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Mar 23, 2006 14:40:51 GMT
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Mar 23, 2006 14:43:19 GMT
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Have you tried J-Tuner?
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Mar 23, 2006 14:51:09 GMT
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^ Oh right cheers, whats that like?
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bryn
Posted a lot
Posts: 3,913
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Mar 23, 2006 14:56:33 GMT
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Usually try and have some older stuff in Jtuner, but the market place kind of dictates the content, had some AE's and other interesting bits though, worth a look. Japanese Performance was started on the back of the massive import surge five/six years ago, a lot of those owners have come from RS/Vauxhall etc ownership and therefore don't appreciate or have much interest in the heritage behind the brands. Retrocars should be filling this void to a certain extent, but maybe there's space for another title? Mr Hotwire sir, I'll have a word with Steve from Jtuner about the Hot Olds meet, there is a guy they use in Japan, but do you think you and Rmad might be able to supply some images for an article? Just a thought and a way to redress the balance for TwincamGTi... ;D
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Volvo, Buggy, Discovery and an old tractor.
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Mar 23, 2006 14:57:08 GMT
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Should be a bit better.
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Mar 23, 2006 14:58:28 GMT
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Mr Hotwire sir, I'll have a word with Steve from Jtuner about the Hot Olds meet, there is a guy they use in Japan, but do you think you and Rmad might be able to supply some images for an article? Just a thought and a way to redress the balance for TwincamGTi... ;D You read my mind .. PM me a number and I'll give them a call
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Mar 23, 2006 15:11:04 GMT
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brynWELL DONE SIR! It's not that i'm against 'new' cars it just I would like to see 'a bit of both' which surely is the fairest way Perhaps these 'modern owners' might be interested in the Heritage ...always nice to learn something new etc.! Thanks
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bryn
Posted a lot
Posts: 3,913
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Mar 23, 2006 15:26:54 GMT
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I know what you mean, but to most readers an old car is just that, regardless of its origin. They own Japanese cars because of what they can offer in terms of performance/handling and value for money. The odd older piece goes in, but is sometimes treated as a novelty factor by some mags... Jtuner tries to focus on as much of the scene as possible, like I said, global retro round up mag anybody? ;D
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Volvo, Buggy, Discovery and an old tractor.
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Mar 23, 2006 15:34:19 GMT
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Japanese Performance has always been that way since they started, but to me has always seemed a bit more grown-up than Banzai which started at the same time. In fairness to the latter, they did feature Datman's 180Y and I got a piece on the history of the Skyline published with them.
Never bought J-Tuner as I assumed it to be much the same, but if pic's from Hot Olds make it I'd definitely buy a copy.
Anyone, we all know there's a gap in the market but fortunately we've got this place instead!
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Mar 23, 2006 15:38:28 GMT
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www.jtuned.com/ They don't much like jtuner though.. Wich i can understand, seems kinda ripoff-ish to me..
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MWF
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,945
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Mar 23, 2006 15:43:19 GMT
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... ...THERES NOT ONE JAPANESE CAR IN THERE BUILT BEFORE 1990!!! ...WHY! Hmmm I wonder. Could it be the massive market of modern Japanese car fans who aren't interested in reading about old cars?
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bryn
Posted a lot
Posts: 3,913
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Mar 23, 2006 15:58:34 GMT
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www.jtuned.com/ They don't much like jtuner though.. Wich i can understand, seems kinda ripoff-ish to me.. Travelling from the US to Ireland (sorry lads, England's this way) and kicking people in the throat... Interesting approach to a supposed copycat attack, seeing as they're Americans I'm amazed there hasn't been some sort of lawsuit yet. Either that or if was just one of those things, and there are plenty of genuine working title designs showing an entirely different set of mast heads, with various different names and a clear trail of how the name Jtuner was created, and a lot earlier than any of those slightly blinkered people would ever know. One of those things I guess...
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Last Edit: Mar 23, 2006 15:59:10 GMT by bryn
Volvo, Buggy, Discovery and an old tractor.
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Mar 23, 2006 16:35:34 GMT
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I think the thing you have to rembember is that fans of modern J performance cars and retro J performance cars are often from very different scenes, as Bryn was saying. Whearas a lot of owners of retro Japanese cars have either liked said retro cars since they were modern cars, or have gotten into retro Japanese cars through seeing them at shows having been into VWs or similar previously, whearas a lot of modern J-car enthusiasts are of the Gran Turismo generation who first learned about Japanese performance cars through wanting an Impreza, Supra or Skyline as a kid or teenager and now being able to get one in the flesh, so the history of the brands they're into are sort of secondary, and they've never really been introduced to the merits of the older models.
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"He's not the messiah, he's a very naughty boy!"
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Mar 23, 2006 20:54:31 GMT
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Some very good valid points have been raised and I take note! However ... I don't believe the principle/belief that owners of new cars are not interested in old cars and I speak from personal experiance: During the late 80's and early 90's I was very involved with the 'XR Owners' club (I had a MK2 XR2 which I entered in Ford concourse events); a time when the XR cars were not that old. Also around same time I helped a friend restore 3 Mk1 ESCORTS (1969 base model, 1972 Mexico Replica and a 1973 1300 GT). A case of me being involved with old and new! Also the XR Owners club would 'join forces' with other Ford clubs to make a bigger show. One example was when the XR Club, RS Club, a local Capri Club and a Consul, Zepher and Zodiac club held a show together also ALL fords were invited (We had pre war to modern at time Cosworth Sierra) so again a diversity of age! Another example of people liking old and new is the many friends I have who are into Land Rovers, one very good friend of mine and his sister have and have had everything from Series 1's to current day 'Defender 110/90's. Again you see an age interest of 50+ years of vehicles So you see my experiance has been those who like new also like old ...and vice versa ... yes!? Finally THIS site ... Just look at the age difference of vehicle we have here on this forum ...what could be more open minded!
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Hirst
Posted a lot
This avatar is inaccurate, I've never shaved that closely
Posts: 3,930
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Mar 24, 2006 21:04:15 GMT
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Hmm just thought I'd chip in a bit about the magazines here, my opinions etc. Japanese Performance - Quite decent technical magazine sometimes but the feature cars aren't usually very exciting, you can pretty much guarantee that half of them will be Imprezas of some sort from some UK tuning garage who do this for a living. I think the last I got was a few months back with a Daihatsu Storia X4 in. Occasionally they do some old stuff but it's exception than the norm, unless you consider early Imprezas to be old. Could do with being a little less serious too. I buy it on and off depending what cars are featured. J-Tuner - Not a bad read, usually has some interesting feature cars (compared to Japanese Performance) but doesn't really get as technical as I'd like. I feel a lot of the magazine could do with revamping like the dyno shootouts bit which feels a bit too much like filler. They should go to Japan a bit more because they've done some really great features about cars already in Japan, but it annoys me a bit when they just put stuff in they found on the Internet, instead of posting up pictures from that Bozo site why not go out to Japan and do a feature on a Bozo car? That would be ace!! Buy this one on and off depending what's in, probably more than Japanese Performance nowadays. Banzai Magazine - Usually pretty poor, I think what summed it up best was when they started putting boy racer Hyundais in the readers cars section. Definitely leans towards people with generic show/cruise type cars rather than anything particularly interesting. Very rarely buy it, can't remember last time I did. I think the Japanese performance scene is an awkward one, usually people will identify with their own particular model (like Skyline GT-R owners generally seem to know and like the C10, C110 GT-Rs etc.) but there's just no convincing most of them about how cool old Toyota Centurys and Nissan Cedrics are. Plus they don't usually seem accepting of oddities and obscurities like Daihatsus (except perhaps the Charade GTti), but they never seem to get bored of wave after wave of newer Supras and Imprezas. You often get closeminded snobs who don't care about anything that isn't Japanese/a Nissan/a Nissan Skyline/a Nissan Skyline GT-R/a Nissan Skyline R34 GT-R. Personally I'd rather read about something I've no/not much experience of than some Impreza with a mishmash of easily available big brand tuning bits and a bigger turbo. Someone should make a Japanese car magazine that only features obscure cars that no one really pays much attention to. Issue 1 could have a pull out poster of a Daihatsu Charmant, and a big feature about the first generation Toyota Celsior and the history of Japanese taxis from 1980-1990. Me and 3 other people would buy it.
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Mar 24, 2006 21:28:45 GMT
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Issue 1 could have a pull out poster of a Daihatsu Charmant, and a big feature about the first generation Toyota Celsior and the history of Japanese taxis from 1980-1990. Me and 3 other people would buy it.
;D
It would have limited interest but I reckon we could get things moving by bugging the publishers of these magazines.
Only in Europe is there still a resistance towards older Japanese cars, with a few noticeable exceptions. A lot of this is mostly due to Japanese Car dealers having no idea about the heritage of their cars.
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Hirst
Posted a lot
This avatar is inaccurate, I've never shaved that closely
Posts: 3,930
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Mar 24, 2006 22:15:52 GMT
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That, and the ridiculous stigma of "them old Datsuns" which was caused pretty much entirely by the general UK motoring press (who still to this day use the old stereotypes, Italian cars all break instantly, Japanese cars will never have any prestige, etc.). On another rant about the UK motoring press it annoys me when they go through a review of a car they find to be mechanically bombproof which drives brilliantly, then bang on about something stupid like the dashboard plastics and conclude you should buy a new Golf or something for 2 grand more because it has a better image. When I'm driving round a bendy 60mph road with engine razzing I couldn't care less about the dashboard plastics and the image I'm projecting!!
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bryn
Posted a lot
Posts: 3,913
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Mar 24, 2006 23:14:41 GMT
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On another rant about the UK motoring press it annoys me when they go through a review of a car they find to be mechanically bombproof which drives brilliantly, then bang on about something stupid like the dashboard plastics and conclude you should buy a new Golf or something for 2 grand more because it has a better image. When I'm driving round a bendy 60mph road with engine razzing I couldn't care less about the dashboard plastics and the image I'm projecting!! That's because you understand what gives a car a soul, and you embrace it for that. Having reviewed a few new cars I can quite honestly say I've never had a satisfying experience in any of them, however you have to temper that with the fact that people will buy it none the less. For example somebody will buy a TDi Golf, when they really want an R32. Real world issues come into play, so buying a new car is often just a series of compromises that a customer has to balance out... This often comes down to trim levels or the like, as most drivers will never fully exploit the potential of whatever car they buy, these factors become more prominent in the whole process giving them a greater sense of empowerment, making them think they're genuinely buying something they actually want. Let 'fleecing marketing cowboys' be our watchwords... ;D
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Volvo, Buggy, Discovery and an old tractor.
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Hirst
Posted a lot
This avatar is inaccurate, I've never shaved that closely
Posts: 3,930
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That's very true, my dad wanted a Peugeot 607 (don't ask me why) but in the end he settled for a 407SW with a good trim spec. The actual driving didn't even come into it, he just likes leather seats and a big boot to shove compost bags into.
I think soul is a very good way of summing it up. The soul and the character of a car can really swing it for me, unfortunately cars are becoming a little bit too serious and just a "utility" nowadays. There was a survey around work the other day asking how you get to work and if you drive, why do you drive, what would make you walk or get the bus instead etc. Basically comprised of a load of tick boxes, something a bit like.
What are your main reasons for driving to work: [ ] Convenience [ ] Safety [ ] Cheap [ ] I have to drive for my job [ ] I need to transport heavy items often
Hang on, where's "because I enjoy driving my car"?
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