|
|
|
Aug 19, 2013 15:13:51 GMT
|
Hello, go easy on me as I'm just coming out of retro car retirement. I've been using a VW T5 as a daily for over a year and I love it (camping, mountain biking, trips to the Alps etc...) but I'm dying to get back into a car. The main car that is currently drawing all of my attention is the BMW M3 that nobody seems to like. The E36. For me it seems to tick a lot of boxes; 1. They look cool in a completely understated and anonymous manner (My bright red Cosworth Capri got attention everywhere and I didn't like it!) 2. Prices have bottomed out (looking to spend less than 5 grand) 3. 300bhp + 4. RWD (this is a must) 5. When I get bored I could re-shell it into an E30 touring and have rapid camping/biking transportation Can anyone with experience add to the list of pros or cons? Can these cars be used as a weekend warrior without too much grief or am I looking for a world of pain? They are getting on a bit but surely they're a lot simpler than later offerings.   Can't even find any decent pics of one! Surely they're not that unpopular. |
| |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Aug 19, 2013 17:21:33 GMT
|
|
I had an early Evo a few years back, absolutely loved it to bits!
They can certainly be picked up for sensible money now too, as they are too expensive for kids to insure and getting a bit long in the tooth for most fast car guys.
I bought mine with a ruined engine, as they were still £5k for a decent one at the time and I couldn't afford that. I bought a donor engine and 'box and then sold on all the bits I didn't need - the engine parts went mainly to Australia and America for good money (they didn't get the proper M3 out there). I actually ended up being quids in on the engine! One of the reasons I went for this car in the first place was it had the alcantara Vadar seats, not leather - far superior in every way!
Great cars, easy to work on. If serviced and run on good oil the engines last amazingly well. Unfortunately, rust seems to be the issue with these now (either that, or they're worn out from being driven hard for 15 years plus).
They've always been bought by people who want to go fast, so plenty have been thrashed; it's the ones that didn't get maintained that are the dogs to avoid. Most tired ones are obviously so, they should be tight, nimble and crisp.
Joe
|
| |
|
|
mattc
Part of things
It will be done one day.....
Posts: 217
|
|
Aug 19, 2013 20:50:40 GMT
|
|
My mate runs one. Great cars and very well built.
Need to make sure you get a good one to start with, as stated rust can get them on the arches. A decent history on an M would be nice so you know its had oil changes are important.
Easy enough to look after at home and simple enough to work on. Don't forget the "M" tax that goes on parts it cost my mate £90 for filter and oil and a lot of the parts are M specific, crafty BMW for ya.
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
Aug 20, 2013 10:00:01 GMT
|
|
as a M3 owner i would go for a 328i which i had before the 3, a very good car, fast and you don't get stung with the "MTAX" on every thing you need to buy for these, oh i would also stay away from verts
|
| |
Please don't throw litter, take it home.
|
|
|
|
|
Aug 20, 2013 13:03:09 GMT
|
Thanks for the pointers. The more googling I do the more love I find for the 328. Can I ask what's so special about it? I've heard they're one of the few cars that actually make more than the quoted power figures with most making over 200bhp. Is this just pub talk? I'm also have a mate with a garage that looks after me with trade price service parts and the like which might make the M-tax more palatable. I also have access to their lift and storage space. I didn't have this option when I had my last car which made working on it a real pain. This is part of the reason I'm thinking about a fun car as it'll be so much easier to deal with. And I've cracked the google code, these are more like it.     |
| |
|
|
|
|
|
Aug 20, 2013 21:36:40 GMT
|
|
Unfortunately. They are pretty awful.
Firstly - the more affordable ones are the 3.0, and they only made 240bhp. Over 300 requires an Evo model (315bhp) which are twice as expensive.
Not only does rust kill them, but the engines are weak. I've had one with 61k and another on 91k and both bottom ends let go. They have to be serviced every 5k and service parts are expensive. A lot of the wearing parts are actually dealer only.
They don't handle any better than any other E36 to be honest, although they would if all the suspension was as new, but its so expensive to maintain that most of the undercarriage is neglected.
A good one, with lots of history, cared for, with all the right extras, can be a nice thing, but you'll have to find £10k to nab one of those, and you'll look at 75 others and get annoyed before you find that good one.
But don't let me put you off, get one, I'll happily keep you in supply of parts from the ones I'm breaking!
If it was me, a nice 328i Sport, (yes they did usually make a little more than the quoted 193bhp), M50B25 manifold conversion and a remap to get to 220bhp for a couple of hundred quid, and US M3 cams and another remap to get 230-240bhp and you're matching a 3.0 one, enjoying cheaper insurance, reliability, 12k service intervals, keener MPG and it looks exactly the same.
|
| |
|
|
mrdave
Part of things
Posts: 26 
|
|
|
|
Unfortunately. They are pretty awful. Firstly - the more affordable ones are the 3.0, and they only made 240bhp. Over 300 requires an Evo model (315bhp) which are twice as expensive. Not only does rust kill them, but the engines are weak. I've had one with 61k and another on 91k and both bottom ends let go. They have to be serviced every 5k and service parts are expensive. A lot of the wearing parts are actually dealer only. They don't handle any better than any other E36 to be honest, although they would if all the suspension was as new, but its so expensive to maintain that most of the undercarriage is neglected. A good one, with lots of history, cared for, with all the right extras, can be a nice thing, but you'll have to find £10k to nab one of those, and you'll look at 75 others and get annoyed before you find that good one. But don't let me put you off, get one, I'll happily keep you in supply of parts from the ones I'm breaking! If it was me, a nice 328i Sport, (yes they did usually make a little more than the quoted 193bhp), M50B25 manifold conversion and a remap to get to 220bhp for a couple of hundred quid, and US M3 cams and another remap to get 230-240bhp and you're matching a 3.0 one, enjoying cheaper insurance, reliability, 12k service intervals, keener MPG and it looks exactly the same. I really have to disgaree. In the UK you could not get a 240bhp M3. Only the American M3s put that out! Your options were 286bhp (and the 3.0 usually put out more than that!) or 321bhp from the evo (and usually put out less than that!). The 3.0 came with a 5 speed box which is tougher, the 3.2 came with the 6 speed which is much better for the mpgs. Honestly with the valve clearances sorted the 3.0 is a strong engine and really does pull a lot better than even a tuned 2.8! A fit 3.2 will be neck and neck with an e46 M3 until silly speeds. They really are not hard to maintain, parts are not too expensive and plenty are being broken because of rust (which is to be expected on a 20 year old car but they are relaible. They need the oil changed every 5k to keep them perfect but an oil and filter can be had for about 50 quid. The 3.2 has more expensive brakes but 3.0 brakes can be had for good money and they handle so much better than any other E36. By the time you tune a 328 up with the manifold BBTB and cams, add in a remap to get the most from that, put M3 suspension in it and the anti roll bar links, add in an LSD and a few other bits and pieces it will cost more than a good M3 and still not be as quick I'm afraid. A good 3.0 can be had for about 4k, a good evo about 5.5k. Insurance is reasonable and my evo used to give me 32+ mpg on a gentle run. You will have to look out for a good one as there are plenty of dogs about and I would steer clear of the evo, too fragile for not much gain. My 3.0 has needed nothing other than servicing parts to be honest and its well over 100k miles. |
| |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
My bad, yes it was the US one had 240, sorry. In which case the 3.0 really is appalling given it is so slow and boaty with that level of power. It's a frightfully weak engine, refer to my previous post, and I don't know of a single drifter that is still using one whereas they're all happy with their m52s and M60s and M30s... and S30s...
I would worry about what oil you're putting in every 5k if you're only spending £50. They don't like it if you don't use the very best.
But hey, I've only had two, and have dozens of customers with them, and they're all terrible, and I hate E36s as a rule anyway, so I'll say no more, was just trying to help the OP steer clear of potentially the worst car based decision he might ever make.
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
Aug 21, 2013 15:41:28 GMT
|
|
Wow possibly more confused now than when I started the thread! Strong opinions on both sides and I love a bit of healthy debate.
Still, if a car is good it's usually unanimous. Something about the E36 seems to have people spooked.
I wanted something for the occasional local drift day and I didn't want to go down the Nissan route. There's always a load of them on track and just as many sitting broken in the car park.
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
Aug 21, 2013 15:44:28 GMT
|
|
In that case may asell just get a 328i. they're just as much fun for going sideways in.
|
| |
|
|
