|
|
|
I’ve a question Chris, if I may? In about 1995 I painted my Land-Rover with a dark bronze green cellulose. Since then, most of the body panels have been replaced piecemeal and painted ad-hoc with a single pack synthetic as and when they were fitted, leaving only the door bottoms in that original cellulose. The motor gets absolutely no cosmetic attention attention whatsoever; not washed, not polished, nothing. The cellulose is still holding up green and glossy, but the synthetic has deteriorated really badly, going flat fairly quickly, and some of the older stuff split, and powdery practically to the point of leaving the panels bare. I got the synthetic paint from different sources and it seems like some of it has held up better than others. Is there something I have done wrong do you think, a process I’ve missed out, or are there brands/types that should be avoided? It’s a working vehicle and I’m not interested in attaining a show/concourse finish, but I’m going to have to finally replace those door bottoms soon, which will need paint, and that will probably spiral into a general blow-over/tidy and I don’t want to put that time, effort and money into paint that’s not going to last. I’m not comfortable at the idea of using 2k, and the job is likely to be done either outside or under a gazebo... When you’ve stopped laughing, your thoughts/comments would be welcome. 😂 Glen - It's down to the quality of the paint - regardless of how you are applying it brush, roller, sweeping brush, spraying the paint needs to be a good quality - I would never use a unknown / cheap brand - it's just not worth it - you will get the results you want with a single pack acrylic - hunt yourself out a good local independent automotive paint supplier - advise them on what you are doing and what solutions they have in the way of paint ranges - if you are not overly fussy about accurate colour matching then one of their industrial ranges will suit you and these tend to be fair priced - the good thing about Land Rovers is that you can readily & easily remove the side & rear doors, bonnet etc and paint them separately rather than have to do everything in one go - critical factor though is that you have a lot of alloy panels - so ensure that you use plenty of etching primer over bare alloy - I would advise that once you are ready for paint to just paint one panel like a door to ensure that you are happy with the results / that the spray gun is applying the paint effectively & that the finish is acceptable - rather than get halfway around the vehicle and find that for whatever reason something is wrong and that you wasted a litre of paint and will have to prep & paint it again - I'm not laughing at all it's something I have done on several occasions due to space restrictions / size of vehicle / logistics etc - and have painted several racecar transporters / coaches with nothing more than a large tarp forming a tent side for protection - all to good effect - once you get into it come back to me with any further questions - Chris
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Very sound advice here that I can only echo Perfect, thank you both very much for the help! Is there a water trap you would go for over any others? Again I don’t mind spending a bit more if it is going to pay for itself in the long run.. And regarding single pack paint, is there a brand you recommend? And should I be using a primer that will prevent any reaction to the previous paint on the vehicle? I also plan to paint the engine bay, which I’m kind of dreading in terms of prep work with all the awkward access and smaller panel sizes, do you have any tips? Look at the range of separators that SprayGuns Direct offer - don't go really cheap but you don't have to spend hundreds either £50 should buy something decent - look at installing a condensing loop into the air supply from the compressor feed too - readily done just with just airline hose see here - forum.retro-rides.org/thread/207305/new-garage-build-thread?page=13 - Paint - You need a good quality known brand - hunt out a good local but independent automotive paint supplier - advise them what you are doing and see what paint range they stock - you need a single pack air drying paint - let me know what they advise / stock and I can advise further - you should be using a primer but only on your reworked / bare metal areas - most paints will go over the top of existing paints once prepped correctly - engine bays are easy - just take your time - through preparation is the key - use scotchbrite for getting into the areas that you cannot access easily with normal abrasives - use plenty of panel wipe - mask any components or areas that don't require painting carefully again plenty of panel wipe to degrease them and ensure that the masking tape sticks - take your time with the spraying - try not to overlap already painted areas has you move around the bay - several coats - 3 to 4 applied once the last coat has started to tack off is a far better method than attempting to put two heavy coats on - a light mist coat has your first coat too will help with the adhesion of the second coat - single pack takes longer to cure so you may be waiting circa 45 - 60 mins between coats - don't dread anything - just take your time - my top tip is to get your paint and just do one panel like the underside of the bonnet that way you can gain your confidence and if its not to your expectations then you can redo just the one panel again rather than have to redo a complete area or car - keep in touch with your progress and don't hesitate to plug / hassle me / us for more info - Chris
|
|
|
|
keyring
Part of things
Posts: 913
Club RR Member Number: 47
|
Body & Paint Threadkeyring
@keyring
Club Retro Rides Member 47
|
|
Perfect, thank you both very much for the help! Is there a water trap you would go for over any others? Again I don’t mind spending a bit more if it is going to pay for itself in the long run.. And regarding single pack paint, is there a brand you recommend? And should I be using a primer that will prevent any reaction to the previous paint on the vehicle? I also plan to paint the engine bay, which I’m kind of dreading in terms of prep work with all the awkward access and smaller panel sizes, do you have any tips? Look at the range of separators that SprayGuns Direct offer - don't go really cheap but you don't have to spend hundreds either £50 should buy something decent - look at installing a condensing loop into the air supply from the compressor feed too - readily done just with just airline hose see here - forum.retro-rides.org/thread/207305/new-garage-build-thread?page=13 - Paint - You need a good quality known brand - hunt out a good local but independent automotive paint supplier - advise them what you are doing and see what paint range they stock - you need a single pack air drying paint - let me know what they advise / stock and I can advise further - you should be using a primer but only on your reworked / bare metal areas - most paints will go over the top of existing paints once prepped correctly - engine bays are easy - just take your time - through preparation is the key - use scotchbrite for getting into the areas that you cannot access easily with normal abrasives - use plenty of panel wipe - mask any components or areas that don't require painting carefully again plenty of panel wipe to degrease them and ensure that the masking tape sticks - take your time with the spraying - try not to overlap already painted areas has you move around the bay - several coats - 3 to 4 applied once the last coat has started to tack off is a far better method than attempting to put two heavy coats on - a light mist coat has your first coat too will help with the adhesion of the second coat - single pack takes longer to cure so you may be waiting circa 45 - 60 mins between coats - don't dread anything - just take your time - my top tip is to get your paint and just do one panel like the underside of the bonnet that way you can gain your confidence and if its not to your expectations then you can redo just the one panel again rather than have to redo a complete area or car - keep in touch with your progress and don't hesitate to plug / hassle me / us for more info - Chris I'll have a look at them and i'll post them up before i buy, same with a gun and paint if that's ok. There is a local spray store that is highly rated, and i've used for rattle cans before so once i'm back onshore, i'll pop in and see what he says. I did see a 2k mask, but not sure what you think of it? www.alloypaints.com/gerson-2k-disposable-paint-spray-respirator-face-mask-medium-large-72-p.aspI'll definitely give it a go on the underside of the bonnet first, air drying paint, with you saying 45-60 minutes between each coat, how long does it have to be left to dry completely? Does it need a clear coat, or is it just left to fully cure and then hit it with the machine polisher? And thankyou for the offer, i'm sure i'll have plenty of questions, I really want to take the car to RRG with paint that I applied myself
|
|
|
|
|
|
Feb 19, 2019 10:59:58 GMT
|
On single pack paint, I painted my recent project using Lechler "Mac 5" paint, which was described to me as a "modern cellulose equivalent". I haven't had a great finish out of it, but then it's the first car I've painted, so I'd put more blame on me than the paint. The main problem is orange peel, and then trying to remove the tiny (and not so tiny) scratches that I put into it while flatting down the orange peel.
I bought a moisture trap from Aldi a while back, I think that was about £25 and it seems to work OK - I know I said I didn't get a great finish, but it wasn't because of moisture as far as I can tell. IIRC it's a combined oiler and moisture trap, but the two come apart so I took the oiler part off so as to not contaminate things.
I'd echo the comment about buying the biggest tank you can - I bought a 50L one because I only had one job for it, but it didn't take long before the temptation of the Aldi air tools sale meant I had all sorts of stuff for it and wish it wasn't running as much as it is. I bought a 3" polisher to get into the fiddly bits to try to fix the orange peel, and it won't run that at all with the harder foam pad on it, only the softer ones. I am limited to single phase electrics so my choice was fairly limited in any case, but I wish I'd gone for something bigger with hindsight, or that I was brave enough to have salvaged the broken compressor someone scrapped and plumbed the tank in as an extender.
|
|
|
|
|
Body & Paint Threadpeteh1969
@peteh1969
Club Retro Rides Member 107
|
Feb 19, 2019 12:01:40 GMT
|
You will all ways get Orange peal regardless of what paint you use, the way to control the degree of it is down to the quality and level of prep you do before you paint and the process you use after painting to achieve the final finish on the car.
|
|
|
|
glenanderson
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,123
Club RR Member Number: 64
|
Body & Paint Threadglenanderson
@glenanderson
Club Retro Rides Member 64
|
Feb 19, 2019 12:38:39 GMT
|
Thanks Chris. 👍
So, cheap paint (guilty), rather than me doing something stupid (other than buying cheap paint). Cool.
The Land-Rover is a patchwork quilt at the moment, some areas much worse than others. New doors will be the trigger for a complete refresh of the paint all over, but realistically I don’t think that will be this year; that’s going to be taken up with mechanical issues. The main thing is the conformation that it’s possible to get a single pack paint that lasts, provided I take a bit more care in where it comes from. Thanks. 😃
|
|
My worst worry about dying is my wife selling my stuff for what I told her it cost...
|
|
|
|
Feb 19, 2019 18:40:06 GMT
|
You will all ways get Orange peal regardless of what paint you use, the way to control the degree of it is down to the quality and level of prep you do before you paint and the process you use after painting to achieve the final finish on the car. I guess, but I was hoping that I could do the same as I see in countless videos on the net - flat it down, then polish it back up again to get a good finish. I just get a shiny surface with a lot of fine (and some not-so-fine) scratches in it. I was at one of the shows last year where they were covering orange-peel removal in one of the "tech workshops", so I hung around to have a chat with the presenters after the talk. Their response was just "oh, sounds like you should have it professionally painted", which wasn't quite as helpful as I was hoping.
|
|
|
|
|
Body & Paint Threadpeteh1969
@peteh1969
Club Retro Rides Member 107
|
Feb 19, 2019 18:59:13 GMT
|
See what grumpynorthener comes back with as he will be able to give you the best tips and advice I have never sprayed a car just these And that was with an Air Brush and it's a totally process after the prep work is done. I cannot fabricate or weld and would be terrified to paint a car so good on you for having a go, witch is why grumpynorthener is doing my Corsair.
|
|
Last Edit: Feb 19, 2019 19:00:28 GMT by peteh1969
|
|
|
|
Feb 19, 2019 20:05:19 GMT
|
Orange peel is more down to the paint viscosity and partly how you lay the paint on. Not anything to do with the prep. If you get bad orange peel then you need to thin the paint a bit more.
If you have painted the car then providing you have enough paint thickness you can block it down till smooth and then polish it up again. Failing that you block it back/scotchbrite it and lay on another coat (preferably thinned a little more) and then wet sand it & polish.
If you are getting scratches you have not got the water clean enough, use 2 buckets, one to rinse in and one to get fresh water to sand. Rinse ALL the time! and change water regularly. you can even use a hose if outside to constantly mist water on as you sand.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Feb 19, 2019 20:40:05 GMT
|
You will all ways get Orange peal regardless of what paint you use, the way to control the degree of it is down to the quality and level of prep you do before you paint and the process you use after painting to achieve the final finish on the car. I guess, but I was hoping that I could do the same as I see in countless videos on the net - flat it down, then polish it back up again to get a good finish. I just get a shiny surface with a lot of fine (and some not-so-fine) scratches in it. I was at one of the shows last year where they were covering orange-peel removal in one of the "tech workshops", so I hung around to have a chat with the presenters after the talk. Their response was just "oh, sounds like you should have it professionally painted", which wasn't quite as helpful as I was hoping. So what grade paper are using for flatting back with to start with - Has Mark states orange peel is down to the paint viscosity and how heavy / thick that you are applying it - Just looked up Lechlar Macrofan 5 which is a cellulose paint has you state but what thinners have you used ? name / brand / type please and that will give a good idea has to what is going on - what spray gun type and any ideas on what size fluid tip & needle that you fitted to it - some idea of the air pressure at the gun was would also be helpful Thanks Chris
|
|
Last Edit: Feb 19, 2019 20:43:38 GMT by Deleted
|
|
|
|
|
Feb 19, 2019 22:19:10 GMT
|
Regarding epoxy primers such as Lechler, I was under the impression that it was non isocyanate, was I wrong?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Feb 19, 2019 23:54:20 GMT
|
^^^yes.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Feb 20, 2019 11:20:04 GMT
|
And that was with an Air Brush and it's a totally process after the prep work is done. Funny you should add that about airbrushes. On the engine bay of my car, the top of the inner wing curls inwards, which makes it very difficult to get to it with a normal gun. So I bought from eBay a mini-gun, which is more like an airbrush in size than a proper spray gun, and I bought it purely because the paint cup is on the side rather than the top, so it can be used upside-down with the air pipe going up over my shoulder. But aside from that, when I've painted stuff like the window frames which are quite narrow, I've used the small gun but the right way up, and the surface is always much better. Only trouble is, it would take days to paint a car with it. So what grade paper are using for flatting back with to start with I first painted the car a panel at a time, virtually. This was mainly because I wanted paint around all the edges of doors, tailgate, bonnet and so on, and didn't feel I could get that with them all attached. I also felt that it would speed the job up, and allowed me a bit of practice as I (as someone else said) started with the inside of the bonnet for practice. When I'd done it and assembled it, I started with quite a coarse grade of paper - maybe 320 - to get the tops down quicker and then worked finer and finer. That soon became a poor finish, lots of bits I rubbed through, some bits where I hadn't flatted filler down properly (the reason I didn't want to pay someone to paint it, initially) so I decided to blow over all of it again, and after the second one I started with 600 grit. I've gone up as far as 2500, but I find that just clogs the paper almost straight away, even though the car had been painted for several months before I touched it. I did get some fine paper discs for my polisher, but I've managed to get some marks in the bonnet from the edges due to my technique, and because it clogged up almost immediately and that caused marks. - Has Mark states orange peel is down to the paint viscosity and how heavy / thick that you are applying it - Just looked up Lechlar Macrofan 5 which is a cellulose paint has you state but what thinners have you used ? name / brand / type please I would have to check on the thinners, I don't know. For the first job, I bought some thinners described as "high gloss" for the colour coats as I figured I needed as much help as I could get. The second time I did it, I used "normal" thinners and it didn't seem to make any difference to the glossiness of the paint even before I'd attacked it to get rid of the orange peel. I will check the brand - if there is one - but it's just a basic thinners from a local paint supplies shop. As for how heavy / thick I'm applying it, I can't describe it. Seems as if I'm putting it on "too" thick, but I was hoping that I could get a load of paint on and then flat it back and polish it up. what spray gun type and any ideas on what size fluid tip & needle that you fitted to it - some idea of the air pressure at the gun was would also be helpful The spray gun is a gravity-feed one that I bought used. As I recall it the nozzle has "1.5" on it, but I've no idea of the needle size or make - it's nothing special and was bought used. I have since acquired a Clarke gun which seems to be unused with a smaller number on it (I forget what) because while I was despairing over the finish I also found the spec sheet, and that talks about 1.2mm - 1.4mm. The Clarke gun has a marking within that range. As I recall it, the pressure on the gauge on the moisture trap was around 50psi, though I can't say if it was different at the gun. Thanks for your comments and interest, I'll have a look at the other stuff when I'm in the shed. The biggest problem with asking much more experienced sprayers about stuff like this is understanding the answers and, sometimes, understanding the questions. The background of the car is that I spent some time (9 years) restoring it, with a lot of panel repairs, and it's my first restoration, with a lot of assistance from TonyBMWs thread here on panel fabrication, which I'm pleased to see has similar techniques to those shown in your own restoration threads, albeit mine take a lot longer. As I touched on above, I didn't want to pay someone £1000+ to stick paint on it and find that some of my repairs are still visible, then have to fix them and pay again, so I figured I'd paint it myself. That turned out to be wise by default, because I had some rectification to do, and one of the reasons for the second respray was because I wasn't able to blend the new paint into the first job. In theory there is quite a lot of paint on there now, but of course a lot of it has been removed. The bottom half of the drivers door looks great, it's just the rest of it now.
|
|
Last Edit: Feb 20, 2019 11:23:41 GMT by droopsnoot
|
|
|
|
Feb 20, 2019 12:12:17 GMT
|
And that was with an Air Brush and it's a totally process after the prep work is done. Funny you should add that about airbrushes. On the engine bay of my car, the top of the inner wing curls inwards, which makes it very difficult to get to it with a normal gun. So I bought from eBay a mini-gun, which is more like an airbrush in size than a proper spray gun, and I bought it purely because the paint cup is on the side rather than the top, so it can be used upside-down with the air pipe going up over my shoulder. But aside from that, when I've painted stuff like the window frames which are quite narrow, I've used the small gun but the right way up, and the surface is always much better. Only trouble is, it would take days to paint a car with it. So what grade paper are using for flatting back with to start with I first painted the car a panel at a time, virtually. This was mainly because I wanted paint around all the edges of doors, tailgate, bonnet and so on, and didn't feel I could get that with them all attached. I also felt that it would speed the job up, and allowed me a bit of practice as I (as someone else said) started with the inside of the bonnet for practice. When I'd done it and assembled it, I started with quite a coarse grade of paper - maybe 320 - to get the tops down quicker and then worked finer and finer. That soon became a poor finish, lots of bits I rubbed through, some bits where I hadn't flatted filler down properly (the reason I didn't want to pay someone to paint it, initially) so I decided to blow over all of it again, and after the second one I started with 600 grit. I've gone up as far as 2500, but I find that just clogs the paper almost straight away, even though the car had been painted for several months before I touched it. I did get some fine paper discs for my polisher, but I've managed to get some marks in the bonnet from the edges due to my technique, and because it clogged up almost immediately and that caused marks. Ok - way too course a grade to start flatting paint back with - you need to be back at 800's lightly - then work through to 1200 - 1800 prior to a good compound polish - if your paper is clogging try a bar of household soap rubbed on to the paper or panel to lubricate the flatting process - but the main reason for you still being able to view scratches through your paint is that you have started with too course of a grade for flatting paintwork back with - Has Mark states orange peel is down to the paint viscosity and how heavy / thick that you are applying it - Just looked up Lechlar Macrofan 5 which is a cellulose paint has you state but what thinners have you used ? name / brand / type please I would have to check on the thinners, I don't know. For the first job, I bought some thinners described as "high gloss" for the colour coats as I figured I needed as much help as I could get. The second time I did it, I used "normal" thinners and it didn't seem to make any difference to the glossiness of the paint even before I'd attacked it to get rid of the orange peel. I will check the brand - if there is one - but it's just a basic thinners from a local paint supplies shop. As for how heavy / thick I'm applying it, I can't describe it. Seems as if I'm putting it on "too" thick, but I was hoping that I could get a load of paint on and then flat it back and polish it up. The quality of your paint is fine but I would question the quality of your thinners - only use a high quality - high specification - high gloss thinners for cellulose paint finishes - low quality high gloss thinners or normal / standard thinners will just not cut the mustard and is more than likely the significant reason behind the lack of a decent finish that you have been unable to achieve what spray gun type and any ideas on what size fluid tip & needle that you fitted to it - some idea of the air pressure at the gun was would also be helpful The spray gun is a gravity-feed one that I bought used. As I recall it the nozzle has "1.5" on it, but I've no idea of the needle size or make - it's nothing special and was bought used. I have since acquired a Clarke gun which seems to be unused with a smaller number on it (I forget what) because while I was despairing over the finish I also found the spec sheet, and that talks about 1.2mm - 1.4mm. The Clarke gun has a marking within that range. As I recall it, the pressure on the gauge on the moisture trap was around 50psi, though I can't say if it was different at the gun. You need a fluid tip & needle size of 1.4 / 1.5 for a cellulose paint finish - 1.2 and you will be struggling - my guess is that if you have gravity feed gun it will be of a HVLP specification - (the majority are) - HVLP denotes High Volume Low Pressure - if your gauge pressure was set at 50 PSI you are going to have close to that at the gun - way too much pressure for a gravity feed gun and probably explains one of the reasons for your orange peel / below par finish - HVLP guns are quite happy in the sub 25 PSI range - so at 40-50 PSI you will have had lots of overspray and the paint going on too heavy all adds up to the factors of the finish achieved that you describe Thanks for your comments and interest, I'll have a look at the other stuff when I'm in the shed. The biggest problem with asking much more experienced sprayers about stuff like this is understanding the answers and, sometimes, understanding the questions. I hope that I have explained it in a straight forward / layman's terms method - there are several small & easy changes that you can make readily that will start to give you the all the right results even with the most basic of kit / setup - let me know of anything that you don't understand / require conformation of / or want further help / information on - Chris The background of the car is that I spent some time (9 years) restoring it, with a lot of panel repairs, and it's my first restoration, with a lot of assistance from TonyBMWs thread here on panel fabrication, which I'm pleased to see has similar techniques to those shown in your own restoration threads, albeit mine take a lot longer. As I touched on above, I didn't want to pay someone £1000+ to stick paint on it and find that some of my repairs are still visible, then have to fix them and pay again, so I figured I'd paint it myself. That turned out to be wise by default, because I had some rectification to do, and one of the reasons for the second respray was because I wasn't able to blend the new paint into the first job. In theory there is quite a lot of paint on there now, but of course a lot of it has been removed. The bottom half of the drivers door looks great, it's just the rest of it now.
|
|
Last Edit: Feb 20, 2019 12:15:59 GMT by Deleted
|
|
|
|
Feb 20, 2019 12:53:01 GMT
|
Thanks for that Chris, some food for thought. I'm planning "over winter" (except it's now nearly March!) to get the bonnet off and re-do that, starting with the inside, so I will take that on board and see what goes on. No doubt I'll be back with more questions.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Feb 20, 2019 14:02:09 GMT
|
Just to add to Chris's comments, wow! 320 grit! that's filler sanding grade I usually start with 1000 or 1200 unless you have bad orange peel, then the 800 (lightly done) may be used. You say your paper clogs up - you ARE sanding it wet aren't you? Also are you hand sanding or block sanding? I use stiff foam blocks to sand, soft enough to not have edges but stiff enough to sand flat. If hand sanding (not recommended unless awkward areas) then ONLY use your palm of your hand to sand, never you fingers as these will leave finger grooves in the paint. And use LOADS of water - it's a good lubricant and also washes away any paint debris that can also cause scratches. Wipe the panel down with a clean wet soft cloth regularly to remove debris as well and to see how flat you are getting the paint, no point in oversanding.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Feb 20, 2019 17:08:30 GMT
|
Look at the range of separators that SprayGuns Direct offer - don't go really cheap but you don't have to spend hundreds either £50 should buy something decent - look at installing a condensing loop into the air supply from the compressor feed too - readily done just with just airline hose see here - forum.retro-rides.org/thread/207305/new-garage-build-thread?page=13 - Paint - You need a good quality known brand - hunt out a good local but independent automotive paint supplier - advise them what you are doing and see what paint range they stock - you need a single pack air drying paint - let me know what they advise / stock and I can advise further - you should be using a primer but only on your reworked / bare metal areas - most paints will go over the top of existing paints once prepped correctly - engine bays are easy - just take your time - through preparation is the key - use scotchbrite for getting into the areas that you cannot access easily with normal abrasives - use plenty of panel wipe - mask any components or areas that don't require painting carefully again plenty of panel wipe to degrease them and ensure that the masking tape sticks - take your time with the spraying - try not to overlap already painted areas has you move around the bay - several coats - 3 to 4 applied once the last coat has started to tack off is a far better method than attempting to put two heavy coats on - a light mist coat has your first coat too will help with the adhesion of the second coat - single pack takes longer to cure so you may be waiting circa 45 - 60 mins between coats - don't dread anything - just take your time - my top tip is to get your paint and just do one panel like the underside of the bonnet that way you can gain your confidence and if its not to your expectations then you can redo just the one panel again rather than have to redo a complete area or car - keep in touch with your progress and don't hesitate to plug / hassle me / us for more info - Chris I'll have a look at them and i'll post them up before i buy, same with a gun and paint if that's ok. There is a local spray store that is highly rated, and i've used for rattle cans before so once i'm back onshore, i'll pop in and see what he says. I did see a 2k mask, but not sure what you think of it? www.alloypaints.com/gerson-2k-disposable-paint-spray-respirator-face-mask-medium-large-72-p.aspI'll definitely give it a go on the underside of the bonnet first, air drying paint, with you saying 45-60 minutes between each coat, how long does it have to be left to dry completely? Does it need a clear coat, or is it just left to fully cure and then hit it with the machine polisher? And thankyou for the offer, i'm sure i'll have plenty of questions, I really want to take the car to RRG with paint that I applied myself Apologies there is still some of your questions unanswered here - single pack air drying acrylic - several days to dry / fully cure has a minimum - either in a hidden place or paint a small piece of a scrap panel / steel sheet with the same number coats of paint has you do the car - try leaving a thumb print in the paint if you cant then try pushing your thumb nail into the paint to see if the paint is still soft it will readily mark if so - if it does not mark readily then it's a good indicator that the paint is cured enough to start flatting back for polish It should be a good finish without clear coating - but you are planning a solid non metallic colour ?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Feb 20, 2019 18:35:47 GMT
|
Just to add to Chris's comments, wow! 320 grit! that's filler sanding grade I usually start with 1000 or 1200 unless you have bad orange peel, then the 800 (lightly done) may be used. You say your paper clogs up - you ARE sanding it wet aren't you? Also are you hand sanding or block sanding? I use stiff foam blocks to sand, soft enough to not have edges but stiff enough to sand flat. If hand sanding (not recommended unless awkward areas) then ONLY use your palm of your hand to sand, never you fingers as these will leave finger grooves in the paint. And use LOADS of water - it's a good lubricant and also washes away any paint debris that can also cause scratches. Wipe the panel down with a clean wet soft cloth regularly to remove debris as well and to see how flat you are getting the paint, no point in oversanding. Yes, I was sanding it wet (though it was with a single bucket), with a little washing-up liquid in the water to help lubricate things. I was using a mixture of things to hold the paper - a "proper" foam-covered sanding block (one of those you clip the paper in either end), a cork block, and a selection of different shaped bits of foam where a flat block wasn't appropriate. I think these latter were pipe insulation originally, but some bits of the body have a curved profile - around the wheelarches, for eaxmple. I figured using something coarse would quickly drop the worst down and then allow me to gradually go better and take out the scratches, like I see people on Youtube doing. The trouble with starting off at 1000 is that it just takes ages (hours if not days) to get the higher peaks down anywhere near flat on a small area, and I just got too easily demoralised with the job as I had the entire car to do. I'm more calm about it now because I haven't really touched the paint since last spring.
|
|
Last Edit: Feb 20, 2019 18:36:45 GMT by droopsnoot
|
|
|
|
Feb 20, 2019 18:40:32 GMT
|
Just to add to Chris's comments, wow! 320 grit! that's filler sanding grade I usually start with 1000 or 1200 unless you have bad orange peel, then the 800 (lightly done) may be used. You say your paper clogs up - you ARE sanding it wet aren't you? Also are you hand sanding or block sanding? I use stiff foam blocks to sand, soft enough to not have edges but stiff enough to sand flat. If hand sanding (not recommended unless awkward areas) then ONLY use your palm of your hand to sand, never you fingers as these will leave finger grooves in the paint. And use LOADS of water - it's a good lubricant and also washes away any paint debris that can also cause scratches. Wipe the panel down with a clean wet soft cloth regularly to remove debris as well and to see how flat you are getting the paint, no point in oversanding. Yes, I was sanding it wet (though it was with a single bucket), with a little washing-up liquid in the water to help lubricate things. I was using a mixture of things to hold the paper - a "proper" foam-covered sanding block (one of those you clip the paper in either end), a cork block, and a selection of different shaped bits of foam where a flat block wasn't appropriate. I think these latter were pipe insulation originally, but some bits of the body have a curved profile - around the wheelarches, for eaxmple. I figured using something coarse would quickly drop the worst down and then allow me to gradually go better and take out the scratches, like I see people on Youtube doing. The trouble with starting off at 1000 is that it just takes ages (hours if not days) to get the higher peaks down anywhere near flat on a small area, and I just got too easily demoralised with the job as I had the entire car to do. I'm more calm about it now because I haven't really touched the paint since last spring. If the finish is that bad then the pointers in my previous postings should help you achieve a lot better finish which should not need anything like the work that you have had to put into your previous paint finishes
|
|
Last Edit: Feb 20, 2019 20:38:04 GMT by Deleted
|
|
|
|
Feb 20, 2019 19:53:27 GMT
|
Over on the mig welding forum several people have stated that although Lechler epoxy primer is two component it is not isocyanate, I guess the only way to know for sure is to obtain the data sheets, I like the idea or a water resistant primer but I am not going to take any silly risks.
|
|
|
|
|