BT
Posted a lot
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Nov 25, 2016 18:50:10 GMT
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Hello retro rides.
I have written this out a good few times over the last few weeks and every time it's a different vehicle and a thread that is way too long for what is a simple question, so I'll try to keep this one to the point.
I need to minimalise my stupid cars and replace them with something cheap, reliable and economic but whilst still being fun and something new at the same time.
I have whittled them down to a 6 pot early E36. The one I have found is a manual 320 M50 model from 1994.
What I need from the car is for it to average above 20mpg and complete about 15 miles a day in the week, and perhaps 100 every other weekend, not huge mileage. Although many may not consider them to be economic, if they're more than 20mpg they're hugely economic to me.
I'd need it to be comfortable and happily sit on the motorway at 70mph with out screaming it's nads off.
A lot of the aspects of it seem to work well, space wise it will do the job. Do the rear seats on all BMWs fold down or was it just a spec for skis or something? I would need to fit a few fishing rods in the back most weekends and fold down seats would be ideal.
I had an E46 a few years ago, the thing was nothing but trouble with some fancy feature failing every other week, that and the boot floor pulling itself to bits. I can only assume that an early E36 will not have so many features to fail?
Are there any areas of the E36 that I would want to keep an extra eye out for when viewing? Are there any jobs that are a right pain in the chuff and are best avoided?
I guess I'd just like to know if the E36 is a cool car? Are they reliable, what are they like to live with? Any major problems to be aware of?
Thanks for any help in advance.
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Last Edit: Jan 26, 2017 18:37:34 GMT by BT
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ChasR
RR Helper
motivation
Posts: 10,309
Club RR Member Number: 170
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E36 advice. ChasR
@chasr
Club Retro Rides Member 170
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The boot floor is a common issue to all E*6 BMWs. The E36 however does seem to do it less.
If it were me I would go with either a 325i or a later 323i. The 320is are not that good on fuel compared to their brethren and don't even have the performance of their larger brothers
Some will say the below is unfair and missing the point but bear with me:
I once drove an E39 520i 2.2 quite a bit. It wasn't the torquiest thing low down at all but it did make a nice sound and was a nice place to be. I remember when I sold him my Mk3 Ford Mondeo 2.5 Auto 5pd Mk3 he thought that was great on fuel. I never clicked as to why (it would do 22MPG around town even with you making progress and low to mid 30s on a run) until I drove that car.
Town? 17-19MPG with a gentle (and I mean holding people up behind me trying to build up speed) right foot and being smooth and not braking much.
Motorway? Better. 31MPG at 70MPH.
Other people seemed to have noted similar MPG, irrespective of the M50/M52 or M54 engine. Even the E30 320is were renowned for not being great on fuel compared to what the 325i offered. I know a guy who had a 320i 2.2i (albeit E46) reported similar figures.
In comparison:
E36 323i:
It had better low down torque by quite a way and IMO was surprisingly more frugal!
Town? - 28MPG ; I was shocked!
Motorway - 35MPG with me doing 80-85MPH on a cruise to Brighton
Average - 31MPG
I didn't own the car long enough!
E46 M3 3.2:
Low down I reckon a 3.0 would be better but when it comes on song it goes! Which makes the below surprising!
Town : with traffic around 19MPG
Motorway: I have just been to Guildford and back doing 80MPH all the way and it got 31MPG.
Average? I get around 23MPG and I do the open the taps on it now and again.
Compare it to the M3 and the 2.5s (and I suspect the 3.0) and the 2.0s don't look like a great deal.
ANYWAY, now I have that out of the way. What else?
They are cheap to maintain, but ensure you go with quality parts.
E30 lower arms fit the front and are cheaper.
Like the E46 lower arm bushes and rear trailing arm bushes can go
They seem to rust around the wheel arches and back of the sill
Ensure the coolant has been changed on time
IME they are intolerant to short journeys and poor servicing with regards to the breather system.
The M52 engines can gain around 20BHP from an inlet manifold swap (ala M50 manifold) and get better with a chip to get the full benefits.
Central locking can go funny on them due to the wiring chafing in the tailgate
Knocking from the rear can be down to either the rear shock mounts dying or the rear shelf rattling.
Only the Coupe and Touring seats fold down. The E36s don't ; it may have been an optional extra but I know the E36s I have seen (and my dad owned) didn't have it.
What went wrong on your E46? As for the boot floor you can now buy kits which I plan to fit onto my M3 just to keep things tickety boo.
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Last Edit: Dec 1, 2016 17:01:07 GMT by ChasR
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adam73bgt
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 5,004
Club RR Member Number: 58
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E36 advice. adam73bgt
@adam73bgt
Club Retro Rides Member 58
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I can't speak for the E36 specifically but I have the M50 2.0 engine in my E34 touring which is I a bit heavier and less aerodynamic than the '36 In my car its underpowered, although recently I've been driving with no interior (don't ask) and it feels better, so I suspect in an e36 it would feel fine Economy wise I believe I'm managing around 28mpg average which is mixed driving to and from work mostly. I'd expect a '36 could do low 30's at least But as Chas has pointed out, the 323i and I think even the 325i are still pretty affordable and might offer a bit more poke for similar economy figures so may be worth a look  |
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BT
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,772
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Jan 26, 2017 18:53:18 GMT
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ChasRI don't know how I totally forgot about this thread, but thanks for taking the time to reply in here with such worthwhile information. On my E46 o had issues with the ABS, always throwing the light on along with traction control, I'd read the fault replace the sensor reset the light and 50 miles down the road it would come back on but this time be a different component that had failed. It had really annoying faults with the parking sensors, coolant sensor and worst of all it ripped the diff mount out. I did however very nearly buy a black SMG M3 aboit 18 months ago, poor dealer service and after digging around and finding the previous owner on M3Cutters resulted in me walking away after being told what had been wrong with it earlier in life, frustrating really as my cousin had a 06 Imola red which was truly fantastic. I have found myself in a somewhat of a different position since starting this thread. I have a L200 18mpg zombie apocalypse looking thing which is fantastic but it's too big for what I need and I am looking to reduce my outgoings pending a property purchase, this is why once again I've come back to the E36. I have an incredibly limited budget and rather than buying some boring Astra or something I have found a local 316i coupe. At least I shouldn't need worry about the boot floor on this one. I don't want a rocket ship, nor do I want the trendiest thing in the world, however it would probably get some M3 wheels, leather interior and Msport bumpers or something along those lines. I just need something cheap to buy, run and maintain. I run perhaps 20 miles to and from work, could possibly rack up another 150 miles a weekend occasionally and would also use it a few times a year for a break away in the uk. The non-folding rear seat would be a PITA however this could be overcome with roof bars I suppose which I am more than ok with. MPG wise I am sure a LPG conversion could make things a little more bearable if they I am not getting the returns I want. The only thing I suspect the 316 may suffer with is maintaining modern day motorway speeds. I think I may have to arrange a viewing and go from there.
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BT
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,772
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Jan 26, 2017 19:02:48 GMT
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adam73bgtI was lent my friends E34 recently whilst he borrowed my truck and it was very nice, his one was the 3.0D so was no real comparison for what I'm looking at annoyingly. I don't know why I didn't think of it earlier but lpg could always be an option.
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BT
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,772
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Jan 26, 2017 19:42:19 GMT
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Jan 26, 2017 20:31:15 GMT
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adam73bgtI was lent my friends E34 recently whilst he borrowed my truck and it was very nice, his one was the 3.0D so was no real comparison for what I'm looking at annoyingly. I don't know why I didn't think of it earlier but lpg could always be an option. E34 only got a 2.5 diesel in the uk, 2.4 on older european variants, no 3.0 came in till late E39. |
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BT
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,772
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Jan 26, 2017 20:35:37 GMT
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welshpug Very well spotted, his was the E39. Not very clued up on the 5 series as you have just seen.
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g40jon
Posted a lot
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Jan 26, 2017 22:40:23 GMT
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My experience of the e36 3 series has been pretty positive. My first was an early 325i, no frills, no fancy gadgets to go wrong. Went well returned around 30 mpg on average. Wish I still had it! The second was a 316 coupe with lots of extras. Again couldn't fault it other than being insanely slow and still only averaged 30 mpg. It did throw up the abs sensor light every so often and the wipers failed due to a dry solder joint on the control relay module. My latest is an e36 318is 16v coupe. Nippy enough, good on fuel and overall a nice drive. Jacking points can rust if they have been abused, rear arches go if they aren't kept free of mud. Rear brake lines are prone to corroding. As others have said cooling system needs to be well looked after. Some models have a plastic impeller on the water pump which often give grief. Pretty sure you can replace with a metal varient. Oil changes need to be on time to ensure the chain doesn't stretch. Other than that they are pretty good for 25 year old design.  |
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ChasR
RR Helper
motivation
Posts: 10,309
Club RR Member Number: 170
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E36 advice. ChasR
@chasr
Club Retro Rides Member 170
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ChasRI don't know how I totally forgot about this thread, but thanks for taking the time to reply in here with such worthwhile information. On my E46 o had issues with the ABS, always throwing the light on along with traction control, I'd read the fault replace the sensor reset the light and 50 miles down the road it would come back on but this time be a different component that had failed. It had really annoying faults with the parking sensors, coolant sensor and worst of all it ripped the diff mount out. I did however very nearly buy a black SMG M3 aboit 18 months ago, poor dealer service and after digging around and finding the previous owner on M3Cutters resulted in me walking away after being told what had been wrong with it earlier in life, frustrating really as my cousin had a 06 Imola red which was truly fantastic. I have found myself in a somewhat of a different position since starting this thread. I have a L200 18mpg zombie apocalypse looking thing which is fantastic but it's too big for what I need and I am looking to reduce my outgoings pending a property purchase, this is why once again I've come back to the E36. I have an incredibly limited budget and rather than buying some boring Astra or something I have found a local 316i coupe. At least I shouldn't need worry about the boot floor on this one. I don't want a rocket ship, nor do I want the trendiest thing in the world, however it would probably get some M3 wheels, leather interior and Msport bumpers or something along those lines. I just need something cheap to buy, run and maintain. I run perhaps 20 miles to and from work, could possibly rack up another 150 miles a weekend occasionally and would also use it a few times a year for a break away in the uk. The non-folding rear seat would be a PITA however this could be overcome with roof bars I suppose which I am more than ok with. MPG wise I am sure a LPG conversion could make things a little more bearable if they I am not getting the returns I want. The only thing I suspect the 316 may suffer with is maintaining modern day motorway speeds. I think I may have to arrange a viewing and go from there. That is fair enough. The diff mount seems to be a common fault on all now! Mine are fine but I plan to reinforce my M3 for this reason ; £800 with the rear end polybushed in the mix is cheaper than £4k for a new floor! That and I can drive the car as it was intended to be ; HARD! That sounds like quite an unfortunate experience. I'm sort of helping a mate fix up an E46 328i with similar faults! We're making headway mind you! To be fair, I almost gave up buying an M3 and I saw 4 of them from £6k to £9k. I originally wanted a manual as it is what the forum and dick length lovers made out was the best choice for the "true" driving experience; I hated my manual 323i's 'box and my weekend car was an RST with a 4 paddle clutch which seemed better! But then a few folk told me the SMG wasn't that bad and after a week I wondered what the fuss was all about. Once you get your head around it the system is fine and TBH not a bad thing for a daily at all! But as you probably know M3s don't half consume cash! I've been tempted to put a thread up on here detailing what it has cost and what I saw for sale on here (there are people out there who still think you can buy a "mint" M3 for £7k which is unlikely unless you get lucky) but it seems it is a bit modern despite being in that tricky realm of "old" & "cheap" ; E36s M3s are more money now! Even the brakes with searching will cost £700 to replace with decent parts (they are floating discs remember) and that's before I get to the tyres which are massive 19" items. That reminds me; I need two  . Anyway, rant over . E36 328i not worth a go for you? I reckon that would fulfill your needs. I was going to suggest a 330i E46 but I can understand why you wouldn't want another one. Anyway, a thread always needs pics. That's my old 323i and my current M3.      |
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Last Edit: Jan 27, 2017 13:02:50 GMT by ChasR
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