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Seems to point towards Rad not big enough i.e 'small' rad not transfering heat quick enough before being recycled...
Not sure there would be that much more water in bigger engine ( casting / core design etc) and even though rubber pipes get hot heat transfer is not optimum ...
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v8ian
Posted a lot
Posts: 3,832
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Bigger is not always better, more cores are sometimes are a hinderance as they don't always allow the airflow thru the rad, Been there and got the postcard, went back to a better smaller cored rad and it worked a treat.
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Atmo V8 Power . No slicks , No gas + No bits missing . Doing it in style. Austin A35van, very different------- but still doing it in style, going to be a funmoble
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Bigger is not always better, more cores are sometimes are a hinderance as they don't always allow the airflow thru the rad, Been there and got the postcard, went back to a better smaller cored rad and it worked a treat. Agreed ... that's what I meant to say .... honest
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The coolant capacity only really affects how long it takes to boil up, if there is less heat being dissipated than generated by the engine it will always end up overheating.
I suspect it is the fan an engine driven fan will easily use a kw of energy, for an equivalent electric one that's 83 A on a 12V system or 163 on a 6V, I'm guessing your's is some way off of this!
At one point I think it was Nissan ran a hydraulically driven fan on some cars which could obviously be far more powefull than an electric one but would need a pump on the engine.
Having a quick look on line - I think it was Toyota / Lexus who used them.
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Last Edit: Aug 3, 2020 14:42:05 GMT by kevins
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drseg
Part of things
Posts: 142
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i'm of the opinion rads too small in capacity, try your orig rad i think that would be better bigger the engine bigger the rad capacity, modern honda probably had a better water pump and better thermal efficiency than your renault
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Paul Y
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,951
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Spending way too much time thinking about this but what about trying this as a test. Get a 12v fan and a shroud and then direct wire it to a 12v battery. Go fir a test drive and if it doesn’t overheat problem solved. If it does then move onto the next thing. P.
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Adey
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,442
Club RR Member Number: 171
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Adey
@adey1984
Club Retro Rides Member 171
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Spending way too much time thinking about this but what about trying this as a test. Get a 12v fan and a shroud and then direct wire it to a 12v battery. Go fir a test drive and if it doesn’t overheat problem solved. If it does then move onto the next thing. P. I will do once the new gasket and alternator turn up
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine peteh1969
@peteh1969
Club Retro Rides Member 107
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It's the going back to work that has demoralized you Adey I bet you were tired last night.
It may help you clear your head leaving it for a few days no rush as it's not your daily.
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Adey
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,442
Club RR Member Number: 171
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Adey
@adey1984
Club Retro Rides Member 171
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yeah was a bit of a change, i love work and ive been off due to shielding for medical reasons. Was all a bit strange, effectively the only other enclosed space ive been in with people in last 5 months was my return to work yesterday. All a little bit odd. Any way this place is for the cars. Id really like to get the car somewhat usable before the weather changes so ill be on it when i can be. Ive been informed the rad i have also fits the rover/mg hatchbacks and it turns out theres a few down the scrap yard for me to hopefully pillage for a fan
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Ok i was intrigued so i measured the rad capacity. New rad roughly 1000ml capacity old rad 1400ml capacity. The new setup does have longer hoses though and the block is bigger so may hold more water there? That’s a big difference...... We have a lot of thinking, but I’d say two things we can say we know aren’t that you have less airflow and less capacity. I’ve lost track a bit - did you run it with the new engine and old radiator ? And did it overheat in that set up to? If you didn’t try it - it must be worth doing it now as an easy test that gives you more facts on hats happening. Did you get the new radiator from a reputable company? There are some really poor cheap radiators out there ....
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Adey
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,442
Club RR Member Number: 171
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Adey
@adey1984
Club Retro Rides Member 171
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No the old rad sprang a leak so that's when i replaced it. It also doesn't have the hose connections in a place that would work well with the engine setup. Tops and bottom hoses were on different sides and differing top and bottom.
Agree though 400cc less radiator capacity and less airflow through the radiator with no fixed fan.
The radiator i have is from Eurocarparts made by EIS? I've looked at the rad fans in pics and the radiators they are attached to look a lot better construction, more brazed looking than tube and fin. When i get down the scrap yard, if the rads look like a better construction or just better quality i will swipe the whole assembly and fit that in there too after measuring water volume.
Today's small amount of work included refitting the exhaust, setting the valve clearances which needed loads of adjustment strangely and cranking it over. When i refitted the head i though the pushrods were abit slack but didn't think much of it. When i came to start it it was back firing and throwing flames out of the carb. Strange, so i reset the clearances, i think i have a thinner gasket on now as they took a fair amount of taking up. Car still wouldn't start and was behaving the same. For some reason some one had mixed up the HT leads, I have an idea of who it would of been but i may have to get a camera out on the garage soon. I never removed the leads from the dizzy and left them all in place, the leads also have spark plug numbers on them.... Anyway once id put them on correctly it caught and fired up nicely, turned it off promptly as there are no hoses or rad fitted but good to know its ready to run.
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Car still wouldn't start and was behaving the same. For some reason some one had mixed up the HT leads, I have an idea of who it would of been but i may have to get a camera out on the garage soon. I never removed the leads from the dizzy and left them all in place, the leads also have spark plug numbers on them.... Anyway once id put them on correctly it caught and fired up nicely, turned it off promptly as there are no hoses or rad fitted but good to know its ready to run. I'm sorry what now?! Someones been messing with your wagon?
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1987 Supercharged BMW R1150 Citroen 2cv Hillclimb Monster 1995 Renault Master Mk1 Race Transporter 1994 Mazda MX5 Mk1 / NA Road Going Class Hillclimber 1991 UMM Alter II Crew Cab OM606 SuperTurbo Diesel MegaUMM Overlander 1992 UMM Alter II Station Wagon 1980 UMM Cournil - survivor - resto project 1979 Lomax 224 2014 VW T5.1 Transporter Kombi Highline
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Adey
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,442
Club RR Member Number: 171
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Adey
@adey1984
Club Retro Rides Member 171
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I'm pretty sure they have yes. Feud with some local builders popping up 9 houses behind mine. I'm the moaning neighbour who thinks its unreasonable for them to be blaring music and singing at the top of their lungs at 6.30am. Weve had a fair few run ins now and alot of people are starting to complain but I'm quite vocal and will just walk on site and tell them, I'm also right next to them and my garage and driveway is at the site entrance. Other than them i cant think who would want to or who would know that messing the order on the dizzy cap would effect running.
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v8ian
Posted a lot
Posts: 3,832
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Many councils have By Laws concerning building work..... Monday to Friday 8-6, sat 9-1 and no work on sundays seems to be the norm. Have a check with your local council and see if you have them.
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Atmo V8 Power . No slicks , No gas + No bits missing . Doing it in style. Austin A35van, very different------- but still doing it in style, going to be a funmoble
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Adey
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,442
Club RR Member Number: 171
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Adey
@adey1984
Club Retro Rides Member 171
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all out the window with covid. 6am till 9pm and 7 days a week so I'm told. only an issue if people complain but then the complaints process is long winded. fill out time and date logs even though videos were sent showing it happening. theres a long list of complaints from lots of people now but the local council don't seem to care tbh. they will be gone soon I hope.
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Adey
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,442
Club RR Member Number: 171
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Adey
@adey1984
Club Retro Rides Member 171
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Scrap yard raid this morning for a selection of hoses, a header tank that might work and a fan and I came away with a radiator too. It was a calsonic item who I've heard off from my early gran turismo days so should be a good brand? slightly smaller than the new rad I have but also a different style core. It has a take off for self bleeding too which will help with trapped air issues. I've also measured its water volume at just under 1600ml or 1.6 litres (200cc more than the original dauphine rad an 600 more than the new rad). Next job is to get it fitted up and fingers crossed an alternator will appear soon to run it all. The fan though smaller is a curved oem style fan so I'm hopeful itll do a better job than what I have. So to surmise I have a smaller rad and fan 🤷🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️ but hopefully a better rad and fan with more water volume.
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Last Edit: Aug 8, 2020 10:51:50 GMT by Adey
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Adey
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,442
Club RR Member Number: 171
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The 1957 "The Dope" Dauphine Adey
@adey1984
Club Retro Rides Member 171
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All plumbed in in a fashion as I'm not going to mad with making it neat and tidy yet until its all proved itself. Ran it all up and it seems good at idle, i wired the new fan to a 12v battery and fair play it moves some serious air in comparison to the "6v" fan. I will try and get the radiator totally paneled off again this eve/weekend and maybe do a quick test with the rad fan running off an independent 12v car battery (as suggested above) and see how it behaves. If it works well it can all stay in place and be tidied up if not i can look to moving everything up front.
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Well done for persevering and fingers crossed 🤞
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Excellent work with this one, you'll crack it in the end - hopefully with this!
Full 12v conversion on the cards?
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1987 Supercharged BMW R1150 Citroen 2cv Hillclimb Monster 1995 Renault Master Mk1 Race Transporter 1994 Mazda MX5 Mk1 / NA Road Going Class Hillclimber 1991 UMM Alter II Crew Cab OM606 SuperTurbo Diesel MegaUMM Overlander 1992 UMM Alter II Station Wagon 1980 UMM Cournil - survivor - resto project 1979 Lomax 224 2014 VW T5.1 Transporter Kombi Highline
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