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Nov 18, 2016 20:12:41 GMT
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For the seals, it might be worth a trip to your local breakers. I found a boot seal on a modern that worked fine on my 70s estate  Or try your local caravan sales/spares place, we have a couple that stock "universal" stuff, including seals Glad to see it's moving in the right direction   |
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Nov 18, 2016 21:39:39 GMT
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Sometimes, others may not understand why you like a car so much. Sometimes, you may not even understand why you like a car so much. But none of that matters; all that matters is that you like the car, and having it makes you happy.
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Rebel
Part of things
Posts: 343 
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The leak on the drivers side from under the dash, might be coming from the windscreen wiper. I had a MKII Escort years ago ( when they were sensible prices, lol ) it would leak through the bulkhead, where the windscreen wiper spindle pokes through, drip onto the arm under the dash, run along it and drip down on your foot when you were driving.
Might be worth getting under the dash with a torch if you can and have someone hold a hose pipe on the wiper spindle or pour some water over the spindle
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1968 Dodge Charger
1985 Chevrolet Camaro
1993 Toyota Hilux Surf
2001 Ford Mondeo
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Paul Y
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,951
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Nov 19, 2016 12:40:28 GMT
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vulgalour
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 7,283
Club RR Member Number: 146
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Nov 19, 2016 20:02:42 GMT
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Well, since I've replaced my back injury with a cold, I'm still in no fit state to sort out the Rover's engine. Happily, Mike volunteered his services today so we at least stand a chance of getting the head to the machine shop next week. Inlet manifold removal was thwarted by a rounded nut (I vaguely recall one was a bit dodgy when we first took it off) so that will come off with the head to make removal of the nut easier on the bench. Cam cover was removed to reveal this. Looks like it's not just gone coolant to air after all, that's definitely emulsion.  The inside of the cam cover confirms that too.  Monday the head will come off and go to the machine shop. For now at least we can see it's not a quick nip up the head bolts and chuck some K Seal in sort of a job even had I been of a mind to bodge it that way. |
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Smiler
Posted a lot
I no longer own anything FWD! Or with less than 6 cylinders, or 2.5ltrs! :)
Posts: 2,492
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Nov 20, 2016 20:28:23 GMT
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Definitely worth persevering with. Hope it goes well.
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www.Auto-tat.co.uk'96 Range Rover P38 DSE (daily driver) '71 Reliant Scimitar SE5 GTE 3.0ltr Jag V6 Conversion '79 Reliant Scimitar SE6A 3.0ltr 24valve Omega Conversion '85 Escort Cabrio 2.0 Zetec - Sold '91 BMW 525i - Sold '82 Cortina 2.9i Ghia Cosworth - Sold '72 VW Campervan - Sold '65 LandRover 88" - Sold
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vulgalour
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 7,283
Club RR Member Number: 146
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Mike has been an absolute star and got the head off the Rover and today we dropped it off at the machine shop. We've made the decision to give it the works rather than just doing enough. That does make things considerably more expensive but it should mean I have an engine in the best health it can be for the rest of the life of the car. So, camshaft cover off...  ... then head off.  With the head on the bench you can see that one stubborn nut still holding the inlet manifold on at this stage. That nut was removed but put up quite a fight so will get replaced. Those that have seen it in person believe this could well be the original head gasket, which is pretty good going for an elastomer gasket on a 100k+ engine that hasn't been treated kindly in recent years. At first glance it looks okay really, no obvious points of burning through.  Take a closer look and there are several points where the elastomer seal has failed, highlighted in this image.  The shopping list of parts I've been given are as follows: Water Pipe Gasket (for small metal water pipe on head) 2 x Oil Filter (one for the flush through, one to go on with clean oil) Flushing Oil Bio-degreaser for waterways MLS Head Gasket Head Bolt Set Cam Cover Gasket Exhaust Manifold Gasket Camshaft Oil Seals (x4) Anaerobic Sealant Inlet Manifold Nut (x1) I already have a new inlet manifold gasket (green type), the oil and coolant so that's not on the list. The head has been delivered to the machine shop who charge rather more than I'd like and take rather longer than I'd like but do very good work as I've seen on other engines in other cars and aren't shy about taking on obscure and/or maligned stuff like Renault 6 engines and K series heads. The head will be pressure tested and if needed skimmed to be on the safe side. It will also be getting one of the spark plug hole threads sorted since with the head off the car it was obvious that it was a bad thread and that's why it spat a plug out back in February. In addition, the head and cam carrier will all get cleaned so everything is in the rudest health it can be before being ready for reassembly. This is going to cost me rather more than I'd like and take a little longer, no one item is particularly expensive or time consuming, it just all adds up together to a larger amount of money and time than is perhaps usually spent on a car like this. I'm going with the theory that if it's done right it only needs to be done once and I'll end up with a very healthy engine at the end of it. I'm not bothered about making it high performance, just reliable. The other reason for repair over replacement is that it costs less to repair properly than to replace with an unknown quantity, be that a new engine or a whole new car. I've also gone through my options suggested both in person and online and the above is the balance I'm striking, limited to a degree by the available funds. |
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Ian
Part of things
Posts: 977
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I think you have chosen the best option, if you have this running right, at a slightly higher cost than you wanted, you should get a reliable car out if it in the end, as long as nothing else goes wrong in the future.
It leaves you free to do what you want with the other two then, when time and funds allow. I procrastinate too long which is why I have not touched mine in 5 years, but it can wait until the kids a bigger and funds allow.
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Nov 22, 2016 13:21:06 GMT
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Good choice, It might be worth considering (space permitting) to change the inlet bolts for studs so the threads/nuts are on the outside?
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Davey
Posted a lot
Resident Tyre Nerd.
Posts: 2,348
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Nov 22, 2016 20:04:17 GMT
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Please check the piston liners before refitting the head! If they have dropped you'll kick yourself later.
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K11 Micra x3 - Mk3 astra - Seat Marbella - Mk6 Escort estate - B5 Passat - Alfa 156 estate - E36 compact
Mk2 MR2 T-bar - E46 328i - Skoda Superb - Fiat seicento - 6n2 Polo - 6n polo 1.6 - Mk1 GS300
EU8 civic type S - MG ZT cdti - R56 MINI Cooper S - Audi A3 8p - Jaguar XF (X250) - FN2 Civic Type R - Mk2 2.0i Ford Focus - Mercedes W212 E250
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vulgalour
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 7,283
Club RR Member Number: 146
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Nov 23, 2016 17:39:39 GMT
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It finally stopped raining today! Time to crack on with some sealing jobs on the Renault. I was going to squidge some more sealant into the windscreen seal but it sits in so snugly I can't, instead I ran the tidiest bead of sealant I could manage over the edges of the seal where it seems to be letting water into the car and we'll see if it does the trick. If not, I can clean it back and try and different approach. That was fairly quick to do, if a little messy, and left me lots of time to get on with the next bit. I'd put a shout out on various fora for suggestions on where to get some door seals and after looking at the various wares on offer, it was www.woolies-trim.co.uk/ who came up trumps with their larger arrowhead profile foam door seals. This isn't self adhesive so sealant is required to fit. 12.5 metres were needed in total for all four doors, I bought 13 because you can only buy in 1 metre multiples and it's always best to have a little bit extra, just in case.   I worked on one door at a time, stripping off the old seal and fitting the new one. The drivers side was still sealing fairly well so I could have probably got away with not doing it, but I'd rather fit new all round. The old seals were quite tired.  Remember, these are the GOOD old seals. It's no wonder the rain was getting in really.  One thing I did learn is that a lot of the glue holding the old seals on had also failed so water was getting in not just around where the old seals were shrunken but also where they just hadn't bonded to the door frame. Not any use to anyone so in the bin they go.  To make sure I had enough seals to go around, I applied the polyurethane sealant to the door frame and then fed the new seal on from the roll I'd bought. Starting at the centre of the bottom edge so the join was in the least visible place and least likely to cause sealing problems, I worked my way around the door frame, holding the seal in place with tape. I swear I ended up with more sealant on me than on the door and this stuff only seems to clean off with thinners. Got there in the end.  Here we see a rare display of a Renault 6 "peacocking" in a vain attempt to attract a mate.  There wasn't much seal left over.  Ages ago when I jacked up the car, water came out and we couldn't figure out how it had got in to where it was coming out as there didn't seem to be an obvious point of ingress.  On rolling the back seat forward and lifting the floor mat to check for water to mop out - it rained LOADS yesterday - I noticed the blanking plate over the fuel sender was loose and quite a lot of water had got in underneath.  The boot seal is next on my jobs for replacement, look how flat this is.  It got a bit cold so I'm hoping the sealant cures okay, if not I can always reglue things. The doors are more difficult to shut now than they were and you can see the seals are squishing into the places they need to so I'm cautiously optimistic. |
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Nov 23, 2016 20:27:41 GMT
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That's a good job done. I always look for your updates first when logging on
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vulgalour
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 7,283
Club RR Member Number: 146
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Nov 24, 2016 16:31:40 GMT
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Little bit of engine news since I just got back from the engine shop and am £180 lighter.
Renault - was two muddled bearing caps. They gave everything the once over which meant taking the head off and disturbing the liners but now it's all sorted and ready to go once my new head gasket arrives. They fitted the spare liner gaskets I'd kept just in case. We should be ready to go on getting this to run pretty rapidly now as it was deemed otherwise fit and healthy.
Rover - head returned with 4 thou skim, general clean up and all ready to refit. The head gasket kit arrived for it today too so I just need to get the special sealant and a couple of oil filters so we can get that sorted.
All in all, bit of a relief to be at this point now, should make some good progress on both cars pretty soon. The only awkward bit is going to be getting the engine crane home so I can refit the Renault's engine once I've finished putting all the extra bits and bobs back on it.
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Smiler
Posted a lot
I no longer own anything FWD! Or with less than 6 cylinders, or 2.5ltrs! :)
Posts: 2,492
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Nov 24, 2016 22:36:51 GMT
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The yellow Scimitar has totally shot hanging door seals. Turns out a friend of mine was sending a French modern(ish) thing to the scrapyard and he kindly removed all the door seals from it for me to recycle.  |
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www.Auto-tat.co.uk'96 Range Rover P38 DSE (daily driver) '71 Reliant Scimitar SE5 GTE 3.0ltr Jag V6 Conversion '79 Reliant Scimitar SE6A 3.0ltr 24valve Omega Conversion '85 Escort Cabrio 2.0 Zetec - Sold '91 BMW 525i - Sold '82 Cortina 2.9i Ghia Cosworth - Sold '72 VW Campervan - Sold '65 LandRover 88" - Sold
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Nov 24, 2016 22:51:31 GMT
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180 quid is a bit of coin, but if it means you have 2 working engines and less stress, then it's money well spent.
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vulgalour
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 7,283
Club RR Member Number: 146
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It's more than I wanted to spend, definitely. The Renault engine inspection I was backed into a corner with, I hadn't the experience or tools to figure out what was amiss so I sort of had to pay whatever was charged to know it was good. That was £80 for inspection, sorting, dismantling and rebuilding.
Rover engine costs were £100, that was for a head skim, pressure test, clean and fixing of the dodgy spark plug thread. I was hoping to pay less but I suppose it is a fair chunk of work and it's stuff I couldn't DIY for once. Then the head kit was £80 which includes all the gaskets and head bolts and I just have to buy a couple of filters, flushing fluids and sealant to make the job complete. I was looking at £700 plus transport to get the car done by a garage, doing it myself I'm saving £400-500 and I'll have a good solid engine at the end of it.
Did get an annoyance tonight when I got an e-mail from the company I ordered the radiator for the Renault from saying they were out of stock and they won't know when they're in stock again until they get delivery info next week. Extra annoying since I've already forked out £85 for it. I can't find any other company listing the particular radiator the 6 uses, it has different fittings to the one in the identically engined 4. Repairing the old radiator is £180-250, way more than I can justify spending, which means if this supplier falls through I'll probably end up getting a 4 radiator and modifying it to fit, thus rendering any guarantee it comes with null and void.
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Nov 25, 2016 12:16:07 GMT
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Given £38 will be VAT £180 doesn't sound too bad given the sort of investment needed for engine re-manufacturing.
There looks plenty of room I am sure with a bit of ingenuity you will be able to find a rad to fit (I know mx5 ones are dirt cheap!)
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vulgalour
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 7,283
Club RR Member Number: 146
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Nov 25, 2016 13:50:13 GMT
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Yeah, I'd forgotten about VAT. That does make it sound a *lot* more reasonable, almost cheap in fact. --- Renault's new boot seal arrived today, again ordered from Woolies. The Laguna one that might have been available suddenly wasn't so I ordered a length of suitable edge seal from Woolies which arrived today. Really easy to fit you just peel the old one off and push the new one on, trimming to size where the lock latch is.  Flat old one can go in the bin.  Again, not a lot left over. I needed just shy of 4 metres to do this and I wish I'd done it ages ago.  It doesn't make that odd crunchy noise when closing the tailgate now and it feels like it seals, the test will be when it rains. Mike had been kind enough to clean up the access plate from under the back seat. I need to glue some sort of strip seal to it and clean up the car side so this makes a good seal when reattached. I'll likely drill an extra hole in it too so it can be clamped down better, there's no visible hole to screw it into the floor that matches that on the plate itself.  Next thing then was to check how the doors had actually sealed. We've had a small amount of rain and I had noticed the car wasn't fogging up as much so I was hopeful the new seals were working. Started with the best sealing door and yep, that seal is working lovely. The door made that satisfying new seal noise when the door was opened too and there wasn't signs of moisture in the door opening. Good job!  Front door on the driver's side not as good. I really should have removed the mirror before putting the seal on so I have a small section that needs resealing once I've done that. I didn't have my allen keys to hand when fitting the new seals and thought I could get away with it. The leading edge of the door where it joins the lower A pillar also hasn't stuck so I need to reglue that too. Not the end of the world, just niggles and easily remedied. The good thing is that there wasn't really any obvious water ingress on the floor this side now.  The worst door, that being rear passenger side, is still causing problems. Water is still getting past the seal here but it's not clear how. The seal is channeling the water as it should but a small amount is still getting down the back of it. I may have to just push the top of the door frame in a bit like I did on the front door this side so that it meets the bodyshell better. The doors on this car are quite flimsy things.  I did find a small hole. At first I thought it was just black paint. That will need some attention and I'm not sure how I missed it when I did the gutter removal.  I also noticed the headlining at the windscreen edge was dry now so I may have sealed that succesfully. With the exception of the rear passenger door, the cabin was dry inside so I've certainly significantly reduced the water ingress problem. I can't do anything on the Renault's engine today as I have none of my tools at home and my loan car was taken back a couple of days ago so I haven't the transport to go and get them in a timely fashion. I can pick them up on the weekend as I'll hopefully be helping Mike put the Rover back together. |
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Nov 25, 2016 18:40:42 GMT
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i think for the most part the seal is not the actual rubber bit being snug against the door shuts, but the O part of the seal deforming into a () shape and making a kind of foam gutter around the hole
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