steveg
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,586
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My Transit hasn't been used for a while and I noticed the central locking getting a bit slow.
It's got two batteries wired together, one might be the original and the other was replaced in 2016. Oddly the newer battery is completely flat, but does show green on the indicator, the old one has a whole 9 volts in it. To make things more interesting when the previous owner got the AA to change a battery they fitted one with a higher rating which isn't ideal.
It seems that the newer higher rated battery has just failed, now it's disconnected there is enough power in the older one to operate the central locking.
I don't fully understand the whole batteries in parallel thing, not sure if the newer battery hasn't been getting fully charged or if it has just failed.
My best plan at the moment is to remove both, try charging them up separately, and see what happens. I would rather not buy 2 but really want to end up with a matched pair.
Can anyone explain ?
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Hi, If you've got a battery that is below par and you connect a better battery in parallel, the good battery will try and charge the poor one because there's a differential. You then end up flattening the good one and the poor one doesn't end up any better. The ideal way is if you want to pair batteries on a permanent basis you should start off with two good batteries of the same spec. If they're are paired on a temporary basis then separate them when you leave them for any length of time ie overnight, so in your case charge them both separately and see if they end up with showing the same voltage, Leave them to rest for a while after charging before doing a volt check. Just fit a batt isolator in one of the link cables to separate them.
Colin
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Last Edit: Feb 4, 2018 20:51:05 GMT by colnerov
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steveg
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,586
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I hope trying to charge them will give an indication which is better it's just strange that the newer of the two batteries seems to have just died. It's a Yuasa so not a real cheapo one while the original one is Motorcraft.
Think it might be time to get a decent battery charger !
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you need a split charge relay to reliably run twin batteries.
Yuasa is usually from Halfords and they have a 4 or 5 years warranty IIRC, so may be worth taking it back.
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Is your vehicle 12 volt or 24 volt?
My brother-in-law has an Isuzu diesel powered Ford bus with 24 volt starter and 12 volt everything else. It runs a series parallel system. One day I went to start it and discovered that the lights had been left on and both batteries were dead flat. I charged them separately and then it worked perfectly. No idea how old the batteries were but the bus had been parked at our place for several years and only run maybe a couple of times a year just to keep it from seizing and it always started first push of the button.
Short answer fully charge both batteries and it should be fine.
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steveg
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,586
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you need a split charge relay to reliably run twin batteries. Yuasa is usually from Halfords and they have a 4 or 5 years warranty IIRC, so may be worth taking it back. I might give the number on the AA receipt a rings and see what they say. It's still in warranty, not sure if it makes a difference as I bought the van since the battery was fitted. I was surprised there isn't any form of split charging, it's just got two connectors per wire. I am pretty sure it's just 12 volt. The vans a 2005 one so I would hope Ford got it right. It starts unless it's very cold with the glow plugs disconnected (previous garage bodge due to a faulty glow plug I think) so the starter must have a good kick to get it spinning quickly. I've not had anything similar before and tried working out what was going on, ended up googling it but still wasn't sure. Thanks for the replies. |
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are they both under the drivers seat? as a factory fit thing ford definitely had a aplit charge relay.
05 would either be a 2.0 fwd or 2.4 rwd van, most variants don't use the glow plugs very much until its under freezing point.
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steveg
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,586
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Yes they are under the drivers seat but are both linked together, it's a 2.4 RWD. To be honest I haven't looked at the wiring but would expect there to be more if there was a split charging system. I will go and have a better look though as it could be the same bodger that cut the glow plug wiring out has been busy elsewhere.
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mk2cossie
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 3,063 
Club RR Member Number: 77
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Batteries wired in Parallel.mk2cossie
@mk2cossie
Club Retro Rides Member 77
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from previous experience with twin battery Transits, one is used for the starting, and the other for the auxiliary circuits when switched off. Had a few in for MOT, and the sidelights and hazard light test with the ignition off has the side lights dim and the hazards slow right down  Both batteries should be the same size though (rating wise, not necessarily the case size) , otherwise one is left out by the other when charging  |
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steveg
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,586
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This is what I have. No signs of bodgery and the extra socket has a proper blanking bit fitted.  I rang up a local auto electrical place and he suggested giving both the batteries a charge to see at they do. Just need to decide what charger to get. They have some GYS smart chargers that are similar to the Ctek ones you can get. I thought these were really just for top ups but the more expensive ones charge quite quickly. Not much info on the GYS ones but they look quite good. |
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Last Edit: Feb 5, 2018 15:55:20 GMT by steveg
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Stu
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,913
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Hi, I picked up a smart charger from Lidl the other week for £14 with 3 year warranty. Works great, I’ve used it on four or five different batteries so far.  IMG_7222 |
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Last Edit: Feb 5, 2018 22:13:16 GMT by Stu
'89 BMW E30 325i Sport, '04 MINI Cooper S, '09 Volvo V70 D5
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steveg
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,586
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Hi, I picked up a smart charger from Lidl the other week for £14 with 3 year warranty. Works great, I’ve used it on four or five different batteries so far. That looks very similar to the ones I have been looking at for £50-£60, there is just no way to tell whats inside the boxes. I will have a look for some more info about them thanks. |
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Stu
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,913
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Hi, I picked up a smart charger from Lidl the other week for £14 with 3 year warranty. Works great, I’ve used it on four or five different batteries so far. That looks very similar to the ones I have been looking at for £50-£60, there is just no way to tell whats inside the boxes. I will have a look for some more info about them thanks. No problem, I was recommended the Lidl charger by a few users on another forum who’d had them a while and found them to work well. Only drawback I’ve found is that you can’t put it on a timer as when you first power it up you need to press a button to switch to charging mode, that would reset if a timer cycled power. Aside from that, all good :-) |
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'89 BMW E30 325i Sport, '04 MINI Cooper S, '09 Volvo V70 D5
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ChasR
RR Helper
motivation
Posts: 10,309
Club RR Member Number: 170
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Batteries wired in Parallel.ChasR
@chasr
Club Retro Rides Member 170
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Hi, I picked up a smart charger from Lidl the other week for £14 with 3 year warranty. Works great, I’ve used it on four or five different batteries so far. That looks very similar to the ones I have been looking at for £50-£60, there is just no way to tell whats inside the boxes. I will have a look for some more info about them thanks. Honestly? No. They look like a Smart charger going by their cycles. They're comparable to a CTEK MXS 3.6 on the face of it, and are more versatile in terms of working with 6V batteries if you ever think you'll have some. But compared to a £60 item like the MXS 5.0? I doubt it. The MXS 5.0 like some of the Optimates and Ring Smart chargers have a reconditioning function which is very handy for making the battery acid more effective in severely flattened batteries. It will also have a supply mode which will act as a tender on a battery in case you are mapping your ECU with a dongle or on newer stuff cycling in electric handbrake calipers (EPBs) for the adjustment cycles. They also have "Comfort connectors. What this means is for a few quid you can buy a quick connector to connect to your battery or a postive and negative source in your car. They even do a cigar lighter attachment. With this it can make hooking the charger up alot easier. Some come with LED battery indicators : I have such a type on the M3 now that it is used less. The latter part sounds silly but anyone with an E36/46 Coupe or a Defender or MGB will appreciate the ease in having a simple connector to hook up a battery to as opposed to taking stuff apart. In the case of my friend that helps with the motorbikes of his  . |
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Last Edit: Feb 7, 2018 13:19:01 GMT by ChasR
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steveg
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,586
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Turns out that the newer Yuasa battery isn't very well. The Motorcraft one looks like it might be the original from when the van was new in 2005.
Before I bought the van it had sat for long periods of time and I wonder if the Yuasa one may have been shot for a while, depends if the van would have started on just one battery. It was probably jump started to get it to the last MOT just before I bought it.
Because the Motorcraft battery is a bit of a low rating, not that common meaning more expensive I bought a pair of new batteries which will hopefully give me a few years use without having to worry about them. Pretty much everything I have read has said running two different rated batteries is not the thing to do. Not particulary dangerous but you won't ever get the same life from them. Even having one new and one old one isn't great as any deterioration in the old battery will affect the new one as well.
Having spent any spare monay I had on the batteries I will have to stick with our old 1970's trickle charger for a while longer. In some ways this is better than the new automatic as it will at least try and charge really flat batteries. Messing about with it for a while it resurrected the silly tiny gel battery in my other halfs Mazda, for a while at least !
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Last Edit: Feb 8, 2018 9:29:55 GMT by steveg
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certainly does look like there's no split charging system there, I havent seen that before, usually just a single 019 under there which is usually more than enough.
Motorcraft would certainly be original to it, they do seem to last very well, have a look at the case on the Yuasa, the sides should all be flat and no bowing, there will be a date on the back sticker too, halfords often swap them without issue.
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Ryannn
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,424
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My Pajero has two batteries. One is wired to the car and the other only to the starter as a winter backup.
Because of the issues described above and the cost of replacing both, I’ve had the ‘backup’ disconnected for the last few years now. It doesn’t get cold enough here to warrant it. Hasn’t had and negative effects and I’ve just taped the ends of the cables up.
Suppose it depends whether you think you need both?.
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