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Great read. It's far more interesting reading about squeezing tens of horsepower out of an old Renault than the latest many hundred horsepower racing car. Glad to hear you seem to have solved the cooling issue. Having experience of converting 6v cars to 12v I can say that you won't regret it. It will make everything much easier and solve a lot of problems. It's also a good opportunity to add a decent temperature gauge.
If it's of any interest, the (really rather excellent) book 'Four Stroke Performance Tuning' by A Bell, has the following passage on rear engine cooling:
"Liquid cooled vehicles with rear mounted radiators (eg, Imp, Renault) or side mounted radiators (eg. Mini) will almost certainly require a larger cooling fan and also a separate expansion tank connected to the radiator, if modified for more performance. Some engines have a tendency to overheat if the radiator header tank is not completely full to give proper water flow down through the radiator core. An expansion tank ensures that the top tank is always full."
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Adey
Posted a lot
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Adey
@adey1984
Club Retro Rides Member 171
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Aug 11, 2020 10:19:49 GMT
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Great info there cheers, i will definitely keep one in place, i think the new setup feeding water to the bottom rad hose with an air return from the top of the rad is better than my last attempt of fitting one inline on the heater pipes of the pump. Once this is all done i will be pulling a favour and running it on a dyno at my mates house. Then all being well i might be able to go for a little more power (but more a sporty noise than anything). Would love a snorting side draft and tasty exhaust on there eventually  |
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Last Edit: Aug 11, 2020 10:42:51 GMT by Adey
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Adey
Posted a lot
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Club RR Member Number: 171
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Adey
@adey1984
Club Retro Rides Member 171
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Aug 11, 2020 11:41:31 GMT
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Oh wow, it's so hot today so I havent completed as much as I wanted. so this was the final testing lash up.  Pulled it all out to make a start on measuring for hoses and brackets. When I took the rad from the scrap yard i took the support brackets too. So they were re bent to suit how I needed them to secure the radiator properly. I've moved the top over another 2 inches than I had it so I could mount it nicely and reduce the air space/gap above it. It also lowers the height slightly so the header tank is effectively higher than it a touch. That's as far as I've gotten today.   |
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Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,882
Club RR Member Number: 39
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Darkspeed
@darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member 39
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Aug 14, 2020 16:16:12 GMT
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I would be inclined to use the heater return as the connection to the header tank - This is the area of lowest system pressure (suction) and will always ensure that air is then pulled from the highest point in the system with the small connection from the rad top to the expansion tank.
If you are not going to have any circulation through the heater or a bypass you effectively stop all flow in the engine until the stat opens which is not an ideal situation - localised boiling in the head could happen before the stat opens - If no circulation path is going to be used - drill 3 x 3mm holes in the outside of the stat. This ensues flow past the stat so it sees an averaged engine temp.
The lack of a bypass can also cause cooling system shunt - whereby the car heats up quickly the stat opens and cold water is pushed into a hot engine the stat closes and this repeats until the whole system is up to temp with the gauge swinging back and forth.
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Last Edit: Aug 14, 2020 16:17:35 GMT by Darkspeed
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Adey
Posted a lot
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Adey
@adey1984
Club Retro Rides Member 171
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Aug 14, 2020 18:34:22 GMT
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hmmmm food for thought. The circulation thing makes sense, when i tested it i did have the feed and return looped so maybe i will do that instead of capping them off.
The way ive planned to plumb the header tank was based on some vw setups, i assume it still pulls on header tank as it feeds into the bottom rad hose before the pump.
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Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,882
Club RR Member Number: 39
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Darkspeed
@darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member 39
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Aug 14, 2020 19:02:14 GMT
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hmmmm food for thought. The circulation thing makes sense, when i tested it i did have the feed and return looped so maybe i will do that instead of capping them off. The way ive planned to plumb the header tank was based on some vw setups, i assume it still pulls on header tank as it feeds into the bottom rad hose before the pump. Just highlighting the best practice. There are benefits with de-aeration and running the system under the cap at the lowest possible pressure etc. etc. But if you know what you are doing then all good. |
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Adey
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,439
Club RR Member Number: 171
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Adey
@adey1984
Club Retro Rides Member 171
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Aug 14, 2020 19:28:35 GMT
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HAHAHA i have no idea which is why its taken me months to sort the cooling issue/setup
So blank off the heater out pipe, pipe the feed from the header tank to the heater inlet and let it pull water through the header tank and from the top of the radiator?
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Last Edit: Aug 14, 2020 19:34:34 GMT by Adey
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Adey
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Adey
@adey1984
Club Retro Rides Member 171
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Aug 18, 2020 11:10:16 GMT
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Last Edit: Aug 18, 2020 12:15:46 GMT by Adey
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Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
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Club RR Member Number: 39
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Darkspeed
@darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member 39
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Aug 18, 2020 12:59:36 GMT
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HAHAHA i have no idea which is why its taken me months to sort the cooling issue/setup So blank off the heater out pipe, pipe the feed from the header tank to the heater inlet and let it pull water through the header tank and from the top of the radiator? Big late back to the party - Yes - oh you did it already  - Looks like you have a healthy volume of water in the system as well. Apart from a medium/high power two speed fan I think you have it about as good as you can - If you went for more power - Is there room for a R8 style installation? |
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Adey
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,439
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Adey
@adey1984
Club Retro Rides Member 171
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Aug 18, 2020 13:47:15 GMT
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HAHAHA i have no idea which is why its taken me months to sort the cooling issue/setup So blank off the heater out pipe, pipe the feed from the header tank to the heater inlet and let it pull water through the header tank and from the top of the radiator? Big late back to the party - Yes - oh you did it already - Looks like you have a healthy volume of water in the system as well. Apart from a medium/high power two speed fan I think you have it about as good as you can - If you went for more power - Is there room for a R8 style installation? You could possibly put a custom rad there but space between the engine and rear panel is very tight. If i have more issues after this the tried and tested front radiator method will be taken. The block was already filled with water from a previous test but i think it took over 7 ltrs of water. Ill do a proper drain down and measure the systems capacity at some point. |
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Paul Y
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Aug 18, 2020 17:38:42 GMT
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That looks much better - dare I say almost factory? With all of that water capacity and new cooling capability must be time too bolt the Turbooooooooo on.... P. |
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Adey
Posted a lot
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Club RR Member Number: 171
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Adey
@adey1984
Club Retro Rides Member 171
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Aug 18, 2020 18:07:43 GMT
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The plan all along was to have it all black, the multicolored thing is due to me using everything I have lying about to do the job.
Id love a turbo setup on there but the gearbox would 5h1t a frisbee trying to take it so I'm told. Snorty sidedraft will hopefully be on there by the end of the year. (if this all works well that is) Turbo noises would be awesome though.
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Last Edit: Aug 18, 2020 18:09:39 GMT by Adey
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Aug 18, 2020 21:13:35 GMT
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Great News !
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Adey
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,439
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Adey
@adey1984
Club Retro Rides Member 171
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Aug 22, 2020 12:47:27 GMT
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Last Edit: Aug 22, 2020 12:49:15 GMT by Adey
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Adey
Posted a lot
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Adey
@adey1984
Club Retro Rides Member 171
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Aug 22, 2020 20:20:13 GMT
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So, its getting dark and there's a knock at the door. Woop woop its my alternator. I quickly popped outside with my led torch that the batteries are running out on, i slap it on and wire it up. Run to the front of the car and slap the 12v battery in there and rig up the jump leads up to give it some juice.
chug chug chug its trying to fire but not catching. Stomping the pedal to give it some fuel and it does the same over and over and over again. Strangely all my lights and gauges work as do the indicators, i was expecting them to pop instantly? Anyway i have a quick look and realise ive left the rubber gloves over the carb.... urgh.
Anyway its too dark to do anything now, so battery on charge so its nice and fresh for the morning where we can try again and make sure everything is working and charging fine.
Fingers crossed another big step closer to it all being ready to run properly.
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Adey
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,439
Club RR Member Number: 171
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Adey
@adey1984
Club Retro Rides Member 171
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Aug 23, 2020 11:09:44 GMT
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Last Edit: Aug 23, 2020 16:36:04 GMT by Adey
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- Looks like you have a healthy volume of water in the system as well.
