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Sept 21, 2013 18:03:43 GMT
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ianmac: I hope I don't disappoint then! -- We have still not got the engine running. However, today has been a day of trying to determine why the engine won't run rather than more cleaning. I've only had the car for 3 days so I'm not expecting miracles. I'm flat broke until October so buying anything is off the cards too, I have to work with what's to hand. One big advantage is having two Princesses in this instance because I can swap known good items from one to the other. On my immediate shopping list is one spark plug and a second hand battery as these are the main items that are being swapped between the two cars to try and diagnose issues at present. First thing I did today was get the carb off the car. The fuel line in was full of fresh fuel from our first attempt to fire up the car, but the carb was full of stale fuel and sediment. I gave the whole thing as good a clean as I could without having a parts/dish washer before rebuilding it and refitting it to the car. The first problem was the metal circlip on the top of the dashpot internals pinging off and me not having a replacement - on the HL, this is a rubber O ring rather than a circlip - and the second was the fuel return pipe being so old and brittle that it shattered on removal. Happily, I could just swap the dashpot from the HL to the HLS easily so we had a working carburettor for the purposes of engine checking. Next we removed the old spark leads from the HLS and replaced them with the leads from the HL that I'd kept just-in-case and knew worked. The old HLS leads do have some corrosion in the connectors and some electrical tape on one of the leads which doesn't instill a great deal of confidence. Spark plugs were removed and found to be heavily sooted. These have been cleaned in the meantime and will eventually be replaced but they'll have to do for now. The internals of the carb were quited sooted up too, hinting at some pretty rich running which probably hints at another problem that's been disguised rather than resolved. 10,000 miles and 16 years ago the car did have a service of some sort. This is the first fragment of service history I've been able to find. At some point we also jacked the car up to see if the factory jacks worked (they do) and to put the car to her proper height. After this was taken the car was let down and sits only slightly lower than the HL did when I collected it, there's no sign of a list to any corner and it does seem to just be low on fluid rather than having any inherent suspension issues which is reassuring. The sill on this side is scruffy but actually quite solid, should just need a scrub and repaint and maybe a few localised sparkle-stick areas to be MoT ready. Unlike the tyres. Removed the rear view mirror plinth from the car and Dad showed me how to pop the mirror back into it without breaking anything. The lens is very fragile and will ideally want replacing, but it's nice to have this all back together and in the car. Even managed to not destroy the sticker when I cleaned this part. There's another sticker underneath the one you can see but I didn't make any attempt to get to it. We have a known issue with the wiper motor, it seems to work however it wants to regardless of the stalk setting and the only way to stop it is to pull the fuse. The blower fan also works but that does at least appear to be controllable. The headlights work on all settings but the indicators and hazards don't. We didn't test the reversing lights. Gear change is acceptable with the engine off, not been able to check with the engine on. Brakes work well enough for the drive but will need an overhaul before being used on the road. Handbrake seems to work well. Clutch seems okay, but the level of wear is unknown. Floor pans are definitely solid and appear to have never been welded or needed welding. Exhaust looks in good order but we don't know if it blows on account of not having the engine running yet. Driver's window regulator needs rebuilding, it doesn't really work at all. Rear driver's side door now locks and unlocks. Driver's door won't lock/unlock with the key, reason unknown. On the engine front we now know a bit more about what works and what doesn't. We suspect there's a compression issue and possibly a snapped piston ring on account of abnormal behaviour with the oil filler cap visibly pressurising and depressurising when cranking. No compression tool at the moment so I can't check what's amiss exactly. Two core plugs on the battery side of the engine have been gummed up with araldite for reasons unknown. By swapping items between the two cars we know the coil and leads work. We also know the coil ballast resistor/suppressor thingy for the HLS is missing. So the car will crank on the starter motor. But there's no spark from the coil at all. We ran out of time to apply a multimeter to things today, it's been a bit hectic, but that's the next job to find out where the electricity is escaping. Earth points and wiring routes look the same as the HL and there's no obvious signs of damage or corrosion to wires or connectors but a multimeter will tell us more on that front. The engine will likely need a rebuild, that's okay and to be expected given the information I was given about the car. Parts for the 2 litre O series aren't too difficult to obtain and there's even a local firm that I'm told specialise in engine rebuilds of any variety for not obscene amounts of money so I might be going that route. My immediate plan is to get a compression test, buy a second hand battery, a spark plug and an O ring for the carburettor. I'm going to see if the local hydragas specialist will come out and pump up the suspension for a nominal fee, he's only about 4 miles away, and we'll go from there.
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stevea
Part of things
Posts: 281
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Sept 21, 2013 18:54:06 GMT
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........We have a known issue with the wiper motor, it seems to work however it wants to regardless of the stalk setting and the only way to stop it is to pull the fuse. ......... The headlights work on all settings but the indicators and hazards don't........ Regarding the wiper motor, it looks to be the usual one fitted to many BL and British cars, it could be worth checking all of the wires on the switch (and contacts) for it and if that doesn't fix it, the park switch on the wiper motor. If the park wire/switch is not working it will tend to keep running on. Indicators, I guess it'll have the old bi-metallic 2-pin units, I found they don't like the damp, being sat dormant for too long or low voltages, so they might improve with the engine running and a higher voltage.
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Sept 21, 2013 19:21:26 GMT
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I know with my other Princess (heh, that still amuses me to say) a lot of the switches and such improved just with use so I'll go through the various dash connectors and get it all cleaned up. Dash is likely coming out anyway so I can check all is well behind it and it'll be easier to clean some of it up.
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Smiler
Posted a lot
I no longer own anything FWD! Or with less than 6 cylinders, or 2.5ltrs! :)
Posts: 2,492
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Sept 21, 2013 20:15:22 GMT
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I'm enjoying reading about your progress, keep it up. I do like the styling of these cars. Thread bookmarked.
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www.Auto-tat.co.uk'96 Range Rover P38 DSE (daily driver) '71 Reliant Scimitar SE5 GTE 3.0ltr Jag V6 Conversion '79 Reliant Scimitar SE6A 3.0ltr 24valve Omega Conversion '85 Escort Cabrio 2.0 Zetec - Sold '91 BMW 525i - Sold '82 Cortina 2.9i Ghia Cosworth - Sold '72 VW Campervan - Sold '65 LandRover 88" - Sold
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Sept 21, 2013 21:15:49 GMT
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I have very fond memory's of the old princesses Me as a child sitting in the back plush seat enjoying being chauffeured around by my dad (sadly passed now ) he had a purple one not sure what the o.g colour was called .... Even remember breaking down in Scotland due to the exhaust snapping and having to help him fix it with some gilbo,s a bean tin and some jubilee clips at the side of the road lol Only sold it to buy a maxi woohoo !!!
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120y
Part of things
Posts: 423
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Sept 22, 2013 11:21:46 GMT
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Well reading all this I have decided I want a Princess/Ambassador its caused an argument with the wife as she says they are ugly. I have had the pleasure of experience of the 2.2l HLS princess and the 1.7l Ambassador so I know how nice they drive if a little underpowered, but thanks to you ive decided its time to buy myself a big hunk of Austin tin. Thankyou.
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1996 Renault Clio MK1 1.4 RT Auto
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Sept 22, 2013 14:50:19 GMT
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I used to drive a 2.2 Princess. Straight 6, 3 spd auto, power steering ... the height of luxury after an Austin Maxi ......
I removed to rear silencer for a straight thru bit of pipe. ( well in those days it added at least 20bhp dontcha know ......lol)The straight 6 sounded good afterwards tho ......
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Sept 22, 2013 17:39:58 GMT
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120y: Go for it! They might be funny looking on the outside, but who cares when they're like a mobile sitting room on the inside? --- After swapping the relevant bits over from the HL, I gapped the known good points from the HL after fitted them to the HLS. The stage was set, the players - Dad, neighbour and I - stood anxiously by and we turned the key... Burning rubber smell but an engine really trying hard now to fire up. Seized alternator. Dad showed us how to free this off with a BFO spanner before we made a second attempt at which point the engine fired into life and the alternator span and then seized. A third application of BFO spanner and the car sprang into life with a big cloud of smoke out the exhaust (presumably the oil put in the bores ages ago to unseize things) and a VERY loud exhaust. IT LIVES! Here's a crappy video by way of demonstration. There's something about getting a car to fire up for the first time when it's been silent for a long time, it's a very satisfying thing. Of course, this wasn't just about giving the car its voice back, this was about finding out just what was wrong with it and why it had been laid up all those years ago. It took only a minute or two for us to find out when oil started to seep from one corner of the engine and steam from the other with the temperature gauge rapidly climbing towards danger zone. Obviously we turned the car off straight away so as not to cause any further problems, but it looks like the car was most likely laid up due to head gasket failure. After everything was turned off and we were having a poke around and deciding what should be done next we noticed that one of the old fuel lines had split. No real surprise but it's good that it did this after the engine was turned off rather than during. With all the excitement out of the way, I was left to get on with anything else I could find to do. That really meant I could only crack on with the cleaning since I'm waiting for payday until I can do anything further for the engine. Took the centre consoles out for a clean and found out why the handbrake warning light doesn't work; looks like the wire has lost the connector. The rear centre console was packed with copper coins too, like someone had been posting them through the holes in it or something. Cleaned up the front centre console and managed to break the ashtray/cubby lid when trying to get the crack to line up on it. It's a clean break and I have some plastic glue so I'll repair it. I need to remake the gaiter too as the vinyl is split and torn, the handbrake gaiter is missing completely so I'll need to make one of those too. Fairly simple items to make at least. In order to clean up the seats properly I needed to perform some repairs. I haven't got any matching fabric and this is probably the most difficult colour HLS interior to find as it seems to not have survived in great numbers. Sewing kit it is for now. It did mean I could give the driver's seat a shampoo. I'm using Stardrops in a stronger concentration than usual in a squirty bottle. Spray on the cloth and work up into a foam with a nail brush before blotting it with a clean damp flannel. The seats will all need two or three applications of this but it's very good at not ruining the fabric or soaking the foams too much. Removed the black gaffer tape repair on the rear seat bolster too. The gaffer tape was hiding a very long tear that looks like it's been caused by a dog scratching the fabric. Ideally I'd let a new panel in here but since I don't have any to hand I did my best to stitch the fabric together before attempting to clean it. Trickiest part was making sure the ribs of the fabric lined up properly. Then finally I shampooed the other half of the rear seat. I'll do the passenger side of the car once the driver's side is fully dried out. It looks like this interior will tidy up rather well and although it won't be perfect, it will certainly be servicable for everyday use. So that's Day 4 of my adventures with the new Princess.
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120y
Part of things
Posts: 423
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Sept 22, 2013 18:27:12 GMT
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Nice the engine at least runs, probably with a new head gasket it will be ok. great progress keep the updates coming
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1996 Renault Clio MK1 1.4 RT Auto
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Sept 22, 2013 18:43:59 GMT
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This is just looking superb my good man... If any Princess needed a good home it was this one and it has certainly found one at Volks Towers...!!!
I cannot wait to see the results of a 'Volks' standard deep-deep-deep clean!
I just know this is going to look the dogs whatsits once it's had the love it deserves...
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***GARAGE CURRENTLY EMPTY***
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Smiler
Posted a lot
I no longer own anything FWD! Or with less than 6 cylinders, or 2.5ltrs! :)
Posts: 2,492
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Sept 22, 2013 18:44:13 GMT
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Good progress. I made good headway with the Cortina today too so that's two of us happy.
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www.Auto-tat.co.uk'96 Range Rover P38 DSE (daily driver) '71 Reliant Scimitar SE5 GTE 3.0ltr Jag V6 Conversion '79 Reliant Scimitar SE6A 3.0ltr 24valve Omega Conversion '85 Escort Cabrio 2.0 Zetec - Sold '91 BMW 525i - Sold '82 Cortina 2.9i Ghia Cosworth - Sold '72 VW Campervan - Sold '65 LandRover 88" - Sold
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Rich
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 6,341
Club RR Member Number: 160
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1981 Austin Princess - 11/08 - Sold!Rich
@foxmcintyre
Club Retro Rides Member 160
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Sept 23, 2013 7:12:19 GMT
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I know with my other Princess (heh, that still amuses me to say)
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Sept 26, 2013 0:37:30 GMT
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Working through my checklist, I can update it again now.
Engine Stuff £10-15 - second-hand battery
£15 - head gasket (bought full gasket set) £? - head check, skim if necessary. £? - 2 core plugs £0.20 - Carb dashpot inners circlip/o-ring - lost during service, still hunting for it. £1.50-2 - 1 spark plug £10 - contact points £? - water pump - might as well if I'm doing the timing belt £10-15 - rubber fuel pipes
MoT stuff £80 - 4 tyres (probably part worns) and wheel balance £15 - Tracking
£FREE - bulbs £12 - wiper blades £FREE - clutch bleed £0-10 brake bleed £FREE - inspect discs and pads - preliminary check shows they might be okay Drums seem to be functioning well. £? - Brake flexi £20 (estimate) - suspension pump up £15 (pair) - suspension rebound strap £15 - fresh oil £FREE - fresh antifreeze £? - exhaust blow fixed - could be a joint, could be a box, don't know yet. £8 - air filter £? - driver's door lock to work on the key £8-16 - Track rod ends, pair £? - Balljoints, at least one £? - any necessary welding
eBay is very useful for some of this stuff and competitively priced.
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Sept 26, 2013 8:38:22 GMT
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That seems like a very manageable list you have there Vulg'... I suppose having had your other Princess for quite a while yoou've got a good feel for this marque...?!
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***GARAGE CURRENTLY EMPTY***
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Sept 26, 2013 10:24:27 GMT
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Yeah, bit like I did with the Polo I had for ages. There's very, very little that can actually go wrong and most of the parts are easily replaced as well as being quite cheap. Really, the only expensive thing is time because it needs a lot of that but thankfully my time for my projects is charged in cups of tea so it won't break the bank.
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Sept 29, 2013 18:15:05 GMT
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It's Sunday, and it's been a stunner of a day. Clearly, tinkering with cars is the only thing anyone ought to be doing on a day like this. Given the recent success of a wooden steering wheel I'm restoring I felt confident to tackle the walnut veneered insert on the dashboard of the HLS. I was going to strip the HL down too, but that doesn't look like it really needs doing so it can stay as is for now. The procedure for removing the dashboard is actually pretty straightforward until you get to unplugging things. Once the top trim rail is removed - just snaps into place on metal clips - it's a case of locating the various screws and just undoing them then reaching behind the dash and unplugging relevant wires and cables. The only issue I had was that one of the heater control knobs had paper wedged inside it and wouldn't come free without considerable effort but after that it was plain sailing and I had the unit out in one lump. I'm fairly certain that on the HL the instruments all stayed attached to the main dash rather than coming out with this part so perhaps the HLS was built slightly differently on this front. This also gave me a chance to have a look behind the dash at the wiring as I wasn't sure what wildlife, if any, had been living in there. Just spiders, as it happens, and on the whole the wiring is in pretty good fettle. I though the radio was an original jobby, it certainly looked right for the car, but it turns out it was housing the only bit of dodgy wiring and is actually from an Allegro that might have been called Flipper. The factory connector block for the radio just had the wires shown above twisted and pushed into the relevant holes. Any spare holes have matchsticks wedged into them. So we'll be putting that right before the radio goes back in then. There's lacquer lift in all the usual places on the wooden insert. This chip is the worst bit of damage, funnily enough the HL has a similar chip in the same location. I'll fill and paint it to match the wood as best I can before revarnishing the insert. With all the plastic exterior trim stripped off it's not a huge amount of work to redo as there's not a great deal of wood to have to fart about with. I'll be very careful as the veneer looks to be exceptionally thin but all being well it'll come up better than new. I found that the choke telltale filter is missing completely, I had hoped it would be hiding in the dashboard. There is a hazard filter but it looks for all the world like it's from a different car. I'll probably just use appropriately coloured sweet wrappers or something until I can find a new pair of appropriately coloured filters so I don't get dazzled by the telltale lights.
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Sept 29, 2013 20:09:22 GMT
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Yay! Another Wedge and a red one at that. Hopefully this will help the process of wedge rehabilitation in the publics eyes. I would still love to see a really fast wedge. My earliest memories of speed was my dad pushing his green 1800HL along a Coventry bypass at what seemed a million miles an hour to my 6 year old self.
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Sept 29, 2013 20:23:28 GMT
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They'll hustle along quite happily, just takes a while to get up a full head of steam. Thanks for the mental image though, I imagine he looked a lot like the guy in your avatar at the time.
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I was going to update my checklist first with this update, but since I've spectacularly failed to purchase or otherwise acquire a single item on it I deemed there being no point to that particular exercise. Instead, I've been making a start on a few jobs that wanted doing and I've got more planned to do today. I accidentally worked on Sunday so I'm taking today off in lieu to make up for it otherwise I'll end up working a fortnight without break and that is a Bad Thing. I finally managed to find a shortcut for getting the shot lacquer off the dash fascia. I've got this weird square cut craft knife blade which has never really been much use until today when I found it could persuade the lacquer to lift from the veneer without causing damage. There were a few stubborn spots that had to be persuaded with sandpaper, but overall it took me probably an hour or two to clean up the fascia back to bare wood. The lacquer that came off had gone cloudy and was obscuring much of the detail of the burr walnut. A little bit of fill and stain work was required on that chip. Must be something about the design of the dashboard because I've seen a few that have this chip in the same place. I just wanted to make it look less obvious so I've not gone all out trying to mimic wood grain or anything. With a first coat of varnish on two things were immediately apparent; the first was just how richly hued the veneer is when you can actually see it properly... ... the second was how dry the wood had become where the old lacquer had lifted. It's definitely going to be at least a 3 coat job to get this looking how I want it to but initial signs are promising. You can see where the varnish looks flat and purplish, that's where previously the lacquer had lifted and looked yellow around the edges. There's no evidence of bleaching or staining of the veneer which is comforting so it should look very smart once I've build up a good layer of clear coat. Another pleasant surprise was the driver's door. There has been a rusty strip poking up from behind the door trim and I'd assumed it was the remnants of the frame where the chrome trim and weather strip clips on. Turns out the rusty bit was actually the remnants of the weather strip itself. I'm hoping I can get a length of this stuff as all four doors need it replacing. It looks like it might be a universal thing and it has trim clips that hold it to the stainless trim which then pushes onto the door frame. Any ideas where I might purchase this sort of thing? Some repair work has been done to the frame rail and it's not perfect as some of it is filler and mesh but it seems to have prevented things getting any worse and I should be able to sort this out without replacing the whole door. The bottom of the driver's door is amazingly solid all things considered. For all I was going to write this door off as being dead it's actually pretty good. The two screws in the door go through the original captive nuts and are correct for the door mirrors. Looks like BL changed the location of the mirror fixings for the final year of production which technically makes the 1981 doors unique to that year as the mirror fixings are differently spaced with captive nuts on the earlier cars. Likewise, the rear door this side is also in good shape overall. I've removed the door cards to clean them properly and to fit the new regulator I sourced for the driver's door. You can see the incorrect window winder on this door which I'd like to replace with a correct 1981 handle which is similar, though not identical, to Maestro and Montego items. This is the inside of that door. Could be better but could also be far worse. Best of all though was yesterday when Dad admitted that the car wasn't worth scrapping or breaking. I'm not sure exactly what changed his mind, whether it was my determination, how much I've managed to improve just by cleaning or whether it was seeing how badly rotten that scrapyard car was, but it was certainly nice to hear.
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Last Edit: Oct 7, 2013 13:21:07 GMT by Deleted
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That is quite the transformation. Very nice indeed! --Phil
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