sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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On one of my projects I'm building I'm in the process of trying to lay out the basic plumbing in my engine bay, and I don't think I will have the room for a normal air-air intercooler mounted at the front. I'm thinking about fitting an air-water chargecooler setup mounted at the back of the engine where I have space, and then plumb a small radiator to the front behind the grille. I have a large chargecooler from a Jaguar XJR6 which looks like a pretty good fit in the available space I have.
Quite simply, is there anything I need to know about chargecooling, tips/tricks etc? Is it as simple as fitting the cooler into the intake, mount a mini sized radiator at the front and have a Bosch water pump to circulate the coolant?
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You could do it like that, I don't know how well the water would cool the air, if you did it that way, an electric pump would be best. Have you thought about a top mounted intercooler, or one in the wing?
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matty2300
South East
Red ones go faster!
Posts: 157
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You could do it like that, I don't know how well the water would cool the air, if you did it that way, an electric pump would be best. Have you thought about a top mounted intercooler, or one in the wing? the bosch is an electric pump! and yes, it is theoretically that simple, just make sure you get the water circulating in the right direction and there is a large enough volume of water for your application! from HERE"All chargecoolers should be of a 'countercurrent' design, which means that cold water from the pre-rad should be fed into the 'cold (outlet)' end of the chargecooler and the hot water that has absorbed all the charge heat comes out of the turbo (inlet) end of the unit. The reason for this is that the coldest water is keeping the coolest end of the CC cool, and the slightly warmed water at the hot end will not actually increase the temps at the 'hot end'. If the water flow is changed to a 'concurrent' design, so the cold water cools the hot end, then like wise, the water temps will heat up, and thus the 'cold' end of the charge cooler can not be any colder than the temperature of the 'heated' water" |
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2002 Saab 93 - Daily
1972 Vauxhall Firenza Sport SL - in storage
1978 Vauxhall Magnum - PROJECT
1993 Vauxhall Cavalier 2.0 GLS - DEAD
1994 Vauxhall Astra 1.4 LS - DEAD
1999 Saab 93 2.0 SE - DEAD
1999 Mercedes W202/C200 - DEAD
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If you wanted to be creative/unique and save money, you could just route the air pipes underneath the car to get cooling from the air? Saves weight from the water and cooler as well. BMW have been developing a turbo which runs from the back box of the exhaust, a low pressure turbo but it uses the pipe work under the car to cool it. If you did manage to do it I think it will have superb benefits, even more so in the winter.
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If you wanted to be creative/unique and save money, you could just route the air pipes underneath the car to get cooling from the air? Saves weight from the water and cooler as well. BMW have been developing a turbo which runs from the back box of the exhaust, a low pressure turbo but it uses the pipe work under the car to cool it. If you did manage to do it I think it will have superb benefits, even more so in the winter. Would also give you monster turbo lag... |
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1988 Mercedes w124 superturbo diesel 508hp
1996 Mercedes s124 e300 diesel wagon
1990 BMW E30 V8 M60 powered!
1999 BMW E46 323ci project car
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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You could do it like that, I don't know how well the water would cool the air, if you did it that way, an electric pump would be best. Have you thought about a top mounted intercooler, or one in the wing? the bosch is an electric pump! and yes, it is theoretically that simple, just make sure you get the water circulating in the right direction and there is a large enough volume of water for your application! from HERE"All chargecoolers should be of a 'countercurrent' design, which means that cold water from the pre-rad should be fed into the 'cold (outlet)' end of the chargecooler and the hot water that has absorbed all the charge heat comes out of the turbo (inlet) end of the unit. The reason for this is that the coldest water is keeping the coolest end of the CC cool, and the slightly warmed water at the hot end will not actually increase the temps at the 'hot end'. If the water flow is changed to a 'concurrent' design, so the cold water cools the hot end, then like wise, the water temps will heat up, and thus the 'cold' end of the charge cooler can not be any colder than the temperature of the 'heated' water" That is exactly the thing I wanted to know, thanks  If you wanted to be creative/unique and save money, you could just route the air pipes underneath the car to get cooling from the air? Saves weight from the water and cooler as well. BMW have been developing a turbo which runs from the back box of the exhaust, a low pressure turbo but it uses the pipe work under the car to cool it. If you did manage to do it I think it will have superb benefits, even more so in the winter. Would also give you monster turbo lag... No room for plumbing big hoses, we're talking a 4 ltr V8 and Garrett T04 turbo in a tiny engine bay! I already get a bit of surge on my Rover P6 turbo, I think mega plumbing would just make it worse. The challenge I've set myself is to make it 100% sleeper with no external clues as to what's happening under the bonnet  |
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Jan 10, 2014 19:13:10 GMT
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Fair enough, the size of the turbo affects the lag as well, that is why turbo's in the back box are small low pressure turbos, but you could run multiple turbos to get a better power band
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Which car/engine combo are you planning to use? I'm trying to picture the amount of space you have, or don't have?
Also have you considered running a supercharger instead of a turbo?
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1988 Mercedes w124 superturbo diesel 508hp
1996 Mercedes s124 e300 diesel wagon
1990 BMW E30 V8 M60 powered!
1999 BMW E46 323ci project car
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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Jan 11, 2014 10:03:21 GMT
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Which car/engine combo are you planning to use? I'm trying to picture the amount of space you have, or don't have? Also have you considered running a supercharger instead of a turbo? I want to keep it quiet right now what it is, but it's beige and old man spec! It's a possible secret RRG14 project Engine is a Rover 3.9 V8, I just happened to have one knocking about and has twin SU's which I know how to pressurise on the cheap. I can always upgrade to a 4.6 or go smallblock in the future when the funds allow  The only useable space I have is behind the carbs, infront is tight with the bonnet line so supercharging is just not a workable solution without cutting a hole through the bonnet as I want it to remain 100% sleeper. I've already mostly made the exhaust manifolds to mount a Garrett T04 turbo on the side, and the exhaust will have to run along the top of the engine bay and exit down the back alongside the bellhousing. I've retro fitted a serpentine timing cover and pulleys which just leaves enough space for a good capacity radiator and fans to be mounted at the front, and leaves next to no room for any intake plumbing, let alone an intercooler. I've also had to cut the starter motor mount off the block and relocate that to make clearance for the engine to fit in the engine bay! |
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Jan 11, 2014 11:37:17 GMT
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Hi, Have you thought about using air conditioning to cool the intercooler? With an evaporator and it's colder temperatures in front of the intercooler you could get away with a smaller unit and so easier to mount.
Colin
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Last Edit: Jan 11, 2014 11:39:03 GMT by colnerov
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