Tell me about Vauxhall Red Top Engines

It's got a red top?






Sorry. I'll get my coat.......

You can use a manta 1.8 gearbox on them, for carbs you idealy need the earlier engine with dizzy rather than the later one without (forget the name) although you can using some kind of engine management, megasquirt etc. The dizzy does come out the back in RWD configuration which can make fitting harder.

The Redtop is a good engine with a strong bottom end based almost exclusively on the 8v GM "familyII" 2.0 block, in fact by fitting redtop pistons you can then fit a Redtop head to an 8v motor and it will work. Only the Redtop Turbo had a significantly stronger crank and rods. Found in list above is more or less correct though Astra MkIII GSi also had it.
Since there was NO factory RWD app for the motor, there are one or two problems but gearboxes are not one of them. The Manta box fits but is rare, however the Carlton 2.0 box and the Omega Box also bolt straight on (Except Omega 2.5 diesel)
The more desireable (for it's COSCAST head) early model will give you problems fitting the distributor on a RWD app but really there is not much difference. All Redtops are 150bhp in standard tune and will make a reliable 200 NA without too much money spent, whether injected or carbed. And as many as you want if turbo'd, but it's best to start with a C20LET motor rather than C20XE or X20XE if you're going Turbo.
I know of at least 3 Dolomite type cars with Redtops in them and a couple of sacriligous MkII Escorts plus endless other less well known and kit cars.
The reason I only have the 8v in my Toledo is one of the problems with the Redtop. Because there is no RWD app for the engine, there is no 4 branch exhaust manifold for it. Add in a non standard car and you are into a bespoke manifold, made up to fit the car, at about £6-700.
Drop me a PM if you want more details on how to make one fit.

Steve

I have a c20xe in my mk2 Escort, 7 degree tilt with Turbo, running about 300 bhp, that's without touching the cams, behind it sits the very strong v6 Omega 5 speed manual Gearbox from the V6 Model good for 500Bhp, don't even think about a type 9 Ford box, they are only good for around 180/200 but not for long!
Further back is a £2,500 Atlas axle, if yo are going up in horsepower torque etc... you don't need a weak link,
if i play with the cams, i reckon i should push it from 300 to around 330+

Solid engines, just keep the oil changes regular and i was told the water pumps can be a pain, but hey... I have yet to experience this......
if you do decide on the Omega Box, i have one, but... no gearstick or linkage, but you will need a bias pedal box of sorts.
good luck and keep us all posted.

The transverse motors have a rear well sump arangement. if this doesn't suit your car (it doesn't on the Dolomite range) then a Carlton sump will, this has the well at the front of the engine!

Steve

Carbs or injection? And dizzy v electronic!

Don't be scared of the original system it may look complex, but the loom from a GSi Cav will leave you needing precisely 5 wires connecting into your car to make it run! This includes all management, ignition and injection! The Bosch Motronic is utterly reliable and the ECU can be remapped fairly easily or can even be given a programmable map.

No room for the dizzy? a megajolt/emerald and Carbs on a later motor is fine, Boggs Bros do a bike carb manifold and there are several choices for Webers/Dellortos.

Personally I prefer the injection,It means i'm not constantly tinkering to get it right and can get on with the business of hooning it around!

Steve

I have a couple of friends that have XE engines in their Fords - both with Turbos fitted. One is approx 550bhp without NOS and the other is around 750hp without NOS. First one runs 10's and the other runs low 8's on the 1/4!

just to correct a few of the previous replies, the C20LET (turbo) doesn't have a "significantly stronger crank and rods", the C20LET and C20XE are internally identical apart from pistons and cams

there are no historic issues with headgasket failures. people might be confusing "porosity", this is where GM took back casting duties on the cylinder heads (kolben schmidt in actual fact) from cosworth. there were quality control issues with their casting process, alloy was more brittle and castings very thin between coolant gallery above the pistons and nearby oil gallery for the cams. when the centre head bolts were tightened you sometimes got a hair line fracture allowing oil and water mixing. most will have been sleeve repaired or simply not affected.

you also could not just plop some 16v pistons in an 8valve, the 20XE rods are much stronger than 8valve versions, and 20XE pistons were forged and have requisite cutouts for valve clearance. there is also a small oil restrictor at the back of the 20XE block which is not present the 8v. the 8v crank has only 6 bolt flywheel, and is smaller, so already on the back foot for upgrades ( all irrelevant really, nobody would be mad enough to try and 16v convert an 8v engine)

yes earlier 20XE had a distributor, but it had very advanced (at the time) 3D motronic engine management, so will not run a set of carbs. however mk2 cavalier distributor (16SH engine) with its hall sensor, ignition module and coil bolts straight on. aftermarket versions are also available, but as mentioned it will be pointing at the bulkhead in RWD, so would be easier to go to distributorless 2D ignition setup. the other alternative is a later 20XE which used a coil pack, distributor blanked off. easier for packaging and keeps fuel injection manners

20XE were fitted into caterhams in RWD layout, adapted to ford box from memory. SBD sell rear wheel drive 20XE manifold but would still need adapting, vehicle dependant

aftermarket tuning parts are still available, and therefore so are carbs and matching inlet manifolds (SBD and QED). mk2 astras are also now edging into historic rallying elegibility, so aftermarket support is actually increasing !

cheapest route to a running 20XE would be a MOT fail cav gsi or calibra.

I think alot of the vauxhall boys use the Saab b204 engine these days as easier to get hold of than the vauxhall redtops and i think they have the same castings as a vauxhall bottom end but not sure but someone on here should know.