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Sept 30, 2008 10:17:38 GMT
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My daily is a 2001 VW Polo 1.4tdi, I've had it from new.
It replaced a much loved but utterly knackered Golf Mk1 1500 petrol.
It weighs loads more than the Golf, yet it delivers the same if not better power and acceleration. The Golf did 35mpg on 4*/LRP, the Polo reliably does 65mpg on diesel. If I cane it it drops to 60, if I am uberfrugal on a long uninterupted journey I can push it over 70.
Diesel costs more so I don't know how it racks up to the ~50mpg an equivalent petrol Polo would give me. But I know this, I visit filling stations very rarely these days.
So yes, if you have the right car, diesel MPG *is* all it's cracked up to be.
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"Jeremy Clarkson, a man we motor enthusiasts need on our side like Lewis Hamilton's F1 car needs a towing ball and a Sprite Musketeer" My motor
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Sept 30, 2008 10:41:12 GMT
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This is a good thread and echos some of my own thoughts. I've mentioned in other threads about a friends VW Golf TDi that returned 56~57 MPG but in reality only achieved 45 MPG in the past ;D My current daily driver (Proton Persona 1.3 Si) gets the same mileage on paper as the diesel variant (37 ave MPG) however here is a screen-shot of my actual MPG: I started to employ mild hyper-miling techniques in June this year and there is a consistently noticeable increase in MPG. All figure are actual calculations of fuel used and distance travelled - not based on any rules of thumb etc. This particular car doesn't achieve the same mileage as my previous Persona though I'd be really keen to get in on the LPG bandwagon but my car is probably worth at least half of the price of an installation...
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Tell it like it is.... NOT how it should be
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ChasR
RR Helper
motivation
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Club RR Member Number: 170
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Sept 30, 2008 11:34:47 GMT
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My dad does around 80k a year, and has come back to petrol.
His 2000 Mondeo 1.8TD managed around 32MPG around town, and about 45-47MPG on the motorway. But it cost alot more in other ways. Tyres it went through the fronts more often, and when we sold it, it was not far off the second clutch change and the 3rd set of Lower arms.
His 2001 Mk3 Mondeo does around 29MPG around town, and used to get up to around 40MPG on the motorway (that figure is now around 36MPG (car has done around 340,000miles). Besides the rear dampers and front springs, and a clutch, the car has been pretty good, and it has certainly cost less in maintenance than the TD did. It's on LPG, hence it is also much cheaper than the TD could ever be.
My mate used to drive a Jaguar X Type 2.2d, which he used to see around 34MPG average out of. Compared to a 2.0 Mondeo, I couldn't figure out the saving! Again, my cousin with his Mondeo STTDCi 155 gets around 40MPG average doing varied driving. The TDCi has also had its injectors changed under warranty which wouldn't have been cheap.
So from my perspective, diesels being cheaper to run is a bit of a fallacy really. I mean, I get around high 20s out of the Pug around town, and now high 30s, maybe 40MPG at times on the motorway, and that's with a smooth linear powerband. Yes I don't really rag it as much as some, but then there's not much real point in town, as it is a fairly effortless car to drive. The Ka I had in comparison I could never get to better 36MPG, no matter how hard I tried (60mph on the motorway for 2-3 hours), although that never dipped below 27MPG.
The most economical car I have owned probably has to be the Escort XR3i. Yes if you floored it (I.e, the pedal welded to the floor as some of my friends drive) it would be into the 20s, but with spirited driving, 30s were quite achievable. On the motorway even with a bootful, I never remember that car not doing less than 42MPG, normally it would exceed that. And that was a tired 1989 1.6i (K-Jetronic) Cabriolet! Again, the Volvo 740 2.3i did around 33MPG all of the time, with it getting into the high 30s with a loaded boot. I can't see how I would have benefitted from going for a 740TD to be honest.
Again, a mate's Volvo V50 is not what he expected, with the diesel going pretty quickly he said. His Astra van makes his V50 look very thirsty.
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Sept 30, 2008 11:45:36 GMT
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Ah yes, the Volvo 740. I was genuinely surprised at its ability to better 30mpg. Proof that big car needn't mean big fuel bills.
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1986 Citroen 2CV Dolly Other things. Check out my Blog for the latest! www.hubnut.org
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SteveP
Part of things
300 Maniac
Posts: 757
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Sept 30, 2008 13:16:50 GMT
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My Volvo 940 turbo did a consistent 25-28mpg, so far the new BMW 325tds is averaging 39mpg over the same kind of journeys (mixed urban, dual carriageway and B roads) with similar performance.
I'm finding it to be about 10mpg more on every type of journey. Basically it does about the same mpg as my Skoda Felicia, but with much more power!
With newer cars, petrol makes much more sense due to the complexity of common rail diesels.
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Last Edit: Sept 30, 2008 13:23:38 GMT by SteveP
2003 - Volvo S60 D5 SE (Daily) 1989 - Volvo 360 GLT 1985 - Volvo 360 GLS
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ChasR
RR Helper
motivation
Posts: 10,258
Club RR Member Number: 170
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Sept 30, 2008 13:58:20 GMT
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Ah yes, the Volvo 740. I was genuinely surprised at its ability to better 30mpg. Proof that big car needn't mean big fuel bills. Just a shame that it set itself on fire . What a car!
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ImpManiac
Part of things
Imps... Imps... Imps...
Posts: 868
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Sept 30, 2008 14:33:30 GMT
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^^ Presumably that didn't do it any favours in terms of its fuel consumption, then. "I'm"
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1966 Singer Chamois sprint/hillclimb car in white over blue two tone 1975 Triumph Stag long term project (over 20 years so far) in colour TBA 2003 Vauxhall Vectra GSi 3.2 in black sapphire
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Sept 30, 2008 18:10:45 GMT
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I'm torn between petrol and diesel at the moment, as I'm changing jobs and have got to give my company car back and buy my own motor next month. I've pretty much decided on a modern Passat (sorry but I have to carry clients about!) and I know I can afford a better spec petrol than diesel, so how much will I save on fuel? These figures are according to Whatcar's quoted average MPG figures, and the cost of fuel at the local garage:
Passat 1.9TDi Average = 48.7 Passat 2.0 Petrol Average = 34.9
Based on current pump prices Cost per mile for the diesel = 11.0 ppm Cost per mile for the petrol = 13.9 ppm
Based on 15k miles per year that's an extra £435 per year.
At the moment I'm looking at Diesels, but for the same spec diesel I'm looking at about a grand more than the equivalent petrol. Obviously there's depreciation to take into account, so I'm undecided as yet...
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Last Edit: Sept 30, 2008 18:11:30 GMT by whitbytom
1967 Morris Traveller 1971 Series IIA Land Rover 1991 Golf GL 4+e 1992 Corrado G60 1986 E28 BMW 528i
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Sept 30, 2008 21:03:20 GMT
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i run my cav 1.7td purely for running veg oil if i had to buy derv id be in a petrol these days
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I drive a 306 HDi as my daily and i rarely look at MPG as such but how many miles on a full tank, currently 520 odd miles if drive hard and 600 if i drive nicely.Its done 136.000 miles i change the oil every 6000 religiously.As for injector failure i'm waiting for it to happen,i regularly put injector cleaner in it(no particular brand) and try to fill up on high cetane grade fuel.I don't need a diesel anymore since i left my GF and no longer comute between Corby, Northants and Leicster city centre were we lived.But at the moment i can't justify buying another car.I drive to work every day in town driving conditions approx 5 miles round trip,not in heavy traffic as i start work at 6am and finnish at 6pm everyday so not many traffic jams with stop start driving.I really belive though that a nice light "retro" with a late 90's non common rail turbo diesel engine would be the ultimate payoff in economy and style.Every now and then i keep thinking about a Triumph Dolomite with Pug XUD turbo diesel engine under the bonnet,all i need is a Sherpa/LDV pilot lt77 gearbox.
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I currently do 100 miles a day 95% on the M1/M18/M62 so bought a diesel because it made more long term sense. They cost more to buy initially and diesel is more expensive but it saves me money. Figured a bigger engine, 1.9 TDI would be less strained and thrashed so work out cheaper than a smaller 3 cylinder 1.4 especially in a Polo. Averages around 40+ when I'm late for work but will do this on a slow run picking up stone chips from lorries, lol.
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this is the wifes daily after 6 laps of the 'ring,not too shabby i think,if i did a decent amount of miles a diesel would be my choice,but it would depend what model it was!
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SteB
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,408
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Standing up for the VAG Forum simpleton... I have a remapped Bora PD130. Rolling roaded at 160bhp and 315lbft - with no other modifications. Pretty quick, and never get less than 500 miles to a tank (55 litres/12 gallon) no matter how hard its driven. Its certainly more economical if you're careful with the throttle.
On occasion, it will tell me ive achieved 70mpg on a single 25 mile trip across the pennines, but I've never had more than 650 miles to a tank because I cant do the economy thing all the time.
As for the price of diesel going up... I'm paying about as much in fuel now as I did 3-4 years ago with a 1.6 petrol Polo. Its a shame diesel prices are so high.
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bortaf
Posted a lot
Posts: 4,549
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Me and the wife share both cars so here's what i've found Escort Mk4 1.8 diesel Me round town 35 Her " " " " 45 Me on a run at 70 50 Her " " " " 70 52 Cortina EFi pinto Me round town 25 Her " " " " 33 Me on a run @80 39 Her " " " @80 41 When i fanaly get a turbo diesel in a cortina i'll report back but i'm thinking LPG would be cheaper and probably have the same inital cost for the conversiom (DIY 2nd hand V a donor car) One thing to remember is older style diesels don't work as well on modern diesel, i've owned diesel transits constantly for the last 14 years and seen the MPG drop (transit Di) from 28 thrashed all day long to 24 driven like a granma, although i can get 30 with a mix of new cooking oil and diesel, i really noticed the drop when the low sulphur diesel was introduced and i avoided it like the plauge till i had no choice
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R.I.P photobucket
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Rich G
Posted a lot
Keyboard Worrier
Posts: 1,059
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I guess it all depends on what sort of driving you do.
My daily trip consists of 10mins through town to M5-J25 then 25mins of M5 at a steady 75mph to J21 then another 25mins up the A370 (max 55mph) through two small towns into Long Ashton Park & Ride on the edge of Bristol. A fair mix of town, country and motorway.
Went over to the dark side in May (having changed offices from Exeter to Bristol; gone from a 60mile round trip to a 100mile round trip) and swapped a 440 Volvo 1.7 auto (average of 33mpg over the 3 years of owning it) to a 52 plate Rover 25 2.0 TD.
Using the same method of calculation - actual mileage and litres to fill the tank - the Rover is returning an average of 52mpg. For me it's a significant saving; one less gallon of juice to pay for so even after having to pay for my daily looser-cruiser ticket I'm still a couple of quid a day up on the deal.
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I've just filled the tank and noted the mileage on my Clio dci to see how accurate the computer is in light of this thread. I've suspected its designed to flatter. It normally reads 60 something mpg and I reckon to get 550 ish miles before the light comes on. It is a 50 litre tank according to the handbook. Mpg does vary according to use. I do mostly urban trundling, so something like a steady run to my brothers boosts the average mpg figure.
I am vastly amused about the comments regarding driveability issues the price of injectors and comments about reliability. In addition to the Clio we have 2 Astra dti's and between them they have done circa 400,000 miles with only one failure between them that cost £80 to sort. Perhaps proper regular servcing pays dividends?
If it turns out the the car does a few less mpg that the computer says i'm still happy. It costeth buttons to run and the mpg is a revalation to that pisspoor effort Peugeot called the 306XSi that managed 26 average, over 30mpg was cause for a party.
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205 GTi Mi16
205 XS - Now in filmidget's signature
Clio dci 80
I've found in life if someone is an idiot, they generally stay and idiot.
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bbq
Part of things
(. )( .)
Posts: 485
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I'm torn between petrol and diesel at the moment, as I'm changing jobs and have got to give my company car back and buy my own motor next month. I've pretty much decided on a modern Passat (sorry but I have to carry clients about!) and I know I can afford a better spec petrol than diesel, so how much will I save on fuel? These figures are according to Whatcar's quoted average MPG figures, and the cost of fuel at the local garage: Passat 1.9TDi Average = 48.7 Passat 2.0 Petrol Average = 34.9 Based on current pump prices Cost per mile for the diesel = 11.0 ppm Cost per mile for the petrol = 13.9 ppm Based on 15k miles per year that's an extra £435 per year. At the moment I'm looking at Diesels, but for the same spec diesel I'm looking at about a grand more than the equivalent petrol. Obviously there's depreciation to take into account, so I'm undecided as yet... You're in Lytham- surely you should buy a Merc like everyone else?
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2003 Suzuki Wagon R+. Feel the POWAAARRRR!!! 1968 Volvo 142. My street/strip car. Currently fubarred, it will run one day. 1971 Volvo 142. Parts car. Stripped and gone. 1993 Nissan Sunny diesel. Runs on cooking oil! [/UR
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this is the wifes daily after 6 laps of the 'ring,not too shabby I think,if I did a decent amount of miles a diesel would be my choice,but it would depend what model it was! Is this a fiat Punto Mutijet,I only ask as there is a Metalic orange one driving around Corby at the moment and i can't keep up with it
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I run a Derv for one reason only.
Cos I like em, I think they sound nicer than a petrol they are tougher less complex the power is lower in the rev range you get a chunk more torque and every now and again some cheep diesel crops up which is always a bonus.
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I am vastly amused about the comments regarding driveability issues the price of injectors and comments about reliability. In addition to the Clio we have 2 Astra dti's and between them they have done circa 400,000 miles with only one failure between them that cost £80 to sort. Perhaps proper regular servcing pays dividends? the GM DTi engines are relatively old-school direct injection engines, no common rail here.
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