Stu
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,913
|
|
|
Hi All, At the weekend I fitted braided hoses to my Mk2 Golf 16v, the fitting went ok but when it came to bleeding the system I just can't get a decent pedal... it nearly hits the floor before the brakes come on! I did the following: 1. Check all pipes/connections - no leaks 2. Disconnected handbrake cables 3. Jammed rear pressure bias valve thing fully open 4. Connected up Easibleed to master cyl resevoir 5. Went around each calliper in correct order (furthest first) and bled out the air I tried this a few times, had already tried without Easibleed with my brother pumping the pedal 'manual' style but no luck! Any ideas? The pedal isn't that bad with the engine off, still pretty cr@p but goes much worse when the engine is running. Was all great before I fitted the braided hoses.... wish I hadn't bothered now!
|
|
'89 BMW E30 325i Sport, '04 MINI Cooper S, '09 Volvo V70 D5
|
|
|
mercmad
Posted a lot
Flush Hard,it's a long way to McDonalds.
Posts: 1,740
|
|
|
Your master cylinder is shot.When the pedal went to the floor,the seals moved over wear marks in the bore and this has ruined the edges of the lip seals.Best to replace it before you "Liberace" someones hideously expensive Roller or Merc...
|
|
Many years ago I changed my driving style to cope with rising fuel prices; I have now reached the stage where I am contemplating keeping my eyes shut in order to lower wind resistance.
|
|
Stu
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,913
|
|
|
Cr@p, I hope it's not that bad! I made sure never to actually press the pedal right to the floor, more like 3/4 of the way down maximum. That said a knackered master cyl would give these symptoms...
|
|
'89 BMW E30 325i Sport, '04 MINI Cooper S, '09 Volvo V70 D5
|
|
mercmad
Posted a lot
Flush Hard,it's a long way to McDonalds.
Posts: 1,740
|
|
|
.. I made sure never to actually press the pedal right to the floor, more like 3/4 of the way down maximum. That said a knackered master cyl would give these symptoms... UMMM,how did you hope to get the air out if you didn't push the pedal to the floor???...That's the general idea,get ALL the fluid moving. the master cylinder has a forward second set of seals which can only be pushed by fluid comming from the first set.If there is air in there they cannot work properly,you probably don't have rear brakes. Does your car have drums on the rear?,If so wind the adjustors out so the shoes are hard against the drums.Then try bleeding by PUSHING THE PEDAL RIGHT DOWN!!!. Once you have "pedal" again,unwind the adjustors so you can "just " hear the linings rubbing on the drums. If the handbrake works on those same drums,pull the handle on 6 clicks,then wind the adjustors back so the drums stop turning,when you release the handbrake it should also allow the drums to turn again. Everything should be right,go through the bleeding and adjusting routine in a week or two,to allow the shoes etc to settle and air to collect near the calipers.
|
|
Many years ago I changed my driving style to cope with rising fuel prices; I have now reached the stage where I am contemplating keeping my eyes shut in order to lower wind resistance.
|
|
Stu
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,913
|
|
|
Ok - cheers for the info. It has rear discs but I expect the routine is the same, I know the rear piston clearance/handbrake adjustment can have something to do with it so will check that out.
I didn't push the pedal right down when bleeding as I had read that it can knacker the seals in the master cyl. Presumably the Easibleed should be alright though unless there is air stuck somewhere that it can't push out?
|
|
'89 BMW E30 325i Sport, '04 MINI Cooper S, '09 Volvo V70 D5
|
|
mercmad
Posted a lot
Flush Hard,it's a long way to McDonalds.
Posts: 1,740
|
|
|
Exactly,Push it too the floor,If it is knackerd it is safer to wreck it in the drive than on the road,I see on telly that UK roads are wall to wall cars.....No need to invite the fates is there?
|
|
Many years ago I changed my driving style to cope with rising fuel prices; I have now reached the stage where I am contemplating keeping my eyes shut in order to lower wind resistance.
|
|
|
|
|
UMMM,how did you hope to get the air out if you didn't push the pedal to the floor???...That's the general idea,get ALL the fluid moving. If all that he’s changed is the brake hoses, I don’t see how it makes any difference if the pedal is pushed all the way or half way.
|
|
1972 Fiat 130 1985 Talbot Alpine 1974 Lancia Beta Saloon 1975 + 1986 Mazda 929 Koop + Wagon 1982 Fiat Argenta 2.0 iniezione elettronica 1977 Toyota Carina TA14 BEST CAR EVER!!!!!!!! 1979 Datsun B310 Sunny 4-dr 1984 Audi 200 Quattro Turbo 1983 Honda Accord 1.6 DX GONE1989 Alfa 75 2.0 TS Mr T says: TREAT YO MOTHER RIGHT!
|
|
|
|
|
I hate to say this but I was thinking brake master cylinder or else the brake servo as well, I've had very similar symptoms from both of those being knackered in the past. Well, assuming your Golf has a brake servo. I had one once that I suspected was knackered, so I removed it, and no sooner had I done it than half a bottle of brake fluid poured out of the servo, i.e. from places where it wasn't supposed to be in the servo! No wonder I couldn't get a decent pedal!
|
|
"He's not the messiah, he's a very naughty boy!"
|
|
|
|
|
Just my 2p's worth but its worth checking that the load sensing valve on the rear isnt airlocked and its definatly in the open posistion. With the pressure bleeder attatched just crack the pipes off one by one before bleeding the rear brakes. Another thing you can try is winding the rear pistons all the way in, slacken the handbrake cables off, then bleed the rears.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I would have thought the master cylinder and servo would be okay if there wasnt a problem before fitting the braided hoses. When bleeding I always start from the bleed nipple furthest away from the master cylinder. Get someone to pump (on/off repeatedly) the brake pedal pretty hard and fast then get them to hold the pedal down then open the bleed nipple (the pedal will drop further down) then tighten the bleed nipple back up. Do this a few times on this nipple till pretty sure there is no more air here then move to the next furthest away. It always seems to work for me. Normally I find you don't need to manually open the rear bias valve as it should still bleed okay. Personally I have always had problems removing trapped air using an eezi bleed. Couple of problems I do remember 1) On Tonycocacolas merc we had difficulties bleeding the rear brakes when he fitted new callipers. Basically there was hardly any fluid coming through the nipple. I even had a pipe on the nipple and I was trying to suck the fluid through this (don't try this at home kids . Eventually found out that the master cylinder reservoir was split into two even though there was only one filler and we had to fill the master cylinder nearly to overflowing before it started filling up ther rear part of it. 2) Other problem I remember having is on my pajero had to change some of the solid pipes for MOT when I bought the car and I couldnt get all the air out what I found was, its a dual circuit master cylinder (normal) but one circuit fed the front brakes the other split into two to run the full length of the car then went into a pressure valve but only one pipe came out which then split into two again on the back axle. What was happening was one of the rear pipes was fine the fluid was flowing to the pressure valve but the other was full of air and the fluid going to the pressure valve was then coming back into the air filled pipe and compressing. To bleed I had to loosen the union on the pipe going into the valve and bleeding as you would a bleed nipple. After that perfect.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
someones not fitted golf mk3 callipers to the rear have they? direct replacement EXCEPT the bleed nipple is on the bottom so you never bleed all the air out of the rears.when euro's sell them they just 'forget' to mention this wee small fact.
|
|
|
|
Stu
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,913
|
|
|
Thanks for all the replies! Slight delay on the brake bleeding front as I have had to remove one front calliper now as it had a sheared bleed nipple jammed in it. Can't get the curse word out, even drilled and tried some 'easyouts' on it... managed to snap one off in the hole! I reckon it's the rear load compensator valve that's too blame, those things are a pain in the rse! Mk3 rear callipers - not sure, I might have those but I definitely have the bleed nipples at the top of the callipers so I assume not. I thought I did have Mk3 ones as the handbrake doesn't stick on with this car like previous Mk2's I've had!
|
|
'89 BMW E30 325i Sport, '04 MINI Cooper S, '09 Volvo V70 D5
|
|