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May 22, 2006 20:55:51 GMT
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Do I buy an E30 M3 engine or turbo and megasquirt the existing engine in my BMW 2002Tii, I want around the 200-230bhp mark. Ive read a number of websites about both conversions. Last week I wanted turbo, now I'm swinging towards M-Power, both have their advantages. I wont be doing anything untill next winter probably, Just interested to hear your opinions/advice on the matter! M3 engine: Reliable 200-210ish bhp with minimal d#cking about. Turbo: Nothing quite like turbo WWOOOOOSSHH, but far far more brain and finger work, I am also worried I may start to become a little out of my depth with megasquirt and turbo bits everywhere Supose I should add, that as far as cost is concerned I cant see either route being substantialy cheeper than the other.
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street
Posted a lot
6.2 ft/lbs of talk
Posts: 4,662
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May 22, 2006 20:59:09 GMT
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I think you've answered your own question really, M3 lump will give you a very nice amount of BHP, and without turbo lag, megasquirt issues, and planning headaches. Either way, winning material
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SteB
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,408
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May 22, 2006 21:03:52 GMT
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NA M3 Rennmotor... Schön!
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M-Power or Turbo For 2002TiiBenzBoy
@benzboy
Club Retro Rides Member 7
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May 22, 2006 22:02:09 GMT
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I'd go the M3 route. I think it'd be a lot more straightforward. Then if you get bored, strap a turbo on the b*gger!
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May 22, 2006 22:14:38 GMT
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I have my doubts as to the reliability of M3 motors after what I saw last year. One of the guys in the drift championship last year had at least two..might have even been three engines let go on him... usually bottom end failures. I was pretty suprised that they seemed to be a bit fragile No doubting they deliver the goods when working though -Ed
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1962 Datsun Bluebird Estate - 1971 Datsun 510 SSS - 1976 Datsun 710 SSS - 1981 Dodge van - 1985 Nissan Cherry Europe GTi - 1988 Nissan Prairie - 1990 Hyundai Pony Pickup - 1992 Mazda MX5
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May 22, 2006 22:25:43 GMT
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Was the power above standard on the drift car? part of my cost calculations on either route involves a rebuild before it goes in, any increase in power from the m3 engine would be small, largely due to the fact I will need to have an exhaust made for my car, so I might as well have a nice equal length manifold made, a filter might make a tiny difference as well but nothing worth reporting on.
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May 22, 2006 22:31:17 GMT
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I'm pretty sure they were virtually stock apart from intake and exhaust. bear in mind this is only one example of one persons experience and I personally have no other experience of M3 motors myself but just thought it worth mentioning as i know how much misery he had with it last year. He was on the verge of fitting a Nissan SR20DET at one point. I'm sure there's plenty of others on here with loads of experience with them.
-Ed
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1962 Datsun Bluebird Estate - 1971 Datsun 510 SSS - 1976 Datsun 710 SSS - 1981 Dodge van - 1985 Nissan Cherry Europe GTi - 1988 Nissan Prairie - 1990 Hyundai Pony Pickup - 1992 Mazda MX5
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May 22, 2006 23:04:07 GMT
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I have seen 02's with SR20DET engines and its probably the best route if I wanted BIG reliable power but for my purpose its not worth it.........Dave
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May 22, 2006 23:08:05 GMT
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I have seen 02's with SR20DET engines and its probably the best route if I wanted BIG reliable power but for my purpose its not worth it.........Dave Rightly so too... SR's belong in old Datsuns ;D If I was looking for a donor for a 2002 I's want to keep it BMW but that's just how I like to do things. -Ed
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1962 Datsun Bluebird Estate - 1971 Datsun 510 SSS - 1976 Datsun 710 SSS - 1981 Dodge van - 1985 Nissan Cherry Europe GTi - 1988 Nissan Prairie - 1990 Hyundai Pony Pickup - 1992 Mazda MX5
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May 22, 2006 23:19:27 GMT
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Well you know what I'm going to say dave, its turbo all the way End of the day a 230bhp M10 engine is going to be super reliable, and virtually no lag at that power as the turbo can be jolly small with very little inertia. The M3 will be good to start, but has very little scope for improvement without a lot more dollar. Weve talked about the 700bhp M10 engines, and you know you want it! J
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Nick
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,483
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May 22, 2006 23:20:01 GMT
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I have my doubts as to the reliability of M3 motors after what I saw last year. One of the guys in the drift championship last year had at least two..might have even been three engines let go on him... usually bottom end failures. I was pretty suprised that they seemed to be a bit fragile No doubting they deliver the goods when working though -Ed yeh but to be truthful, bon bon did rape the curse word out of his engines and not look after them, one was a dodgy engine, bought cheap from a dodgy guy.. one got rtv rammed in the oil pickup and one got abuse with an 8500rpm revlimiter on a engine that was untouched since it came from factory. all engines got ragged too curse word at some stage, so this guys experiences are hardly a good example. s14/e30 m3 lumps are much better and more sexual i think bon bons engines were the later 3.0 6 cylinder lumps.. pretty sure the guy here is on about a 4pot m3 lump
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idea stolen from rattely eddie.
this weeks car count "5"
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May 22, 2006 23:29:49 GMT
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The 4pot should certainly handle stock, or close to, power all day every day for eterntity. The S14 (as in BMW, not Nissan!) lump bottom end is iron and thus should just get stronger with age.
But if you're looking for big HP I would look elsewhere as it's not a very tuneable without spending mucho cash.
Out of curiousity- do you know of any S14's up for sale and how much are they going for.
Cheers, Aaron
(292,000km on my M3 and still going strong- the HP matched that of cars with less than half the mileage on a recent rolling road day)
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Bioshock
Posted a lot
It aint hip to be square.
Posts: 1,861
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May 22, 2006 23:31:21 GMT
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gotta be the M3 route,i'm suprised at the three engines letting go in the drift cars,from what i've learnt of these lumps ,the're pretty bomb proof.were these badly built/tuned?in the touring car wars between the M3s and the cossies,one of the biggest levelers was the M engines reliability,against the cossies outright power.I read an article a couple of months ago in one of the beemer mags in w.h. smiths about a 2002 Touring using an E36 M engine,awesome! all the best with the conversion whatever you choose post some pics ;D
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Almera GTI = ugly bird who turns out to be great in the sack = Win
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May 22, 2006 23:33:01 GMT
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Wondered how long it would take you J, I was all up for turbo when we spoke the other day, now I've realise how easy it is to do the m3 engine, it will inevitably take far less time, Megasquirt and turbo at he same time seems like a world of pain,
How reliable is an M10 turbo engine built by "ME"
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May 22, 2006 23:33:57 GMT
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Also, I believe the M10 bottom end is the foundation of the S14... Guess I should know. Let me know what you decide either way- sounds like it could be a good feature car for the mag.
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Last Edit: May 22, 2006 23:34:24 GMT by aaronm3
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May 22, 2006 23:42:53 GMT
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Will definately keep you posted when I start the project (car is total restoration project currently) I have seen an engine go on ebay before for just under a grand and there is a reconditioned one on ebay currently at £1000 but i don't know what ancilaries it comes with.
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Is there going to be a RHD issue with the 2002tii? I've done some (fairly brief) investigating in the past re. fitting an M3 unit to a certain e30 BMW... From what I managed to gather, the steering mechanicals conflict with the exhaust manifold on a RHD E30 set-up.... hence why the M3 was LHD. Folk out there have found soultions, but to me they seem convaluted and a bit of a ball-ache. I don't know whether you would run into the same issues with the 2002. Just my 2 penneth. Whichever you decide, it's gonna make one awesome toy
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Bioshock
Posted a lot
It aint hip to be square.
Posts: 1,861
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2002tii check this out- these people sell a cd-rom on the total installation- ;D they've fitted the M3 lump in all kinds of Beemers!
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Last Edit: May 23, 2006 2:14:03 GMT by Bioshock
Almera GTI = ugly bird who turns out to be great in the sack = Win
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Nick
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,483
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gotta be the M3 route,i'm suprised at the three engines letting go in the drift cars,from what i've learnt of these lumps ,the're pretty bomb proof.were these badly built/tuned?i those 3 engines were all 6 cylinder m3 engines, and the reason for them dying, is serious abuse. taking a second hand engine with little or no history and treating it like a brand new race engine is going to end badly, the only drift car i came across personally with a s14/e30 m3 engine was standard power and as reliable as anything. i think that one did get treated well though.
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idea stolen from rattely eddie.
this weeks car count "5"
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s14 engine = good choice but the steering box will foul the exhaust manifold. ireland engineering do a revised manifold and other goodies for m2s (2oo2 with m power)they can be found here www.bmw2002.comcheck out this guys website as an englishman whos actually done it. he got raound the exhaust probs by swapping in an e21 rack, not for the faint hearted. go check it www.m2bmw.com. turbo is also good but you haven't much room for an effective manifold (I own an 02 too, its in readers rides). they probably work out about the same pricewise. s14 is gonna set you back £1-1.5k hth
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