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Apr 26, 2021 21:22:58 GMT
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So as those of you who have seen my econojag thread might recall we were in the process of moving house, this has now happened and I have a new garage which while a lot smaller than the old one is still a reasonable sized double.
First thing to do is to insulate it to cut down the noise a bit as I can't imagine the neighbors in our new area are going to be as tolerant of my angle grinder!
I've been doing some research on how best to do this with what is reasonably cheaply available and have settled on:
Soundbloc plasterboard on the ceiling with 100mm of mineral wool insulation (I might increase this in future but it will do for a start as its easy to add more).
Build stud partitions around the side and rear walls and fill with mineral wool insulation and line in soundbloc plasterboard.
I still need to work out what to do with the doors.
I also bought 10 secondhand fluorescent lights from e-bay for £1.34 which was a bargain and should give me plent of light compared to the two that were in the garage originally.
So this is the garage when I started (nice and tidy as you can see):
First sheet of plasterboard going up, note that I have put foam tape on the underside of the trusses to cut down the transmission of sound.
Also note the plasterboard hoist, hired for £24 for the day from the local hire shop and worth its weight in gold, i've boarded ceilings before without one of these and its hard work on your own, with the sound bloc board its much heavier and I can't imagine how I would do it without one of these.
The boards slowly went up, more time was spent moving my junk around than fitting boards though!
I put one light up so I had some light to work and also because the lights in the garage are wired off the ground floor lights in the house so until I connected this up I couldn't turn the lights in the house back on.
More lights installed, one isn't working (might have to complain!).
Ran out of cable to wire up the last one, more ordered from Screwfix.
Today I made a start on studding out one of the walls, the timber stud that screws to the ceiling had a foam strip added to the back of it.
I did the same for the piece on the floor and also stood it on a piece of damp proof course.
The main thing is that the stud is spaced away from the outer wall which should help reduce the transfer of sound.
More studs to go in tomorrow then the cabling to put in for a socket (cables will run in void but the socket will be surface mounted not recessed).
That brings us up to date, still a long way to go.
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Flynn
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 143 
Club RR Member Number: 166
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New Garage for EconojagFlynn
@flynn
Club Retro Rides Member 166
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Apr 26, 2021 21:56:23 GMT
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Looks great so far, well done. I am watching with interest as I am intending to do something similar with mine.
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1971 MGB GT
1983 Daimler Sovereign 4.2
1999 Jaguar XJR
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Looks great so far, well done. I am watching with interest as I am intending to do something similar with mine. I am hoping that it will cut the sound down to an acceptable level but it will be interesting to see, one other issue is that because the garage is attached to the house noise travels into the house as well so i'm going to do all the walls. I think sealing the garage doors will be a challenge. The other concern I have is that plasterboard is paper faces and i'm not sure how it will get on when the inevitable grinder sparks hit it, i'm thinking I might paint it all in masonry paint to provide a semi protective layer. As with econojag I will keep a spreadsheet of the cost and see what the total is. |
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You can get intumescent paint but it is pretty pricy, I've cut plenty of walls and never seen the masonry paint burn so I reckon that will do the job for the odd spark.
As you say the doors will be the problem, you can't add much weight to an up and over door as they won't open, if you can find the funds roller doors would be better (if you can fit them yourself they are not too expensive)
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New Garage for Econojagballbagbagins
@ballbagbagins
Club Retro Rides Member 164
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You've gone about this very well, the foam tape and keeping the stud work off the walls. On the house wall I'd go with two sheets of the plasterboard with the joins offset.
You can bond the two layers of plasterboard with green glue, it's a permanently flexible adhesive that decouples the two layers.
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Apr 27, 2021 12:50:50 GMT
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You've gone about this very well, the foam tape and keeping the stud work off the walls. On the house wall I'd go with two sheets of the plasterboard with the joins offset. You can bond the two layers of plasterboard with green glue, it's a permanently flexible adhesive that decouples the two layers. I will see how I get on with the single layout of soundbloc and if that isn't enough I will look at doubling it up to improve things.
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Apr 27, 2021 13:15:43 GMT
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Clearly a lot of thought going into this task. Re the timber stud-work, of late I have been following several renovation projects being carried out in France, and one of the things that interested me was the way in which the French undertake stud-work. It would appear that all of this work is completed using steel studding, which can be cut with a pair of metal shears; they punch holes in it for wiring etc... with a another hand held pair of what look like pliers, but leave a circular hole; where the base rail and the ceiling rail has the vertical piece inserted, they do so and then twist the upright, which then locks into place. Using another set of pliers type gadget, where the two individual sections cross they clip another hole to lock the two together. There purpose made plastic tags to help secure insulation, and finally the plasterboard is screwed directly to the metal studding; the joints between boards are taped over and skimmed. I appreciate that such studding is used here in UK, but I would think that their Building Regs. perhaps dictate the use of metal studs. They all seem to use lasers to identify levels, both vertical and horizontal as well. Maybe it's just me, but very clean and neat way to go; has kept me amused whilst watching it all. Keep up the good work.
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cortinaman
Part of things
Posts: 948
Member is Online
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Apr 27, 2021 13:18:00 GMT
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I wouldn't worry about the paper faces from a catching fire point of view, but they are designed to be skimmed or at least painted - so I would definately get some paint on them - emulsion would be fine.
You don't need intumescent paint - such stuff is designed to swell up to protect a surface in the event of a fire, so not needed here!
For sound transfer, I would look at taping and skimming the joints, as any slight gap between the boards will let sound through.
The garage looks great - they always look better with a Mk2 Jag in them!
cheers
Cortinaman
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Old Fords never die they just go sideways
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Apr 27, 2021 20:10:29 GMT
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Clearly a lot of thought going into this task. Re the timber stud-work, of late I have been following several renovation projects being carried out in France, and one of the things that interested me was the way in which the French undertake stud-work. It would appear that all of this work is completed using steel studding, which can be cut with a pair of metal shears; they punch holes in it for wiring etc... with a another hand held pair of what look like pliers, but leave a circular hole; where the base rail and the ceiling rail has the vertical piece inserted, they do so and then twist the upright, which then locks into place. Using another set of pliers type gadget, where the two individual sections cross they clip another hole to lock the two together. There purpose made plastic tags to help secure insulation, and finally the plasterboard is screwed directly to the metal studding; the joints between boards are taped over and skimmed. I appreciate that such studding is used here in UK, but I would think that their Building Regs. perhaps dictate the use of metal studs. They all seem to use lasers to identify levels, both vertical and horizontal as well. Maybe it's just me, but very clean and neat way to go; has kept me amused whilst watching it all. Keep up the good work. I work in construction and timber studding is very rarely used on commercial projects its all metal as its easier to cut, less labour intensive and the metal is always straight unlike timber!
One of the issues with cables in metal studs is they all need to be contained in conduit/kopex to stop the sharp metal from damaging the cable.
For me doing it at home timber was a lot cheaper and i'm a tight git!
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Clearly a lot of thought going into this task. Re the timber stud-work, of late I have been following several renovation projects being carried out in France, and one of the things that interested me was the way in which the French undertake stud-work. It would appear that all of this work is completed using steel studding, which can be cut with a pair of metal shears; they punch holes in it for wiring etc... with a another hand held pair of what look like pliers, but leave a circular hole; where the base rail and the ceiling rail has the vertical piece inserted, they do so and then twist the upright, which then locks into place. Using another set of pliers type gadget, where the two individual sections cross they clip another hole to lock the two together. There purpose made plastic tags to help secure insulation, and finally the plasterboard is screwed directly to the metal studding; the joints between boards are taped over and skimmed. I appreciate that such studding is used here in UK, but I would think that their Building Regs. perhaps dictate the use of metal studs. They all seem to use lasers to identify levels, both vertical and horizontal as well. Maybe it's just me, but very clean and neat way to go; has kept me amused whilst watching it all. Keep up the good work. I work in construction and timber studding is very rarely used on commercial projects its all metal as its easier to cut, less labour intensive and the metal is always straight unlike timber!
One of the issues with cables in metal studs is they all need to be contained in conduit/kopex to stop the sharp metal from damaging the cable.
For me doing it at home timber was a lot cheaper and i'm a tight git!
Thank you for the reply, I understand the fact that electrical cables require some form of protection, when used in conjunction with metal stud work. My comments were not meant to be critical of your chosen method of construction; it merely interested me how the French work, as opposed to the common method used here in UK. Good work, keep it up. |
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bstardchild
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 14,968
Club RR Member Number: 71
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New Garage for Econojagbstardchild
@bstardchild
Club Retro Rides Member 71
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Apr 28, 2021 11:40:54 GMT
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I used foil backed bubblewrap (Insulation) - attached with spray carpet adhesive on my up and over door - had two benefits - definately reduced noise transmission and stopped the condensation issues I had in winter (heating the garage resulted in condensation on the metal door)
I did it for the condensation issues but the sound reduction was an added bonus
I think I have a fairly big roll of it left - certainly enough to do 2 up and over doors but I have no idea how far away you are from Norfolk
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I used foil backed bubblewrap (Insulation) - attached with spray carpet adhesive on my up and over door - had two benefits - definately reduced noise transmission and stopped the condensation issues I had in winter (heating the garage resulted in condensation on the metal door) I did it for the condensation issues but the sound reduction was an added bonus I think I have a fairly big roll of it left - certainly enough to do 2 up and over doors but I have no idea how far away you are from Norfolk That sounds like something worth considering for the doors, I'm up in the Midlands so unfortunately a long way from you. Where did you buy it from? |
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bstardchild
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 14,968
Club RR Member Number: 71
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New Garage for Econojagbstardchild
@bstardchild
Club Retro Rides Member 71
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I used foil backed bubblewrap (Insulation) - attached with spray carpet adhesive on my up and over door - had two benefits - definately reduced noise transmission and stopped the condensation issues I had in winter (heating the garage resulted in condensation on the metal door) I did it for the condensation issues but the sound reduction was an added bonus I think I have a fairly big roll of it left - certainly enough to do 2 up and over doors but I have no idea how far away you are from Norfolk That sounds like something worth considering for the doors, I'm up in the Midlands so unfortunately a long way from you. Where did you buy it from? It was surplus from a lagging project at work so no idea where it was sourced from - I don’t think it has any labels left on it either - I had 4 rolls but shared them out amongst local club members |
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Screwfix/ took station/ Wickes do it, many different versions and qualities are available.
I normally use tri-iso which is a multilayer foil and fibre insulation in loft conversions as it's thinner than the equivalent thickness of kingspan.
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I've been a bit lapse in updating this thread and will try and get some pictures up soon, I also had a diversion while I relaid most of the patio because it hadn't been laid correctly originally by whoever did it for the previous owners and most of the slabs were loose and rocking.
The walls are now all boarded and the lights are in, I even have a loft hatch £5 from facebook marketplace!
I've painted most of the walls, just a bit left to do and i've even started fitting the skirting board (actually old bed slats to provide some protection to the bottom of the wall when i'm sweeping up.
I've now started to think about painting the floor, there are lots of different floor paint manufacturers but i'm not sure what to go for, does anyone have any recommendations?
The floor is bare concrete and is around 20 years old, i'm leaning towards an epoxy type but I don't know how much I will need, the floor area is around 30m2.
Any recommendations? Ideally I want to paint it in two halfs as I can't really empty the garage completely but I'm not sure how feasible that is?
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jamesd1972
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,921
Club RR Member Number: 40
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New Garage for Econojagjamesd1972
@jamesd1972
Club Retro Rides Member 40
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Last house (which had a garage !) we sealed the concrete with concrete sealer then painted with some left over from work non-slip floor paint.
Two bits I'd pass on from this, firstly you need to seal the concrete as the bit that was painted without flaked up. Secondly the thought of a non-slip is a great one until you try and sweep up and everything sticks to it. When we used epoxy floors at work all the effort went into the prep but long term they were much better lasting. Epoxy will be slippy until the sheen wears off but will be easier to keep clean in the long term.
Good luck.
James
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Have a look at vinyl floor tiles, mainly the commercial ones, they are bonded to the concrete using a latex glue. Had them fitted in my last workshop and they were very durable, easy to sweep or mop. Did put a piece of plywood underneath axle stands or in the direction of the sparks from the angle grinder for added protection. Would also allow you to fit around moving belongings.
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Here are a few photos of progress.
So its now all empty ready to paint the floor, then I can start trying to organise it, its going to be a challenge to squeeze what I need into it and I will need some high level storage shelves/cupboards I think.
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Jul 30, 2021 16:06:14 GMT
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I'm afraid i've not been good a taking photos so don't have any of the floor, suffice to say it looked amazing when first painted but it has already picked up a few minor scuffs from dragging trolley jacks around on it, tool boxes etc. Onto the next problem, storage. I wanted some old kitchen cupboards to put on the walls to give me more storage but without lots of open shelves to gather dust. I watched e-bay and facebook marketplace and saw a few but people wanted so much for old second hand Spammy spam spam spam, no thank you, man. it was unbelievable. One near me was £350, then reduced to £150 and after a few days still listed so I asked if they would sell the wall cupboards seperately and after another week they said I could come and take what I wanted for £20. To be fair the wall cupboards are fine and just what I wanted and I was happy with the price but the base units (which I left) were totally knackered and one of the units had been fixed together with huge nails. Generally the base units and the unit around the boiler were a mess. How on earth anyone thought they were going to get someone to pay them £350 for these is beyond me. Some people are just nuts! They were also thick with grease which fortunatley cleaned up ok with some thinners, they aren't good enough to put into a house but fine for my garage. I have hung them up and now have loads of storage which is great (will soon be filled though when I start bringing stuff up from my mums where its stored). I used some old wood salvaged from the pallet the plasterboard was delivered on to space them off the wall over the conduits and also to spread the load onto the studs rather then using plasterboard fixings so they will take more weight. This is the start of the installation.
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