scaff
Part of things
Posts: 73 
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Mar 28, 2014 22:22:46 GMT
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Is it me, or are there a lot of kit cars for sale that are 90%+ built or ready "just need mot" to finish.
Have things got though or the law changed on kit cars and people being caught out part way thru a build and deciding to sell because it will never get on the road.
In particular I see a lot of the Robin Hood / lotus 7 / Westfield type cars for sale
ive always fancied one of these and am tempted but not if it just ends up catching rain water on the drive.
thanks
scaff
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People have always been selling their almost finished projects, its not a new thing.
Depends on how much of a kit car it is as it may needs a SVA which is a very strict test even down to what type of dash switches you can have.
Personally I would stay clear of any unfinished projects as you don't know how well they have been built or the quality of the parts used unless you want to use it as a base and are going to strip it down and start again.
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Kieran
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,092
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Anything which hasn't been on the road needs to undergo an IVA test, even stricter than the previous SVA. It costs about £500 and is like an mot in steroids. I think the retest is £250.
Most kitcars are designed to pass the test or will if built sensibly.
It covers a lot of things like external projections, radius of contactable edges, radius of lamp screw heads etc.
It is doable, you can download the handbook, but I think the cost and faff just puts people off. Basically anything you pay for the project, budget another £500+ to get it through the test.
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The Ashby Jackson fleet:-
1979 Mini Clubman 1.8 K series
1978 Skoda 110r Project 130RS K-oupe
1978 Austin Allegro 1500 SDL Estate
1984 BMW K100 Sidecar outfit
1999 Yamaha FZS 1000 Fazer
1991 Kawasaki ZXR400 race bike
2002 Kawasaki ZX9r race bike
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Mar 29, 2014 13:56:28 GMT
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I've got a Marlin Roadster. I was looking for a project so not registered seemed OK until everybody told me there was very little chance of getting an older kit road legal / pass BIVA test without substantial modifications so in the end spent almost double my original budget getting a completed (Q reg) vehicle. It's possible to get anything legal but you need to weigh up the cost of test / retest as already pointed out and then have to jump through hoops. A neighbour has a Westfield and he showed me the switches. There are a row of 5 (lights, wipers, washers, hazards, heater) and they are neat little, almost flush with dash, rockers. The 2 or 3 nearest the driver had to be removed and the edged rounded off as you can't have a corner radius under something like 3mm. The test is that strict. Such would mean a BIVA fail and expensive retest - for the edge of a switch ! Have a look here for inspiration - www.locostbuilders.co.uk/Paul H |
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`state
Yorkshire and The Humber
Posts: 1,215
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Mar 29, 2014 14:42:13 GMT
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Does any one actually know of someone who's been caught out driving an incorrectly registered car yet? Or one been turned down for an mot due to it? I know theres plenty of cars driving around using the donors v5 who shouldnt be but has anyone been caught yet?
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Look at all the plastic people who live without a care.Try to sit with me around my table,but never bring a chair.
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Mar 29, 2014 15:12:42 GMT
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I have always assumed that "Just needs MOT'd" or "Just needs finishing" whether applied to kits or normal cars is sales talk for "I know damn well it wont pass an MOT".
A finished, legal car is always going to be easier to sell and more valuable than something needing work.
Having said that, a lot of people get their pleasure from building things rather than driving them, so selling nearly finished stuff is quite common.
Personally, I would be very wary of buying a kit someone else had built. It would always be at the back of my mind, wondering what their welding skills were like as I skimmed along at 70mph with my ass literally 4 inches above the road.
I would love to build one myself, but time, money and motivation are all lacking as usual. Probably wouldnt scratch-build one though - I would rather prefer to get a part-built thing from the factory, like an MK Indy, at least I would know the chassis is well designed and built square.
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1986 Panda 4x4.
1990 Metro Sport.
1999 Ford Escort estate.
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Mar 29, 2014 19:06:24 GMT
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`state
Yorkshire and The Humber
Posts: 1,215
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Mar 29, 2014 19:28:28 GMT
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By the sounds of that he'd have been ok if he'd have made sure the number on the v5 was stamped into the chassis.
I'm not saying it doesn't happen but the way people go on about it on the internet you'd think vosa was driving a task force round hunting every modified car down and ripping its v5 up.
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Look at all the plastic people who live without a care.Try to sit with me around my table,but never bring a chair.
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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Kit cars and the law / mots sowen
@sowen
Club Retro Rides Member 24
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Mar 29, 2014 20:18:54 GMT
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Does any one actually know of someone who's been caught out driving an incorrectly registered car yet? Or one been turned down for an mot due to it? I know theres plenty of cars driving around using the donors v5 who shouldnt be but has anyone been caught yet? My dad was telling me yesterday one of his customers who has a Land Rover/Range Rover hybrid took it for an mot and the tester called the DVLA to report it there and then because the Land Rover lightweight body didn't match the Range Rover Vogue's identity. |
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scaff
Part of things
Posts: 73
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Mar 29, 2014 21:04:51 GMT
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Food for thought.
Oh well, banish the ideas of me living out my years like Wesley from last of the summer wine.
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I see a lot of cars that have been wrongly registered, some after the MOT tester has either reported the car of it has been picked up by DVLA because the numbers don't match or body type is different and some that have been stopped at roadside checks.
VOSA are a common site at off roading events and modified/ kit car shows.
Home built kit cars do not require a VIN plate/ number on the car but it makes sense to stamp one onto the chassis or body.
We are seeing more now then there were five years ago due to the computerised MOT and the ease that Police and others can check chassis numbers and the history of that car.
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Last Edit: Mar 30, 2014 2:05:55 GMT by Deleted
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Mar 30, 2014 10:37:37 GMT
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MOT chassis number didn't match the logbook? Surely thats not possible now its all computerised? Anyway I'm sure a careful search of the chassis by the new owner would find the correct number stamped in somewhere.... |
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Mar 30, 2014 13:49:49 GMT
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....
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Last Edit: Mar 30, 2014 14:12:30 GMT by Deleted
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Mar 30, 2014 14:16:36 GMT
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MOT chassis number didn't match the logbook? Surely thats not possible now its all computerised? Anyway I'm sure a careful search of the chassis by the new owner would find the correct number stamped in somewhere.... The 'chassis number' on older cars is a small metal plate riveted onto the car or frame so it is possible that the numbers didn't match and it was the computer that picked that up. Homebuilt kit cars and car built pre Aug 1981 do not require a VIN or chassis number to be shown on the car so the MOT tester COULD have just selected 'not required' in the dropdown box when it asked for the chassis number. Note for those who get confused about the VIN, chassis or commission number. it is all the same number just different terminology. |
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Does any one actually know of someone who's been caught out driving an incorrectly registered car yet? Or one been turned down for an mot due to it? I know theres plenty of cars driving around using the donors v5 who shouldnt be but has anyone been caught yet? My dad was telling me yesterday one of his customers who has a Land Rover/Range Rover hybrid took it for an mot and the tester called the DVLA to report it there and then because the Land Rover lightweight body didn't match the Range Rover Vogue's identity. I always found that it depends on the MOT tester and how good or bad of a day he/she is having and if they are a car person or not. I couldn't take my limo to my normal MOT tester as the car was too big for the ramp, i had to take it to a different one instead, i knew it was gunna fail, but needed a definitive list to work to. One thing that he failed it on,which i said nothing about as I'm gunna have a field day when i take it back if he fails it on that again  was no hazard switch,the fact that it is fitted to the steering column and not obvious to the uninitiated can be a challenge, however, he should have asked me where it was , as all MOT testers have asked questions about the strange cars i have owned. This just highlights that no matter what the forces at be say or do, they cannot reign in the testers discretion,knowledge or actually if they are doing the job to be "important" in life. A garage that understands modern cars rarely understands older ones or proper cars as they cannot make money from them when failing them. That has been my experience from several years in the trade as well as being a customer. |
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'88 Cadillac Brougham hearse (white)
'91 Carlton GSi 24v
'72 Dodge dual cab pick up
'99 Mercedes S55 AMG
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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Kit cars and the law / mots sowen
@sowen
Club Retro Rides Member 24
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My dad was telling me yesterday one of his customers who has a Land Rover/Range Rover hybrid took it for an mot and the tester called the DVLA to report it there and then because the Land Rover lightweight body didn't match the Range Rover Vogue's identity. I always found that it depends on the MOT tester and how good or bad of a day he/she is having and if they are a car person or not. I couldn't take my limo to my normal MOT tester as the car was too big for the ramp, i had to take it to a different one instead, i knew it was gunna fail, but needed a definitive list to work to. One thing that he failed it on,which i said nothing about as I'm gunna have a field day when i take it back if he fails it on that again was no hazard switch,the fact that it is fitted to the steering column and not obvious to the uninitiated can be a challenge, however, he should have asked me where it was , as all MOT testers have asked questions about the strange cars i have owned. This just highlights that no matter what the forces at be say or do, they cannot reign in the testers discretion,knowledge or actually if they are doing the job to be "important" in life. A garage that understands modern cars rarely understands older ones or proper cars as they cannot make money from them when failing them. That has been my experience from several years in the trade as well as being a customer. Talking to my dad a few days ago, he said the other guy with the Land Rover hybrid asked another mot tester if they'd do it, they said yes and would pass it if it complied with the relevant mot regulations, and they weren't worried about the identity etc.... |
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Apr 17, 2014 12:39:50 GMT
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As other have mentioned it's not getting caught (Although I'm sure it could happen), it's getting a car throught an MOT that's the problem. If you were an MOT tester would you risk your licence testing an Escort if it was described as Mini?
In terms of buying a nearly or part built Kit, I've done a few now. Go in with your eyes open & a sensible approach, factor in £1k to get it on the road (IVA, retest when it fails and registation fees)and there are some bargains to be had out there.
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Apr 22, 2014 20:22:21 GMT
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The bigger issue is if you have an accident then the insurance is void if it does not match up correctly. In the early days a lot of cars were incorrectly registered by the DVLA after being converted. It was common for one area to accept one thing and another the opposite. There was an amnesty when owners were allowed to convert the log books correctly however many did not as they were off the road at the time. It was not uncommon to see a Cobra described as a two seater Jaguar.
There is a guy who used to work for the DVLA called Paul Jepson. He does cases that need help at getting through all the hoops and has had success with cars even now where the description does not match. Google and you will find him
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was no hazard switch,the fact that it is fitted to the steering column and not obvious to the uninitiated can be a challenge, however, he should have asked me where it was , as all MOT testers have asked questions about the strange cars i have owned.