Siert
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,105
|
|
|
Without the airflow meter you would probably still get the thing started. That said, mine wouldn't start without the temparature sensor wire as it will massively overfuel. Here's Bosch's technical manual for L-jetronic, they're really simple, there's no digital electronics at all involved, its just an analog oscillator. The downside is that there's no "panic mode" so in case of loose connections it may generate something that can impossibly make an engine run. Check the hoses to the cold start compensation valve as well.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Apr 10, 2011 21:30:39 GMT
|
Anyone fancy a bit of an update? Well tough cos here is one anyway. SO, this Fiat is still sat in my garage and is still a non-runner. I have been hammering the internet to the max teaching myself about Bosch L-jetronic. It spun over but did not fire, except if you tipped some easystart down its throat at which point it fired up immediately. I reckoned the injectors were not pulsing, so I tried to find out what circumstance would cause that to happen> I checked out pretty much the entire injection wiring loom: but could not find a single fault. The switch in the airflow meter was working and the relay pack was recieving and sending all the right signals. I did not trust the relay pack (I'd had to bypass the fuel pump relay to get it running back in France) and saw another for sale on eBay (same as an Alfa GTV6 you see!) so I bought that and boshed it on. It made no difference so I opened it up to check everything was working as it should be: It was all 100%. So the ECU was getting all the right signals, the relays were powering up the injectors and the pump, yet still no juice was getting through. It looked like the ECU was b0rked, but I just tried one last thing - a noid light bought off eBay for £5. This plugs into the injector wiring and lights up off the injector pulses - if it flashes you know the injectors are getting a signal. I boshed it on and would you believe it, it flashed away like a mutha. I popped the AFM wide opn and tried again, and it flashed much brighter. So it was defo getting a good signal. That only left the injectors - they must be blocked!!!! I have never heard of all 4 injectors being totally blocked before. It seems ludicrous but theres defo fuel pressure and the injectors are defo pulsing. Yet no juice is getting through. They must be blocked solid! Fuggin wars what a carry on. Just after I made this revelatory discovery, my NEW FUEL PUMP which had cost £30 off the bay, jammed solid and made an impotent humming noise. WHAT!!! Thats the third fuel pump i've had on there, after opening and cleaning the tank I thought I had the problems solved. Now I had 2 dead bosch pumps on the bench, I could hardly face buying ANOTHER cos they are not cheap so i decided to have a look inside one!!! Nowt to lose was there. this is the thing i'm talking about: Its sealed for life by being crimped at one end: Well I uncrimped it with some pliers and opened it up! Afer a small war it admitted defeat and I popped the end cap out: The end cap contains the brushes for the motor, and the pump is in fact 95% electric motor: The magnet bit just slides out of the case as does the winding which has the pump fastened to it (the actual pump is the lump on the LHS of this pic). The pump must have had a bit of curse word in it. Its just like a ttiny oil pump, you can just about see it in here: As soon as I opened the pump up the bit of crud must have dislodged itself cos now it spun free as you like. Fixed!!! I flushed it through with WD40 while spinning the pump by hand. The casing had a disappointing amount of crud inside: Seems my tank is not as clean as I thought. Or maybe loads of crud is being flushed out the pipes etc while i'm messing about trying to start the damned thing. Anyway i cleaned that out: popped the end cab back onto the core (you have to open up the brushes to get it on) : And bunged it all back in the case! My crimping skills are not as good as Bosch but it seals with an o-ring on the OD of the end cap so as long as its nice and tight we should be laughing. Anyway this pump is back in the game!!! AND, while I was arsing around the old ex-ratdat pump must have considered its own lifestyle options and decided to miraculously repair itself!!! I tried it a couple of times on a battery connecting it up the right way round and back to front, and after a fashion it came back to life!!! So i went from having two knackered pumps to two decent ones!!! CA$HBACK. More shortly including some hot video action.
|
|
1974 Lancia Beta Saloon 1975 Mazda 929 Coupé 1986 Mazda 929 Wagon 1979 Mazda 929 Hardtop 1982 Fiat Argenta 2.0 iniezione elettronica 1977 Toyota Carina TA14 1989 Subaru 1800 Wagon 1982 Hyundai Pony 1200TL 2-dr 1985 Hyundai Pony 1200 GL 1986 Maserati 425 Biturbo 1992 Rover 214 SEi 5-dr 2000 Rover 45 V6 Club 1994 Peugeot 205 'Junior' Diesel 1988 Volvo 760 Turbodiesel Saloon 1992 Talbot Express Autosleeper Rambler 2003 Renault Laguna SPEARS OR REAPERS
|
|
|
|
Apr 10, 2011 21:42:42 GMT
|
Nice work! Interesting seeing what's inside one of them fuel pumps, they aren't as alien as I thought they might be.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Apr 10, 2011 21:49:33 GMT
|
Mega
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Now to try and get the injectors out. They are well buried, i started by taking the top ha;f of the inlet manifold off: That didnt gain me a lot sadly, see if you can spot any signs of the injectors in this pic: After a lot of swearing i managed to wrestle the first one free: Access to these is dire. freakin italians!! Eventually the whole lot gave up the fight thankfullly, as I could not see how to get that bottom half of the manifold off without removing the engine! Here is the gubbins: looking at the tips of them, there does appear to be a bit of variation in how the pintle thing is sitting: Now i've gotta find someone who can flow test and ultrasonically clean these. HOPEFULLY these are the source of the non-starting issue! Here is the Argenta in the classic pose (which it has adopted permanently since arriving in the garage: In other news, I decided to see if the Avenger would fire up. On went a battery and a can of juice. For your delectation here is a video of proceedings: Woo hoo! That was amazingly painless! One thing I did notice about this car is the steering rack feels like someone has popped a handful of pea gravel inside the gaiters. New rack required I think. Look out! here comes Ms_Bollox with a complaint about me revving up smoky old bangers next to her lovely clean washing.
|
|
1974 Lancia Beta Saloon 1975 Mazda 929 Coupé 1986 Mazda 929 Wagon 1979 Mazda 929 Hardtop 1982 Fiat Argenta 2.0 iniezione elettronica 1977 Toyota Carina TA14 1989 Subaru 1800 Wagon 1982 Hyundai Pony 1200TL 2-dr 1985 Hyundai Pony 1200 GL 1986 Maserati 425 Biturbo 1992 Rover 214 SEi 5-dr 2000 Rover 45 V6 Club 1994 Peugeot 205 'Junior' Diesel 1988 Volvo 760 Turbodiesel Saloon 1992 Talbot Express Autosleeper Rambler 2003 Renault Laguna SPEARS OR REAPERS
|
|
Siert
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,105
|
|
|
That fuel pump repair looks like it may be exactly the thing I will be doing tonight...
|
|
|
|
Rob M
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,915
Club RR Member Number: 41
|
|
|
I'm not sure how you have the patience Mr B. I reckon i would have been tempted to have dropped the Fiat off the ferry into the depths of the Channel. Wish i had your skills and patience! I was, however, somewhat disappointed to see that the video didnt end in a "You've been framed" moment. Why are the plug leads pushed into some dead strawberries on the distributor cap? Does their acidic content assist the spark or summat?
|
|
|
|
Seth
South East
MorrisOxford TriumphMirald HillmanMinx BorgwardIsabellaCombi
Posts: 15,538
|
|
|
Disappointed in the lack of electro soundtrack to the video. But the tappety soundtrack almost makes up for it! Bootiful! Just sent you a PM.
|
|
Follow your dreams or you might as well be a vegetable.
|
|
|
|
Apr 11, 2011 10:44:21 GMT
|
Diagn0stix by Boll0x. Loving it. Looks like the Argenta has been suffering that tank for quite a while. What's the word on fitting a filter before the pump? It can't kill the pump any more than dragging dirt through it, surely? Funny that the Avenger came through to save the day though haha --Phil
|
|
|
|
|
|
Apr 11, 2011 17:22:12 GMT
|
I did have a little prefilter thing on there but took it off after doing the tank as I reckoned it was restricting the flow to the pump, which is effectiveley a gravity feed. Now i'm wondering if my best option is a separate low-pressure electric pump to push the juice through another paper filter before it reaches the Bosch pump. It would have to be a poppet-valve type chugger pump rather than a Bosch-type continuous one though as they are less bothered about eating the occasional pebble etc.
I have a feeling that unless I do something along those lines, this car might be dogged by dirt in the fuel system forever more no matter how much I swill it out.
|
|
1974 Lancia Beta Saloon 1975 Mazda 929 Coupé 1986 Mazda 929 Wagon 1979 Mazda 929 Hardtop 1982 Fiat Argenta 2.0 iniezione elettronica 1977 Toyota Carina TA14 1989 Subaru 1800 Wagon 1982 Hyundai Pony 1200TL 2-dr 1985 Hyundai Pony 1200 GL 1986 Maserati 425 Biturbo 1992 Rover 214 SEi 5-dr 2000 Rover 45 V6 Club 1994 Peugeot 205 'Junior' Diesel 1988 Volvo 760 Turbodiesel Saloon 1992 Talbot Express Autosleeper Rambler 2003 Renault Laguna SPEARS OR REAPERS
|
|
|
|
Apr 11, 2011 18:15:24 GMT
|
That'd be good, but I'd say after the filter (because it always gets through in some form or another) to have a swirl pot/dirt sump that has a gauze mesh in the base to allow debris to settle and try keep the inlet to the high pressure pump as clean as possible?
|
|
|
|
Hirst
Posted a lot
This avatar is inaccurate, I've never shaved that closely
Posts: 3,930
|
|
Apr 11, 2011 19:52:17 GMT
|
Nice Avenger vid, you should become some sort of Youtube celebrity, it'd be better than all those infuriating morons I see thumbnails of when I go on there to watch old Kia adverts.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Apr 13, 2011 10:27:12 GMT
|
|
|
1962 Datsun Bluebird Estate - 1971 Datsun 510 SSS - 1976 Datsun 710 SSS - 1981 Dodge van - 1985 Nissan Cherry Europe GTi - 1988 Nissan Prairie - 1990 Hyundai Pony Pickup - 1992 Mazda MX5
|
|
|
|
Apr 22, 2011 14:29:25 GMT
|
Holy Moly a news update!!! So last time I had removed the injectors with the intention of getting them tested and cleaned. In the meantime the car was sat doing nowt so i decided to tray and tackle something that was bothering me, the horrrible black paint on the lower body trims. It wasnt stuck on very well so i though there was a chance the bumpers could be revived. First off, remove the trim in question: I also cleaned the black paint off the wings behind the trim, the black had clearly gon on without much in the way of masking happening. Wire-brush the paint off: Came off surprisingly easily. Hot air gun (inexplicably I didnt photograph that bit, must have got too excited) refit and shine up with lashings of Armor All (might have to try and find something better than that stuff to finish off): Next i did the front bumper, which took all day but went from this: To this: To my eyes that looks much better, but when my garage mate saw it he said "what, is it supposed to be that colour? Looks dull as hell, I preferred it black" No idea man. I informed him that the Argenta sales brochure made a big deal about the 'striking grey finish' on the exterior trim, I think i managed to convince him. Anyway the injectors got themselves sent off to these boys: www.injectortune.co.uk. Charged £12.50 per injector for a clean up and service (service is new o-rings and gaize filter). I bought the servive through eBay and sent em off. After a few days i'd heard nowt so asked what was happening. The lad said the injectors 'as recieved' were blocked completely solid with shiz so it had taken a while to get them flowing at all, before they could go on the ultrasonic cleaner. (not sure how he did that). Once flowing he ran them for 6 hrs on his rig which got them flowing at 50% then another overnight blezzs had them up to 100%. Fantastic! So that was the problem after all. Anyway I got them back yesterday: ... and armed with a load of new pipes and clips (plus another Jordans Crunch box): set about reassembling the fuel system: ^^^ get a load of that little beauty. It took freaking ages to get it all back together due to the total lack of access to any of it. However by about 1 am last night it looked like this. In came the rover on jump lead duty: I then tried to start it, and would you fuggin believe it it would not even fire. WHAT!!! I took the fuel return of and powered up the pump, none was coming through. Turns out I had wired the pump up back to front like a twit. Tried again, this time it coughed and spluttered (a first) but still would not run. I mucked about a but blowing the pressure regulator through and so on, and establlished that there was rag all fuel in! I hat spilt most of it on the garage floor. In went a fresh gallon of firewater, and BRAAMMMMMMMMMMMMM!!!!!!!! Its alive!!!!! So today i drove it out into the sunshine and gave it a hose down. WHAT A BEAUTY! Not really, even I agree this is a pretty fugly car, what were they thinking of!!! I still like it though. Theres a hideous death rattle off the exhaust somewhere that spoils the music of the twink, but here it is anyway: CIAO 4 NOW!
|
|
1974 Lancia Beta Saloon 1975 Mazda 929 Coupé 1986 Mazda 929 Wagon 1979 Mazda 929 Hardtop 1982 Fiat Argenta 2.0 iniezione elettronica 1977 Toyota Carina TA14 1989 Subaru 1800 Wagon 1982 Hyundai Pony 1200TL 2-dr 1985 Hyundai Pony 1200 GL 1986 Maserati 425 Biturbo 1992 Rover 214 SEi 5-dr 2000 Rover 45 V6 Club 1994 Peugeot 205 'Junior' Diesel 1988 Volvo 760 Turbodiesel Saloon 1992 Talbot Express Autosleeper Rambler 2003 Renault Laguna SPEARS OR REAPERS
|
|
EmDee
Club Retro Rides Member
Committer of Autrocities.
Posts: 5,933
Club RR Member Number: 108
|
|
Apr 22, 2011 15:48:40 GMT
|
WHAT A BEAUTY! Not really, even I agree this is a pretty fugly car, what were they thinking of!!! I still like it though. haha well I must say I LOVE it long time, I reckon it's saucy in a sort of old boxy Italiany Fiaty kinda way, looks like the illegitimate offspring of a 131 and an Alfa 6. Anyway, I digress, CONGRATULATIONS, very well played
|
|
|
|
|
|
Apr 22, 2011 17:00:12 GMT
|
MEGA.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Apr 22, 2011 18:41:08 GMT
|
Top work. Sonically cleaned injectors. That's NASA shiz man! It looks much better with the cruddy paint off the bumpers.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Apr 22, 2011 18:59:44 GMT
|
Awesome I like it, but then again, look at my current choice of retro... Win --Phil
|
|
|
|
Hirst
Posted a lot
This avatar is inaccurate, I've never shaved that closely
Posts: 3,930
|
|
Apr 22, 2011 23:34:01 GMT
|
Nice work plums! Best thing in my experience for plastic trim is boiled linseed oil, especially on your "bit of grey" as it actually consistently returns it to the original colour and it'll stay like that for yonks (unlike Back to Black which just turns every into a greasy black tar mess). The Armor All type stuff tends to look patchy and wears off quickly. The £1 cost can be negated by using it on that bloody Rover.
|
|
|
|
skinnylew
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 5,634
Club RR Member Number: 11
|
|
|
excellent work sir
|
|
|
|