uncle silvia
Posted a lot
Datsun Club UK - Devon & Cornwall Rep
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May 11, 2011 13:06:09 GMT
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We have all seen "THAT" drifting diesel Merc estate and I'm sure various other diesel tanks that have been tuned to the hilts with massive blowers etc........ But what really is the potential of actually tuning these oil burners, what mods do they need for "reasonable" power hikes and how easy are they to do?? I know modern diesels u just wack a chip on it and u get 1 million torques, but what about the older lumps? Just thinking about some cheap power potential with reasonable running costs?? Any advice??   |
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1981 KE70 Corolla - 1978 B310 Sunny Coupe - 1977 Pink Clubman Mini Shorty |
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bdtd
Part of things
Foundered and Frozen.
Posts: 159 
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May 11, 2011 15:06:48 GMT
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Get the head ported and polished, then big turbo, big intercooler, tuned pump, bigger injectors decent intake and exhaust manifolds.
The 2.8 in my trooper came from the factory with 85bhp in 96. With a tiny bit of fettling I have it now at 117bhp with loads more to come.
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Last Edit: May 11, 2011 15:08:32 GMT by bdtd
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Potter
Part of things
'E who dares wins,eh Rodders??!
Posts: 304
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May 11, 2011 15:21:50 GMT
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Not really an expert but the Malta boys love their dervs so loadsa smokey whistley whooshy diesels here!
Mate has a Daewoo Cielo with a 1.7 Izusu TD lump and it's fecking fast!
Same bloke had,back in the day, a Mk1 Escort four door with a 1.5 BMC diesel,turbo'd and backed by a 5 speed Sierra box.
Morfe boost and more fuel seems to be the recipe
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More cars than sense or money!🙄
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uncle silvia
Posted a lot
Datsun Club UK - Devon & Cornwall Rep
Posts: 1,483
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May 11, 2011 22:37:33 GMT
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Cool cheers guys............... getting me thinking!!!
I'm thinking potentially one of the indestructible Volvos or Mercs as a base!!
does anyone have any websites i can look at about Derv tuning??
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1981 KE70 Corolla - 1978 B310 Sunny Coupe - 1977 Pink Clubman Mini Shorty
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JamieS
Part of things
Posts: 115
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May 11, 2011 22:41:28 GMT
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mechanical tds are more fun.. vnt and high pressure fuel pumps are all well and good but there nothing like the kick in the back reward you get for waiting for the lag of an wastegated cow eater on an old smokey mechanical  Its because of this I'm moving from a volvo 850 tdi back to a 306 dturbo when funds allow  For RWD your on the right lines.. mercs are hard because they never did a td manual to my knowlage which means you have to take a standard diesel 190e and drop the 300td engine in. Volvo did the 740 td which is rwd and proberbly your best bet down that route.. BMW did a few variants of 6 cylinder 3series tds If its handling and hot hatch beating your after theres a few options in the FWD neck of the woods When it comes to diesel tuning its worth looking at all marques club sites as each marque brings different tuning ideas and parts. |
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Last Edit: May 11, 2011 22:45:36 GMT by JamieS
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THE_Liam
Yorkshire and The Humber
If at first you don't succeed... HAMMERS.
Posts: 1,363
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May 11, 2011 23:02:37 GMT
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Get yourself something with an XUD series PSA engine. they come in 1.8, 1.9 and 2.1 sizes with or without turbos, so think Peugeot 205, 306, 405, 406, Citroen BX, ZX, XM, Xantia and Xsara... I've had a few 306 D-Turbos which come with the 1.9 TD version. 92 bhp factory, with a tweak of the wastegate and fuel pump that can be 110 bhp FOR FREE! My last one had a modded Bosch fuel pump (a hybrid I built myself with the 11mm head from a Transit pump) and a big front mounted intercooler. With a de-cat it dyno'ed 141 bhp and 230 ft lbs of torque, and cost about 200 quid to build to that spec  Best bit is, the Bosch pumps can handle SVO, so I was running it for 80p a litre too |
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May 11, 2011 23:07:12 GMT
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how are the old izusu lumps to tune? the ones out of the old astra's and stuff? Thinking of putting one in my mini in the next few months and was just wondering how hard they are to tune |
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Nobody dies a virgin, because lifes curse word us ALL
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May 11, 2011 23:08:02 GMT
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Was thinking of chucking a 1.7 turbodiesel from an Astra or Vectra into a 1972 rekord i have, but i don't know how it`d work in a big old barge. Maybe a 2.0 dti would be better, i know of one thats going for about 600 quid....
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May 11, 2011 23:10:47 GMT
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Cool cheers guys............... getting me thinking!!! I'm thinking potentially one of the indestructible Volvos or Mercs as a base!! does anyone have any websites I can look at about Derv tuning?? The Volvo diesels (a 6 cylinder VAG engine, the same as the one used in the LT trucks) aren't indestructible at all, in fact, while the bottom end may be quite sturdy, the cylinder heads are very prone to cracking and warping. |
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194? Willys Jeep MB 1965 Volvo 544 Special 1968 Opel Rekord 1975 Opel Kadett Estate 1985 Mercedes-Benz 230E 1985 Datsun 720 King Cab 4x4 diesel 1997 Volvo S70 2.5SE (ex. "Volvo544special65" - changed to more reader friendly username.  ) |
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uncle silvia
Posted a lot
Datsun Club UK - Devon & Cornwall Rep
Posts: 1,483
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Cool cheers guys............... getting me thinking!!! I'm thinking potentially one of the indestructible Volvos or Mercs as a base!! does anyone have any websites I can look at about Derv tuning?? The Volvo diesels (a 6 cylinder VAG engine, the same as the one used in the LT trucks) aren't indestructible at all, in fact, while the bottom end may be quite sturdy, the cylinder heads are very prone to cracking and warping. Hmmmmm how bad are these?? I was really considering one being a meaty 6cyl!! I wouldn't be going silly with tuning, just a little extra poke!! |
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1981 KE70 Corolla - 1978 B310 Sunny Coupe - 1977 Pink Clubman Mini Shorty
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qwerty
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,410
Club RR Member Number: 52
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Retro Diesel Tuning?!?!qwerty
@qwerty
Club Retro Rides Member 52
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Remember that "that" Merc Estate has a Modern Diesel engine.
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THE_Liam
Yorkshire and The Humber
If at first you don't succeed... HAMMERS.
Posts: 1,363
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Hmmmmm how bad are these?? I was really considering one being a meaty 6cyl!! I wouldn't be going silly with tuning, just a little extra poke!! If you want a 6 cylinder diesel, I'd recommend a BMW M51 engine as fitted to the E36 3-Series, E34 5-Series and Range Rover  The intercooled version is 143 bhp as standard, but with a chip and a de-cat you can get around 180 bhp. They sound nice for a diesel and their very refined and smooth. I've always fancied finding a nice 525 TDS and sticking some Alpina bits on it |
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uncle silvia
Posted a lot
Datsun Club UK - Devon & Cornwall Rep
Posts: 1,483
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Trouble is around where I live there are BMWs everywhere and as usual I'd like to do something a little different!!
Ideally I'd love a big J diesel saloon but they are few and far between, so the next best interesting and different thing would be a slammed old Merc or Volvo lol
Surely if I get the cooling right on the Volvo with maybe a massive intercooler and oil coolers then it should prolong it's life maybe???
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1981 KE70 Corolla - 1978 B310 Sunny Coupe - 1977 Pink Clubman Mini Shorty
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THE_Liam
Yorkshire and The Humber
If at first you don't succeed... HAMMERS.
Posts: 1,363
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Trouble is around where I live there are BMWs everywhere and as usual I'd like to do something a little different!! Ideally I'd love a big J diesel saloon but they are few and far between, so the next best interesting and different thing would be a slammed old Merc or Volvo lol Is it just me or are there very few old diesel J-cars? I know a lad who put an M51 in an E28 M5 rep, that was just full of win |
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bortaf
Posted a lot
Posts: 4,549
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May 12, 2011 11:48:08 GMT
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try here www.tdocuk.com/index.phpthere a real good tuning thread on the lucas pumps although bosch are stronger and more SVO friendly there also a good thread on additives and loads of pug tuning pumps can be a black art but have a GOOD read before gettibng stuck in and theer loads you can do, oversixed pump heads injectors on and off boost tweaks, larger turbos ect ect |
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R.I.P photobucket
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May 12, 2011 12:21:31 GMT
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how are the old izusu lumps to tune? the ones out of the old astra's and stuff? Thinking of putting one in my mini in the next few months and was just wondering how hard they are to tune easy peasy, and very very rewarding!! google it, theres a website that gives you step by step instructions on how to tweak the pump etc...... Can be made really quite fast with very very little cash if youve got a bit of savvy..... its my second favourite td lump, after the perkins 2.0 fitted into maestros and montegos........ although the real irony is, ive never experienced one in a car!! make very very good boat engines though!! |
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Current fleet:
'58 A35 (half mine)
'67 11 window splitscreen vw (half mine)
'77 mini 1000 (not quite 1000 any more!!)
'86 Armstrong MT500
'89 XR4X4
'94 Corrado VR6
Some sort of sevenesque kit car (no age yet!!)
'01 Mondeo estate 2.0 (engine eventually destined for kit car!) - scrapped, engine only left!
'98 E300 estate, rusty but seemingly reliable, fast-ish tat hauler. eventual engine donor
A35 van, or whats left of it after it lived in a field for many years
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Colonelk
Posted a lot
Posts: 3,740
Club RR Member Number: 83
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Retro Diesel Tuning?!?!Colonelk
@colonelk
Club Retro Rides Member 83
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May 12, 2011 13:31:49 GMT
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As far as I can tell, the limits are.... How much fuel can the pump pump? (how big is the pump head etc) How much boost can your headgasket / engine / turbo take? I know the Isuzu 1.7 lumps as found in cavs and some astras (don't mistake it for the GM diesel!) can go from 85(?)bhp to about 115-120bhp with just boost and more fuel. Apparently (Ive been told, yet to play with mine yet) the limit is the turbo as it doesnt really like doing more than 1.2 bar for any period of time. Obviously the better it breathes the less you have to strain the turbo There was a lad who put Nitrous through his and IIRC he bent a rod at around 220-250bhp (god knows how much torque though!) This is all info gleened from the web, no real life experience...... yet No worried about too lean though, or too rich (unless bore washing) just make sure the EGT doesnt melt anything and its happy days! |
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Last Edit: May 12, 2011 13:33:02 GMT by Colonelk
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May 12, 2011 13:34:14 GMT
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Its because of this I'm moving from a volvo 850 tdi back to a 306 dturbo when funds allow What is the Engine in the 850tdi? I'm considering a Pre D5 V70 or S70 Diesel as I need a bigger car for towing than my Sierra. How are the 850s? |
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Last Edit: May 12, 2011 13:34:28 GMT by Deleted
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May 12, 2011 13:59:54 GMT
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In PPC they have an article about tunning the VAG 1.9 TDI motor 90/110hp up 200+ hp. One of these would be good. Bigger turbo's and uprating the fuel pump seems to be the recipe. The details will depend on the engine and what you want to achieve. Porting the head is what you do if you are going for max power.
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May 12, 2011 14:24:06 GMT
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When i used to work on the astra vans (x17dtl engine) i adjusted the pump on my company one and it would spin the wheels in 1st, 2nd and 3rd, if it was wet 4th aswell. Top end was no better and the "pull" never lasted any longer, it just redlined instantly. Great fun and raised a few eyebrows when someone borrowed it though lol.
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