markbognor
South East
Posts: 9,970
Club RR Member Number: 56
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Oct 30, 2007 11:24:35 GMT
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Obviously they had gas to weld big bits of metal with, but it's hard to do bodywork with.
When did arc/mig/tig etc start to be used.
Is using the wrong type of welding on your trad rod/sled as bad as having alternators and radial tyres?
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Oct 30, 2007 11:28:34 GMT
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from what ive heard gas is better for bodywork, infact, those in the know say gas is best all round!
Also means you have cutting torch facilities ;D
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Davenger
Club Retro Rides Member
It's only metal
Posts: 7,272
Club RR Member Number: 140
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Oct 30, 2007 11:38:59 GMT
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Gas is lovely for welding, just takes a bit more patience and skill. Which is probably why MIG became so popular, it's easier
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Oct 30, 2007 11:42:58 GMT
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The trad method of welding was gas.
Apparently thats how leadsleds got their name - through all the lead filler needed to smooth the distortions in the bodywork caused by gas welding! ;D
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Old Fords never die they just go sideways
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Oct 30, 2007 11:43:51 GMT
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Gas should distort less than mig, but ive never tried it. I guess it depends how good you are.
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Oct 30, 2007 11:45:21 GMT
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So do you prefer MIG and filler or gas and lead-loading?
There's a pervy bit of me that likes the latter...But my head says the former is quicker and easier...
*n
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Top grammar tips! Bought = purchased. Brought = relocated Lose = misplace/opposite of win. Loose = your mum
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Davenger
Club Retro Rides Member
It's only metal
Posts: 7,272
Club RR Member Number: 140
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Oct 30, 2007 11:48:35 GMT
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I'm perving right with you penski, but like you say, mig is quicker and easier
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Oct 30, 2007 11:48:55 GMT
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personaly, ive only ever used mig, but have been thinking about getting a gas set recently, purely for the ability to weld bodywork without to much distortion.
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Oct 30, 2007 11:52:28 GMT
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Gas should distort less than mig, but ive never tried it. I guess it depends how good you are. Not for me - mig distorts less. Maybe if you're a top gas welder you can do it without distortion, but then you'd be good enough to mig weld without distortion too. If I was going to put half a door skin on, a thin panel with gentle curves and unsupported for most of its area, I'd mig weld it. There isn't enough filler in the world to cover up my abilities with gas on a repair like that
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Oct 30, 2007 11:54:41 GMT
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For the record, I can't weld for wibblepoo.
I spent two years in high school practicing several times a week but it just never clicked with me :/
*n
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Top grammar tips! Bought = purchased. Brought = relocated Lose = misplace/opposite of win. Loose = your mum
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Oct 30, 2007 12:01:27 GMT
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Obviously they had gas to weld big bits of metal with, but it's hard to do bodywork with. No one has piped up yet, but they primarily BRAZED. Then used lead filler.
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Team Blitz Ford Capri parts worldwide: Restoration, Road, or Race. Used, Repro, and NOS, ranging from scabby to perfect. Itching your Capri jones since 1979! Buy, sell, trade. www.teamblitz.com blitz@teamblitz.com
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Oct 30, 2007 12:14:51 GMT
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If I was going to put half a door skin on, a thin panel with gentle curves and unsupported for most of its area, I'd mig weld it. There isn't enough filler in the world to cover up my abilities with gas on a repair like that A Mates Dad, can properly gas weld, seen him do a lower half door skin repair, butt joint and gas welded Sunk the door and the bottom of the new panel into a water tank while welding to pull the heat out of it No distortion at all, planished flat with a Hammer and dolly and then stretched over the frame..... just a light High build primer coat flatted back is all that was needed...... lovely to watch, but I couldnt do it Or Nick Paravanni over at Competition Fabrications...... he gas welds everything, including Aluminium bodywork, and that really is an Art its great though as it doesnt split in an accident like Tig welded Alloy, the welds are strong and the heat affected zone is much larger so it doesnt work harden at the edge of it like Tig welding Alloy does...... I`d love to be able to afford to go and work for him for nothing for a year just to learn...... sadly I fear he will have retired before I could afford to do that
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Oct 30, 2007 17:56:01 GMT
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Gas 'hammer' welding was popular in the day, the welds being hammered flat taking the heat distortion out of the panels whilst still warm. It's very easy to get wrong as I found out when I pulled loads and loads of filler out of the original shell on my Magnette (27mm thick in places ). It was so badly distorted that I had to make the choice of refilling or reshell..... I chose to reshell.
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Aircooled is cool.......
But V8 is great!!!!!!
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slater
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 6,390
Club RR Member Number: 78
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Oct 30, 2007 18:17:05 GMT
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Anyone tryed mig brazing yet? I'm considering getting hold of some wire because even with mig i get a bit of distorsion and i hate fillerwork!
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Seth
South East
MorrisOxford TriumphMirald HillmanMinx BorgwardIsabellaCombi
Posts: 15,536
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Oct 30, 2007 19:05:35 GMT
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Gas welding would have been used by those with more money and experience but a lot of the home builders and modifiers used the only cheap means available which was "stick" arc welding. Not exactly conducive to quality bodywork but it was possible to build a channelled car in a shonky home-built kind of way (remember the metal on 30's car bodies is more substantial than modern stuff!) Gas welding is definitely king as far as I am concerned. Just wish I could afford the gear, time, space etc to do it at home. Its not exactly ideal for outside work either... The main reason it is so good for bodywork is that the weld remains soft unlike the rock hard join you get with mig. That's what allows it to be hammer formed. You can also use the gas torch to heat areas to allow you to shrink and otherwise form the metal too and weld without any filler rod too. Note the mismatch of the window swage line in this in progress shot. Compare with the finished item!
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Follow your dreams or you might as well be a vegetable.
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Oct 30, 2007 19:08:12 GMT
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Wow! impressive. Magic infact! I'd rely on filler for that.
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it doesn't matter if it's a Morris Marina or a Toyota Celica - it's what you do with it that counts
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Seth
South East
MorrisOxford TriumphMirald HillmanMinx BorgwardIsabellaCombi
Posts: 15,536
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Oct 30, 2007 19:14:17 GMT
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Wow! impressive. Magic infact! It certainly is! I should have made clear that its not my work. I enjoy standing back and observing this stuff being carried out by those that know.
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Follow your dreams or you might as well be a vegetable.
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markbognor
South East
Posts: 9,970
Club RR Member Number: 56
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Oct 30, 2007 19:43:26 GMT
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Cheers for all the well informed responses guys. I was sure that gas must have been used really and like others have said it would be a more useful tool for those skilled enough to use it than juat a machine that can weld.
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John
Part of things
Posts: 347
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Oct 30, 2007 20:13:30 GMT
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I am interested in MIG braze too. It is used a lot on production cars. I will have to do some research.
As has been said gas welds are more ductile and gas is the tool for body work IF you have the skill to hammer weld, shrink and stretch. Its easy to end up with a back of wallnuts!
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sav
Part of things
Posts: 842
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Oct 30, 2007 21:25:08 GMT
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I believe MIG brazing is used these days in order to preserve the strength of the heat treated steels.
Would be certainly interesting to learn more on the subject.
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