
Posts: 4,549
|
|
|
yep the old unleaded additve plums all over again i susspect, there will be ethanol safe intank pellets, inline tubes and no doubt magnets as well. All my classics rotted the no neoprean fuel lines when i swapped to unleaded so no doubt there will be similar issues this time round.
|
|
R.I.P photobucket
|
|
mikeymk
Part of things
'85 Polo Coupe S 1.6 16v
Posts: 931
|
|
|
It's already killed a late '90s set of CBR600 carbs, they look like i've been running on battery acid.. i'm really not happy.
How can they get away with putting it in fuel and not telling us? Ethanol smuggled in modern fuels is killing another set of my carbs and i want to avoid said fuel. But how do i know who uses it?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
It's already killed a late '90s set of CBR600 carbs, they look like i've been running on battery acid.. i'm really not happy. How can they get away with putting it in fuel and not telling us? Ethanol smuggled in modern fuels is killing another set of my carbs and I want to avoid said fuel. But how do I know who uses it? I think they should do it like they do here, if a pump pumps E10 then it had to have a sticker by the handle that says so. Quite a lot of stations will advertise out front "No Ethanol" too. A little bit of honesty would work there. -Phil
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Did you know they are currently allowed to add up to 5% at the moment without any notification on the pump Reading the classis mag's it's a big problem in the states but it is keeping a lot of garages busy! The problem is even worse when you leave a car for a while some people are reporting their fuel system get destroyed by the stuff within a few weeks!
|
|
|
|
|
|
Mar 10, 2012 21:21:10 GMT
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Mar 10, 2012 21:28:06 GMT
|
Since most (not all, but most) of the problems are caused by the water absorbed by the ethanol causing corrosion, I am fairly confident that it will affect little-used cars (where the petrol sits around for ages) more than cars in regular use (where the petrol gets replaced rapidly).
I don't know whether it was ethanol, or other additives, but the Nitrile O-rings I used when I rebuilt my Strombergs really didn't like being say in unleaded - they became a loose fit and stopped sealing. The Viton ones I fitted instead seem - so far, anyway - to be holding up.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
If you want to check out the compatibility of ethanol with other materials you can get a complete list here. www.coleparmer.com/Chemical-ResistanceHere is a shorter list that I cut 'n pasted. Selected Chemical : Ethanol PVDF (N - No Data) SS 316 (A - Very Good) PTFE (A - Very Good) SS 304 (A - Very Good) Viton (A - Very Good) Polypropylene (A - Very Good) Neoprene (A - Very Good) Hastalloy C (A - Very Good) EPDM (A - Very Good) Cast Iron (B - Good) SILICONE (B - Good) Aluminium (B - Good) I should point out that (B - Good) in chemical compatibility terms means that over time corrosive effect will cause some discolouration, but not major failure. Also the chemicals listed are assumed to be 100% not diluted.
|
|
Last Edit: Mar 11, 2012 7:30:03 GMT by arrocuda
'71 Arrocuda.... '71 Sunbeam Rapier Turbo (The Grim Rapier).... '63 Hymek D7076..... Audi GT5S
|
|
andyborris
Posted a lot
Freedom is just another word for nothing left to lose.
Posts: 2,173
|
|
Mar 11, 2012 11:32:36 GMT
|
Wonder if those "slosh around" sealants for fuel tanks will be affected?
If they aren't, they might stop the rust inside a tank.......http://www.frost.co.uk/automotive-tanks-products/por15-tank-sealer-946ml.html
Other sealants are available!
|
|
|
|
|
|
Mar 11, 2012 14:40:04 GMT
|
tbh the petrol is far inferior to ours anyway even the premium stuff is barely up to our normal unleaded, couldn’t find any high octane stuff anywhere.. They measure octane slightly differently in the US so despite the numbers on the pumps being slightly lower their fuel is actually not far off European octane levels. There is a table that shows the differences here - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octane_rating
|
|
Last Edit: Mar 11, 2012 14:41:27 GMT by jackherer
"Alice in Wonderland's Cheshire cat is perhaps the 1.9-litre 205's closest parallel, for like Carroll's fiendish cat, when the Peugeot is gone only the grin remains." -What Car? March 1987
|
|
|
|
Mar 11, 2012 16:36:40 GMT
|
|
|
Remember the days when sex was safe and motorsport was dangerous. Vintage bling always attracts pussy.
|
|
|
|
Mar 11, 2012 17:05:17 GMT
|
|
|
Click picture for more
|
|