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Jan 31, 2011 17:56:02 GMT
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Say I want to convert a mk2 GTi to 5 stud, and I've got a mk3 Gti in front of me. I'm assuming can just stick the mk3 5 stud (285mm disks) hub carriers on the front, and the stub axles and rear disks/hubs on the back? I'm making the assumption (perhaps wrong) that the suspension on mk2/mk3s is basically identical? I'm feeling this kind of thing: ![](http://image.automotive.com/f/images/9203347+pheader/160_0609_et_01z+1990_volkswagen_golf_gti+front_right_view.jpg) ta!
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CIH
Posted a lot
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Jan 31, 2011 20:34:58 GMT
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Possibily if you swap over hubs, arms and possibily struts ? That's what I'm doing with my S12 Silvia, incidentally. Picked-up my S14 hubs today. ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png)
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Jan 31, 2011 20:39:41 GMT
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There are a number of ways to do it using various combinations of parts. Easiest is the way you have said, but it depends on which mk2 you have and which mk3 you get the brakes off. I think the rear disks are all that need changing on the rear. Best bet is to have a search on clubgti.com www.clubgti.com/forum/showthread.php?t=220814 is a good start
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Dez
Club Retro Rides Member
And I won't sit down. And I won't shut up. And most of all I will not grow up.
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Club RR Member Number: 34
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Mk3 golf hubs on mk2?Dez
@dez
Club Retro Rides Member 34
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Jan 31, 2011 20:42:04 GMT
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no.
a mk2 is narrow track. a mk3 gti is wide track. basically 4 stud= narrow, 5 stud=wide. the exception is that 4 stud passats are wide track but with the smaller 4 stud hubs/outer driveshaft/balljoints. these parts are not compatable- hubs different, different lower balljoint, different wheel bearings with different size driveshaft splines, different offset disc, etc.
as a minimum you need to swap wishbones, balljoints, uprights/hubs, driveshafts, discs and calipers. itll be about 1-1/4" wider each side then.
you can just swap the rear end bits over, the spindle is held onto the beam with 4 bolts, but the rear beams are obviously different widths between wide/narrow track which depending on your wheels might look a bit daft- if they're staggered they might look ok, as its handy for putting way too wide rims on the back of mk3s by using a narrow track subframe.
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Jan 31, 2011 22:27:38 GMT
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no. a mk2 is narrow track. a mk3 gti is wide track. basically 4 stud= narrow, 5 stud=wide. the exception is that 4 stud passats are wide track but with the smaller 4 stud hubs/outer driveshaft/balljoints. these parts are not compatable- hubs different, different lower balljoint, different wheel bearings with different size driveshaft splines, different offset disc, etc. as a minimum you need to swap wishbones, balljoints, uprights/hubs, driveshafts, discs and calipers. itll be about 1-1/4" wider each side then. you can just swap the rear end bits over, the spindle is held onto the beam with 4 bolts, but the rear beams are obviously different widths between wide/narrow track which depending on your wheels might look a bit daft- if they're staggered they might look ok, as its handy for putting way too wide rims on the back of mk3s by using a narrow track subframe. Cheers Dez - I'm planning TT comps or something similarly large, but could probably do without any track widening, really. So basically I can't just slam the front hubs onto my wishbones, slot my shafts in and keep the same track and roll? curse word. When taking the engine out of we just cut the driveshafts because it was cold and some idiot had been at all the inner bolts and rounded them off. I have the outer CV joints if they are any help? Could I press the 5 stud hubs into the 4 stud bearings? I don't have etka to check the sizes anymore.
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ims
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Posts: 1,055
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Jan 31, 2011 23:00:09 GMT
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my memory is curse word but if you want to use etka just bob to my yard anytime (tx first i curse word off to stuff my face a lot), last time i did 5 stud on a mk2 it was the way dez mentions on a vr conversion
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1993 Rs2o0o
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Dez
Club Retro Rides Member
And I won't sit down. And I won't shut up. And most of all I will not grow up.
Posts: 11,715
Club RR Member Number: 34
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Mk3 golf hubs on mk2?Dez
@dez
Club Retro Rides Member 34
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Jan 31, 2011 23:16:58 GMT
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nah, the front hubs don't go onto the wishbones cos the balljoint is a different size, but you cant swap the balljoints over as they bolt up to the wishbones differently. its has been done by use of various adapters, machining and cut and shut bits, but its a lot of dicking around, plus I think the geometry of the steering arm on the upright is a bit different too so it gives squffy handling.
from memory, you can swap over inner CVs between shafts, but not outers- so long shafts are essentially tied to big CVs and therefore 5 stud hubs, and its possible to go wide or narrow with 4s using the previously mentioned passat setup) I think inner CVs come in 100mm and 108mm sizes. generally if youre doing it you want to keep each respective wishbone with its associated driveshaft too so theres no issues length wise there as ive seen people get em mixed up and fit too long shaft, and it breaks stuff- lots of stuff.
the hubs/bearings/uprights are not interchangable at all, so you cant put 5 stud hubs into 4 stud bearings/uprights.
also, you cant just drill your 4 stud hubs to 5 stud and fit the bigger brakes- the disc offset is different, but the wrong way- the 'hat' is taller on the 4 stud ones so you cant space your way around it.
I have a full set of mk3 gti kit in boxes here including 288mm brakes if you are going to do it- ive got some uncut driveshafts if you need em.
the two options are basically- go wide, with 5 stud and bigger brakes. or if youre not bothered about the bigger brakes, jsut buy a pair of adapters. itll obviously be a bit wider, but not as wide as the above option. you can then just chuck your 5 stud discs on the back which is a half hour job.
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Last Edit: Jan 31, 2011 23:21:40 GMT by Dez
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You can press 5 stud hubs into late 4 stud carriers and then use early passat vr6 5 stud disk, but they are only available from vw and are about £40 + VAT each, with the right callipers and carriers. Its all in the link I posted ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/wink.png)
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You can press 5 stud hubs into late 4 stud carriers and then use early passat vr6 5 stud disk, but they are only available from vw and are about £40 + VAT each, with the right callipers and carriers. Its all in the link I posted ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/wink.png) Thanks for that link, I missed your first post! It's a lot to take in because it seems to be focused on wide tracking rather than going to 5 stud (I'd rather keep the narrow track and just bump things out with spacers or wide wheels!) So, my late mk2 hub carriers will take the early mk3 hubs, like you say, although GSF list different wheel bearings. Is the "offset" of the hub the same as the 4 stud hub? - If so, I'm happy to redrill my existing disks and stick with 239mm brakes (Or mk5 polo 1.0 disks look like they are close enough to fit, 2mm narrower and 1mm out on the offset but otherwise the same, but in 5 stud) Oh, interestingly (or not), brakepart list the same disk for an early? (92) passat VR6 as for a mk3 golf GTi with girling calipers - 280mm dia, 22mm thick and 28.2mm overall height, at £17 each)
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Couldnt you just use adaptors?
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Couldnt you just use adaptors? I could, but they are a: £90 a pair b: 15mm thick My mate is about to send a mk3 gti over the bridge, so if the stuff swaps over I can convert it for free/cheaper without losing 15mm of arch clearance ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png)
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Offset wise they would still just fit being 7.5J and et32 ( minus the 15 making a final offset of et17) and the right tyres , but i see your point on wanting to save nearly 200 notes.
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Offset wise they would still just fit being 7.5J and et32 ( minus the 15 making a final offset of et17) and the right tyres , but I see your point on wanting to save nearly 200 notes. I don't think they would go on with the adaptors - I've got 14x8 et20 wheels on now and the rim itself sits outside the arch - TT comps with 15mm adapters will only sit 3mm further in but will me 3" bigger diameter: ![](http://www.willtheyfit.com/wheelimage.php?tyrediameter=595.8&tyrewidth=205&wheelwidth=190.5&wheeldia=431.8&offset=17&poke=78.25&inset=112.25&aspect=40&tyrediameter2=531.1&tyrewidth2=195&wheelwidth2=203.2&wheeldia2=355.6&offset2=20&poke2=81.6&inset2=121.6&aspect2=45&.jpg) Even with 165/35/17s I think the rim itself would foul ;D Ideally I want to run 195/40/17s or even 205/40/17s. That way I'll be able to get the car up my drive again!
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Last Edit: Feb 1, 2011 18:44:17 GMT by cobblers
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