|
|
Mar 10, 2020 22:16:57 GMT
|
Yea, seems that way. I’ve had the same set of Taskmaster spanner’s I bought when I was an apprentice. Probably about 10 years ago now. I’ve looked after them, and, well, they still undo nuts and bolts, and no better or worse because of the brand name on them. I also have a lot of Halfords tooling from when I first started too, I’ve killed a few ratchet spanners but that is from downright abuse. I’ve got loads of gear from loads of manufacturers. Quite simply Snap On is the best. Everyone knows it, it widely excepted that is the case, that’s why it’s in its 100th year, this year. Yes there is the argument of cost & I’d agree, it’s never going to be for everyone, but it IS the best It might be the best in the “back street garage big sticker on a red tool chest” bragging rights contest but not in an engineering sense. My dad was a mechanical engineer his whole life, who fixed his own cars in the early days, and I remember talking to him about tools and SnapOn and he said they were overpriced rubbish. He never used one brand, each tool was selected as to who made the best for each task. As he was used to building and maintaining multi million pound machines in high end production lines I think I’d take his word for it over someone whose trying to justify all that money they spent on the “cool” brand of tools. Anyway - my choice of tool would be a proper UK made Record vice, one of the big engineering ones or the unbreakable red Record vices. It’s amazing you can get one second hand for less than £100 when a comparable new one would be several hundred if not nearing a thousand pounds - and the quality and longevity might not be the same as the old versions.
|
|
The Millenium Volcon"Get yourself a Volvo if that's what you really want, you might be dead next year. In the meantime, you could be going sideways in a gigantic land barge."
|
|
|
|
|
Mar 10, 2020 22:21:22 GMT
|
I have wera Allen keys. They’re very good except they have an annoying lack of continuity across their range. I bought their stainless imperial set in a pouch and I love em. But they don’t do a corresponding stainless metric set in a pouch to match. I don’t like the handles on their screwdrivers either. Very well regarded in cycling workshops too - they are the ones to get for most bike mechanics - used 85% of the time on bikes. I still need to buy some myself!!
|
|
The Millenium Volcon"Get yourself a Volvo if that's what you really want, you might be dead next year. In the meantime, you could be going sideways in a gigantic land barge."
|
|
|
|
Mar 10, 2020 22:49:45 GMT
|
On the socket and spanner discussion, I bought the best socket set I could afford as an apprentice (on £58 a week).... so not great, think it was a draper. But as I broke bits, I replaced them with better components, I still have some draper sockets that haven’t been used, so haven’t broken. But the rest is mostly Britool or Gedore. Similar thing with spanners. I appreciate that poor quality tools can cause damage or problems, but I think it’s better to have cheap ring spanners than an adjustable or just a set of cheap combination spanners, and it’s easy to get hung up on a name and buy stuff you’ll not use. I’ve bought Tom mostly Halfords stuff, it’s much better quality than what what I could afford 30 years ago. And probably I’d chose something already mentioned first, so I’ll add ratchet spanners as my choice
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
On the socket and spanner discussion, i prefer a matte finish to the glossy chrome, like Hazet or Stahlwille. Their quality is on par with Snap-on. And so are the socket sets from Koken. If you are on a budget, look for Hans tools.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I’ve got loads of gear from loads of manufacturers. Quite simply Snap On is the best. Everyone knows it, it widely excepted that is the case, that’s why it’s in its 100th year, this year. Yes there is the argument of cost & I’d agree, it’s never going to be for everyone, but it IS the best It might be the best in the “back street garage big sticker on a red tool chest” bragging rights contest but not in an engineering sense. My dad was a mechanical engineer his whole life, who fixed his own cars in the early days, and I remember talking to him about tools and SnapOn and he said they were overpriced rubbish. He never used one brand, each tool was selected as to who made the best for each task. As he was used to building and maintaining multi million pound machines in high end production lines I think I’d take his word for it over someone whose trying to justify all that money they spent on the “cool” brand of tools. Anyway - my choice of tool would be a proper UK made Record vice, one of the big engineering ones or the unbreakable red Record vices. It’s amazing you can get one second hand for less than £100 when a comparable new one would be several hundred if not nearing a thousand pounds - and the quality and longevity might not be the same as the old versions. First of all is just like to apologise unreservedly about my comments on Snap On tools. Clearly they are no good whatsoever. I mean some guys on here have even bought cheap stuff 20 yrs ago that hasn’t broke so it must be that the cheap stuff is obviously better. Also a Snap On torque wrench needed mending a couple of times at some point, so wow, it’s just tat. Not only that but a bloke who was a mechanical engineer says ‘it’s rubbish’, so that must true & I’m definitely just deluded in my thoughts & will now promise to only buy Kamasa in future.
|
|
|
|
Rich
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 6,239
Club RR Member Number: 160
|
|
|
It might be the best in the “back street garage big sticker on a red tool chest” bragging rights contest but not in an engineering sense. My dad was a mechanical engineer his whole life, who fixed his own cars in the early days, and I remember talking to him about tools and SnapOn and he said they were overpriced rubbish. He never used one brand, each tool was selected as to who made the best for each task. As he was used to building and maintaining multi million pound machines in high end production lines I think I’d take his word for it over someone whose trying to justify all that money they spent on the “cool” brand of tools. Anyway - my choice of tool would be a proper UK made Record vice, one of the big engineering ones or the unbreakable red Record vices. It’s amazing you can get one second hand for less than £100 when a comparable new one would be several hundred if not nearing a thousand pounds - and the quality and longevity might not be the same as the old versions. First of all is just like to apologise unreservedly about my comments on Snap On tools. Clearly they are no good whatsoever. I mean some guys on here have even bought cheap stuff 20 yrs ago that hasn’t broke so it must be that the cheap stuff is obviously better. Also a Snap On torque wrench needed mending a couple of times at some point, so wow, it’s just tat. Not only that but a bloke who was a mechanical engineer says ‘it’s rubbish’, so that must true & I’m definitely just deluded in my thoughts & will now promise to only buy Kamasa in future.
|
|
|
|
LowStandards
Club Retro Rides Member
Bigging Up The Sum Sum Man Since '99
Posts: 2,638
|
|
Mar 11, 2020 10:13:12 GMT
|
First of all is just like to apologise unreservedly about my comments on Snap On tools. Clearly they are no good whatsoever. I mean some guys on here have even bought cheap stuff 20 yrs ago that hasn’t broke so it must be that the cheap stuff is obviously better. Also a Snap On torque wrench needed mending a couple of times at some point, so wow, it’s just tat. Not only that but a bloke who was a mechanical engineer says ‘it’s rubbish’, so that must true & I’m definitely just deluded in my thoughts & will now promise to only buy Kamasa in future. Not sure you're quite getting it. Snap On make some ok tools, they make some great tools, they make some mediocre tools. They also charge a premium for every tool. Are they worth the money? Hell, if you think so, go nuts, no ones stopping you. We can of course have the opinion there are much better tools out there for a serious amount of money less, they just lack the stamped in name you lust after so badly...
|
|
|
|
Dez
Club Retro Rides Member
And I won't sit down. And I won't shut up. And most of all I will not grow up.
Posts: 11,712
Club RR Member Number: 34
|
|
Mar 11, 2020 10:21:43 GMT
|
First of all is just like to apologise unreservedly about my comments on Snap On tools. Clearly they are no good whatsoever. I mean some guys on here have even bought cheap stuff 20 yrs ago that hasn’t broke so it must be that the cheap stuff is obviously better. Also a Snap On torque wrench needed mending a couple of times at some point, so wow, it’s just tat. Not only that but a bloke who was a mechanical engineer says ‘it’s rubbish’, so that must true & I’m definitely just deluded in my thoughts & will now promise to only buy Kamasa in future. No one has said snap on is rubbish. What they have called you up on is your statement that blindly decrees all snap on tools are better than any other tools just because they say snap-on on them. This is clearly plums. Snap-on sell you a brand image first and a tool second. They know this. It’s why a lot do their marketing is made on woolly blanket statements about everything they make being better, but with no specifics of why that is so. Other competing manufacturers tend to do the exact opposite with in depth coverage of specific technical features to undermine this approach. Snap-on has NEVER been better quality than brands like (old) Britool, gedore, stahlwille, Ko-Ken, and the like who concentrate less on brand image and more on making the damn tools. They just shout that they are a lot and eventually people start to believe the hype. Marketing first, product second. Truth is snap-on are the ‘best’ at very few things, but fairly good at a lot. Good enough to claim an overall brand image of perceived quality, built up over many years. They also make a strong link between price and quality, which may have existed 50 years ago but is totally gone now. Technological advancements in that time have brought the quality of cheap tools up to the point where the quality of any tool you will put on a fastener is greater than the quality of the fastener itself, making the fastener the fail point, not the tool. Compare a 50+ year old snap on ratchet to a brand new halfords one and the halfords one is easily better quality , purely because technology has come on so much in that time. In value for money terms snap-on present a poor choice, purely because everything they sell is priced so high. They also know this, it’s why blue point and eurotools exist, as they know they were/are loosing a huge about of sales to cheaper brands. They also know that other people make tools that are better than theirs in a lot of cases. That’s why they buy certain things from other manufacturers. Knipex and cebora are the first two that spring to mind. Snap-on only actually make their ‘core’ tools- spanners, sockets and ratchets etc., some of the screwdriver range. What is said above by minininjarob is totally accurate. If you want the best of everything you need to shop around and choose specific brands for specific things, as each manufacturer specialises in making one type of tool. Knipex for pliers, snips, etc., Pb Swiss or vessel for screwdrivers and other tipped tools, ko-ken for ratchets, Chicago pneumatic for air tools, etc. When it comes down to it spanners and sockets are now the area where quality matters least, as explained above.
|
|
Last Edit: Mar 11, 2020 10:22:52 GMT by Dez
|
|
melle
South West
It'll come out in the wash.
Posts: 1,983
|
|
Mar 11, 2020 10:31:15 GMT
|
Completely agree with Dez , shop around for what's fit for your purpose and budget. As much as I like Wera screwdrivers, I don't like their spanners and as much as I love Gedore 1B combis, I don't rate Gedore screwdrivers. There also are complete tool categories I dislike, like ratchet spanners (I have a set but I've never found a use for them) and impact guns (I can't stand the noise), but that doesn't mean that they're useless.
|
|
www.saabv4.com'70 Saab 96 V4 "The Devil's Own V4" '77 Saab 95 V4 van conversion project '88 Saab 900i 8V
|
|
|
|
Mar 11, 2020 10:37:42 GMT
|
Probably the 2 most important things:
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Mar 11, 2020 13:34:18 GMT
|
First of all is just like to apologise unreservedly about my comments on Snap On tools. Clearly they are no good whatsoever. I mean some guys on here have even bought cheap stuff 20 yrs ago that hasn’t broke so it must be that the cheap stuff is obviously better. Also a Snap On torque wrench needed mending a couple of times at some point, so wow, it’s just tat. Not only that but a bloke who was a mechanical engineer says ‘it’s rubbish’, so that must true & I’m definitely just deluded in my thoughts & will now promise to only buy Kamasa in future. No one has said snap on is rubbish. What they have called you up on is your statement that blindly decrees all snap on tools are better than any other tools just because they say snap-on on them. This is clearly plums. Snap-on sell you a brand image first and a tool second. They know this. It’s why a lot do their marketing is made on woolly blanket statements about everything they make being better, but with no specifics of why that is so. Other competing manufacturers tend to do the exact opposite with in depth coverage of specific technical features to undermine this approach. Snap-on has NEVER been better quality than brands like (old) Britool, gedore, stahlwille, Ko-Ken, and the like who concentrate less on brand image and more on making the damn tools. They just shout that they are a lot and eventually people start to believe the hype. Marketing first, product second. Truth is snap-on are the ‘best’ at very few things, but fairly good at a lot. Good enough to claim an overall brand image of perceived quality, built up over many years. They also make a strong link between price and quality, which may have existed 50 years ago but is totally gone now. Technological advancements in that time have brought the quality of cheap tools up to the point where the quality of any tool you will put on a fastener is greater than the quality of the fastener itself, making the fastener the fail point, not the tool. Compare a 50+ year old snap on ratchet to a brand new halfords one and the halfords one is easily better quality , purely because technology has come on so much in that time. In value for money terms snap-on present a poor choice, purely because everything they sell is priced so high. They also know this, it’s why blue point and eurotools exist, as they know they were/are loosing a huge about of sales to cheaper brands. They also know that other people make tools that are better than theirs in a lot of cases. That’s why they buy certain things from other manufacturers. Knipex and cebora are the first two that spring to mind. Snap-on only actually make their ‘core’ tools- spanners, sockets and ratchets etc., some of the screwdriver range. What is said above by minininjarob is totally accurate. If you want the best of everything you need to shop around and choose specific brands for specific things, as each manufacturer specialises in making one type of tool. Knipex for pliers, snips, etc., Pb Swiss or vessel for screwdrivers and other tipped tools, ko-ken for ratchets, Chicago pneumatic for air tools, etc. When it comes down to it spanners and sockets are now the area where quality matters least, as explained above. I disagree, I have snap on screws drivers I’ve had over 35 yrs & the point is they are infinite because they will always be replaced. That fact alone makes them fantastic value for money. I might have paid a higher price at the time but I’ll NEVER have to buy them again. The same goes for spanner’s sockets etc. Let’s take a snap on socket for example, there is quite simply nothing else out there, so thin walled. I grant you it’s Somy you may need on one job once in a blue moon, but if you have a bolt down in a counter bore & it’s close to the side walls NOTHING else will do it. You say ‘no one said they are rubbish’ if you look again at the thread they did. With regards to the lecture on snap on as a company & their strategy, I understand it very well, I was a Snap On Dealer from 89 to 91, so fully understand how they operate. I will also say, I hated that job, but that was just a personal thing, I went from being a mechanic to that & didn’t settle, so went back on the spanner’s again. It didn’t alter my opinion on their products though. I’m not a ‘brand junky’ never have been, which how most people seem to justify their ‘not’ buying them, coz it’s just paying for the name, I’d disagree. If you look at my original post it was a combo spanner made by snap on, that was it. The op question was what essential would be in your box, I made a statement, end of. 😀
|
|
|
|
cb11acd
Part of things
Posts: 132
Club RR Member Number: 122
|
|
Mar 11, 2020 13:41:36 GMT
|
Ok. can we stop talking about Snap-On now. You have all said your part, lets move on. With the above safety gear I would also add:
Full face masks.
Protect your face a bit more while grinding, also good if your under a car and you have rust falling on your face, stops it going in your mouth etc.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Mar 11, 2020 14:21:15 GMT
|
Think i've mentioned this in a previous post somewhere, but this... is really useful..not just for brake springs. My other most useful tool is a 1 1/2' bar that slips over most breaker bars/socket wrench handles for the times when you need just a bit more leverage.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Mar 11, 2020 15:57:24 GMT
|
While we're on the subject of PPE gear, I've been using Mechanix gloves for quite a few years. They're excellent for protecting your hands when going heavier mechanical work, saved me from many a skinned knuckle and just last weekend my latest pair saved me from a worse injury when a grinder flapdisk met my thumb. It still gave me a nibble, and there's a hole in my glove now, but it would have been worse without them. Additionally if you have a day job where your hands need to be presentable, or your other half doesn't appreciate grimey fingernails, they keep the worst of the muck off. I've found dexterity is still surprisingly good and I can still use a touchscreen phone with them on although accuracy suffers! Also, a box of latex or nitrile gloves for other, lighter, dirty jobs are really handy (ha)
|
|
Last Edit: Mar 11, 2020 15:58:41 GMT by BenzBoy
|
|
hohocc
Part of things
Posts: 36
|
|
Mar 11, 2020 18:48:44 GMT
|
Dettol and Palmolive are some of my favourite tool manufacturers. They make stuff that comes in squirty bottles that once used up can be filled with dishwashing liquid and water, which is very useful for a bunch of little jobs in the garage.
|
|
|
|
timasorus
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 433
Club RR Member Number: 90
|
|
Mar 11, 2020 19:53:10 GMT
|
God tier tool
|
|
banditos ahoy!
|
|
gte86
Part of things
Posts: 611
|
|
Mar 11, 2020 20:00:39 GMT
|
A phone. Or someone that knows you are in the garage and will check if you are gone for ages. When I was building my XE Nova, aged 20, I had the engine slip off the jack and my hand got wedged between cambelt cover and the inner chassis rail. After a lot of swearing and realising I would have to wait 2 hours till dad came home to get help, I managed to find the super human strength I needed to lever it across (with a hammer) and pull my hand free. Could of been worse. Like the time it caught fire and dad put the car out instead of me. I suppose fire extinguisher is probably needed too
|
|
Last Edit: Mar 11, 2020 20:01:14 GMT by gte86
|
|
lilbob
Part of things
Posts: 419
|
|
|
A phone. Or someone that knows you are in the garage and will check if you are gone for ages. When I was building my XE Nova, aged 20, I had the engine slip off the jack and my hand got wedged between cambelt cover and the inner chassis rail. After a lot of swearing and realising I would have to wait 2 hours till dad came home to get help, I managed to find the super human strength I needed to lever it across (with a hammer) and pull my hand free. Could of been worse. Like the time it caught fire and dad put the car out instead of me. I suppose fire extinguisher is probably needed too I totally agree with this
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
A phone. Or someone that knows you are in the garage and will check if you are gone for ages. When I was building my XE Nova, aged 20, I had the engine slip off the jack and my hand got wedged between cambelt cover and the inner chassis rail. After a lot of swearing and realising I would have to wait 2 hours till dad came home to get help, I managed to find the super human strength I needed to lever it across (with a hammer) and pull my hand free. Could of been worse. Like the time it caught fire and dad put the car out instead of me. I suppose fire extinguisher is probably needed too I totally agree with this A mate had a friend who was working under his VW bus alone when it caught fire. It slipped off the trolley jack as he was trying to get out and the rest doesn't need any further detail.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
A phone. Or someone that knows you are in the garage and will check if you are gone for ages. When I was building my XE Nova, aged 20, I had the engine slip off the jack and my hand got wedged between cambelt cover and the inner chassis rail. After a lot of swearing and realising I would have to wait 2 hours till dad came home to get help, I managed to find the super human strength I needed to lever it across (with a hammer) and pull my hand free. Could of been worse. Like the time it caught fire and dad put the car out instead of me. I suppose fire extinguisher is probably needed too It's very often worth having something around that you don't need for the job, just to lever things or lift things if you need to - or the break the fall of something, like leaving wheels under cars you are working on. There's nothing more frustrating that not quite being able to reach the long bar that would be "just right" for levering the heavy thing off your little finger. Trouble is, many of us don't think of it until we hear a story like this.
|
|
|
|
|