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Got a 2002 BMW E46 recently and the steering is pretty vague on it. It passed an MOT today so they would've checked the steering assembly for potential faults but didn't mention anything.
Only thing I can think of is wheel alignment.
Does anyone have any knowledge of the E46 and know if there is anything else they sometimes do which causes woolly steering?
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Davey
Posted a lot
Resident Tyre Nerd.
Posts: 2,335
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They have all kinds of issues caused by lower arm bushing failing, normally manifests itself as wobbly steering though.
Does it feel like it follows the road surface? If so could very well be tracking.
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K11 Micra x3 - Mk3 astra - Seat Marbella - Mk6 Escort estate - B5 Passat - Alfa 156 estate - E36 compact
Mk2 MR2 T-bar - E46 328i - Skoda Superb - Fiat seicento - 6n2 Polo - 6n polo 1.6 - Mk1 GS300
EU8 civic type S - MG ZT cdti - R56 MINI Cooper S - Audi A3 8p - Jaguar XF (X250) - FN2 Civic Type R - Mk2 2.0i Ford Focus - Mercedes W212 E250
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It does feel more than tracking, hence coming on here for a second opinion.
When you say wobbly do you mean vibration or just meandering? It does seem like on a perfectly straight road that it will fall off into the path of the opposing traffic seemingly without warning. Then you correct it by steering back and that counter steer requires another counter steer to get you straight again.
I'm not sure most people would notice this but being a car nut it does feel like there's something not quite right.
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E36/46 lower wishbones when they are past it, you get a shimmy under light breaking from higher speeds. Feels like warped disks.
Budget tyres can ruin a perfectly good car.
Is the rear subrame/diff ok?
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It doesn't have the standard BMW brake shimmy. I'm pretty sure that was older BMWs which used the steering box system. Pretty sure from E30-onwards the 3-series was always rack and pinion?
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The E36's defo do it & yes, rack and pinion racks
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I suppose my only experience with this was on the 635csi. That had a lot in common with the 5 and 7 series of the era. All were steering boxes and I just assumed with the E30-onward the rack & pinion setup meant it didn't happen... but thinking about it, the control arms were the main cause and they probably have those setup the same way regardless to which steering mechanism they used.
Either way... it's not the brake shimmy issue as it's most apparent when cruising on a straight road with foot nowhere near the brakes.
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Has it got matching tyres on the axels?
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Davey
Posted a lot
Resident Tyre Nerd.
Posts: 2,335
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The E36's defo do it & yes, rack and pinion racks E46's are terrible for it, but also gives similar symptoms to original post. My 328 was like steering the titanic on gravel when I first bought it. |
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K11 Micra x3 - Mk3 astra - Seat Marbella - Mk6 Escort estate - B5 Passat - Alfa 156 estate - E36 compact
Mk2 MR2 T-bar - E46 328i - Skoda Superb - Fiat seicento - 6n2 Polo - 6n polo 1.6 - Mk1 GS300
EU8 civic type S - MG ZT cdti - R56 MINI Cooper S - Audi A3 8p - Jaguar XF (X250) - FN2 Civic Type R - Mk2 2.0i Ford Focus - Mercedes W212 E250
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Has it got matching tyres on the axels? I've not checked each of the tyres but from a distance I think they've been recently renewed on all 4 corners. It's something I'm interested to verify so will check but I think it has 4 new tyres all of the same type. |
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The E36's defo do it & yes, rack and pinion racks E46's are terrible for it, but also gives similar symptoms to original post. My 328 was like steering the titanic on gravel when I first bought it. Okay, something to check then. |
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jmsheahan
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 689
Club RR Member Number: 121
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BMW e46 vague steeringjmsheahan
@jmsheahan
Club Retro Rides Member 121
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As mentioned above, worth checking over the front control arms again and having a 4 wheel alignment done by someone who know's E46's.
Another weird one they suffer with is snapped rear springs which aren't always immediately obvious.
Again as mentioned above, my old 330 was incredibly sensitive to tyre type so well worth confirming all 4 tyres match and are the correct size.
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thanks for the suggestions. It's just past an MOT so whatever it is must be minor, unlikely to be a snapped spring.
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Milord
Part of things
Posts: 156
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Mine has seen most of the front suspension replaced before the problem finally disappeared altogether. Front control arms are a big difference, but mostly the rear bushing. I replaced those with PU bushings and this worked wonders. Sadly this is not streetlegal in Belgium so I had to take them off again which clearly made the ride more wobbly again. I have these laying around so if these are legal in the UK I'd be happy to ship them your way!  Are you sure there is no play in the rack itself? These racks do start to wear out in the connection where the rubber hose is. These can be refurbished. (FEBI make these parts) It's rather easy to check these if you have a companion at the steering wheel!  I have yet to do mine, but the play in these is tolerable at the moment. Lastly: mine had play in the upper steering joint. This is a universal joint behind the dash. Rather expensive to replace, and a definite PITA to remove. Mine has only 200.000km on the clock at this moment so anything is possible Tracking does make a huge difference, but as long as you have some play in the system it wont last... |
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Currently:
BMW E46 320i Touring
BMW E34 525TDS Touring
VW T3 panel van 1.6d
Opel Kadett C1 Caravan 1.2
Fiat 411R
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big02
Part of things
Posts: 62
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A common issue related to vague steering on e30, e36 and e46 is the wearing out of a rubber bush in one of the steering joints.
Not sure if a direct replacement is available, it is for the e30 but not for the e36. Some people simply delete the rubber coupling and use bolts as spacers and report a better more positive feel when driving, The downside being a bit of feedback via the wheel.
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I used to run a garage specialising in BMWs and MINIs. But I didn't see every problem on every car so I still like to ask for opinions when I come across an issue I don't have a 100% diagnosis for. But I do know RealOEM pretty well. There were some other places that were very useful. For instance BMW did offer a direct line to Munich under the right to repair scheme which we used a lot. You could give them the fault codes from the reader and describe the symptoms and they'd return with a troubleshooting plan and provide follow-up until the issue was solved. They did diagnose an engine rebuild incorrectly though and that was a tricky one to deal with. It was the early days of the Prince engine with the dodgy camshafts and all the engine required was a camshaft kit but they diagnosed a failed engine which would have to be rebuilt! |
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On an e46 the front lower control arm bushings die young and usually cause brake wobble (as above) but can also make the steering a bit vague as they toe all over the place.
Rear trailing arm bushes also go soft and cause the handling to go a bit wobbly, but it's a general wooliness and not an 'in the steering' type feeling.
Also mismatched/delaminated/cheap and nasty tyres can cause weird handling, but I'd definitely start with a wheel alignment. If the static toe isn't right then you'll have all kinds of strange behavior like you describe. Good luck!
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1964 Daimler 2.5 V8 (project)
2015 Disco 4 SDV6
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Mar 12, 2022 13:22:51 GMT
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Mine has seen most of the front suspension replaced before the problem finally disappeared altogether. Front control arms are a big difference, but mostly the rear bushing. I replaced those with PU bushings and this worked wonders. Sadly this is not streetlegal in Belgium so I had to take them off again which clearly made the ride more wobbly again. I have these laying around so if these are legal in the UK I'd be happy to ship them your way! Are you sure there is no play in the rack itself? These racks do start to wear out in the connection where the rubber hose is. These can be refurbished. (FEBI make these parts) It's rather easy to check these if you have a companion at the steering wheel! I have yet to do mine, but the play in these is tolerable at the moment. Lastly: mine had play in the upper steering joint. This is a universal joint behind the dash. Rather expensive to replace, and a definite PITA to remove. Mine has only 200.000km on the clock at this moment so anything is possible Tracking does make a huge difference, but as long as you have some play in the system it wont last... If you have those bushes spare I'd like to get them. |
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ChasR
RR Helper
motivation
Posts: 10,297
Club RR Member Number: 170
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BMW e46 vague steeringChasR
@chasr
Club Retro Rides Member 170
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Mar 13, 2022 10:23:56 GMT
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As what others have said.
There are 4 core things which can make these vague
-Front Control Arm Bushings (aka Lollipop bushings). With a bearing puller, they are quite easy to change. Pattern bushings tend to be alot softer than genuine ones, even from Meyle. Poly bushes here can be a good choice
-Steering Coupler : I've seen a couple go bad, but it's not as common as you think. I'm still on my factory one, and it drives tighter on the steering than a few others examples I've been in. Maybe heat cycles kill them
-Rear Track Control Arm Bushings. These can play up, but the rear of the car will then think it's steering
-Tyres : I've driven these on either terrible tyres or good ones. On very old ageed and retreaded rubber, they are semi-lethal. I recall almost drifting a 328i in this state around Warwickshire one! I also recall it making the ESP go nuts as they were that terrible! Mediocre items should be OK on them.
I've driven one with terrible alignment (as in toe-ing) and it was not vague, albeit that car had a quicker steering rack.
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