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Apr 20, 2012 22:05:00 GMT
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I've read through lots of internet wisdom, but I'm not convinced!
I want to get rid of the power steering on my Mercedes project. No manual steering box is available, how is best to do it?
Can I just loop the two hose connections on the steering box? Does that modification let the remaining fluid circulate properly?
The Merc uses a steering box (recirculating ball or worm and roller... I can't remember), so I'm assuming that the fluid also acts as a lubricant, whereas that may not be the case for PAS-equipped rack and pinion set-ups. Could be wrong there though.
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Apr 20, 2012 22:07:04 GMT
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If it is anything like my w124 was, then you need both hands to turn it.  |
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1988 Mercedes w124 superturbo diesel 508hp
1996 Mercedes s124 e300 diesel wagon
1990 BMW E30 V8 M60 powered!
1999 BMW E46 323ci project car
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tardis
Part of things
Posts: 38
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Apr 20, 2012 22:12:22 GMT
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I'm sure I have read that a car will fail the MOT if it has power steering that is defective and/or obviously not working. When I converted my old Merc van over I junked the whole lot and used a non pas box out of a different model just to be on the safe side. It might be worth while checking with your local friendly MOT tester.
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Apr 20, 2012 22:32:20 GMT
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If it is anything like my w124 was, then you need both hands to turn it. I'm not too worried, I'll only be using the car as a trackday toy so won't need to parallel park it or anything.  My W115 is non-PAS and is pretty heavy even with the big bus steering wheel! ;D I'm sure I have read that a car will fail the MOT if it has power steering that is defective and/or obviously not working. When I converted my old Merc van over I junked the whole lot and used a non pas box out of a different model just to be on the safe side. It might be worth while checking with your local friendly MOT tester. Hmm, is that part of the raft of new things that were introduced? I'll look into that, although if there's no PAS pump I can't see how a tester will know if it's a manual or PAS set-up. |
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10mpg
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,253
Club RR Member Number: 204
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what do you hope to acheive, if the steering just to light, then a bigger pulley on the power steering pump might help, might reduce parasitic losses as well..
**fyi i have no idea if it would ven work** but to my fuddled logic it makes sense,
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The Internet, like all tools, if used improperly, can make a complete bo**cks of even the simplest jobs...
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stealthstylz
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 14,836
Club RR Member Number: 174
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I've always wondered this, changed a few cars to non-PAS systems. Would it not be better to remove all the PAS related gubbins from the box, then just fill with normal oil/grease. I thought part of the extra effort needed without the engine running is because you're having to pump the oil round.
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andyborris
Posted a lot
Freedom is just another word for nothing left to lose.
Posts: 2,158
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Back in the 70's the Triumph World Cup rally cars run with power steering racks, but no pump.
The power rack has a higher ratio, so it gave the cars a quicker steering and the drivers arms like the Hulk ;D!
Not much help, I know..........
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No way you can switch to rack & pinion rack?
Just bought a hilux which is the first car ive drivern (or knowingly driven) with a a steering box, they are a bit vague lol.
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kevfromwales
Posted a lot
the conrod's REALLY out the block now!
Posts: 3,909
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Apr 21, 2012 11:16:43 GMT
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spoke to my old man (mot tester) about this - as it's on the to do list for the p100 no tech advice to offer, as it's rack, not box, but from an mot point of view, he'd fail it as p/s system incomplete, even if the pump and lines were removed, and the rack unions capped - as it would be obvious that the rack was a power one this is his interpretation, so it might be down to your tester choice?  me, I'll be going for test with standard struts and a standard steering rack |
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Almost on the road: b11 sunny breadvan, e36 tds, 325i skidcar,
nearly there: ford f250 tathauler, suzuki alto, u11 bluey
not for a while: ford pop, 32 rails,
not in this lifetime: ruby, '29 hillman
''unfortanatly I'm quite old and scruffy and in need of some loving. my drive shaft needs a new boot....''
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ChasR
RR Helper
motivation
Posts: 10,192
Club RR Member Number: 170
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Apr 21, 2012 16:28:32 GMT
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If it is anything like my w124 was, then you need both hands to turn it. I was going to say, modern car geometry (well, increased castor angles for one) certainly makes life harder without a rack. |
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Apr 21, 2012 18:13:04 GMT
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Agh, maybe I'll just leave it alone then.  As the car is track-only, I wanted to have a more direct feel to the steering (no need for low-speed manouevers really). Also, I might have bagged 0.03 extra BHP by losing the PAS pump. I want to keep the car MOT'd though, so will maybe have to abandon this idea. Still, that's one less job to do! ;D Thanks for the replies, chaps. |
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Apr 21, 2012 18:40:03 GMT
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I don't know if your car would have one, but I removed the steering damper on my e class. It gave much more feel through the steering.
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1988 Mercedes w124 superturbo diesel 508hp
1996 Mercedes s124 e300 diesel wagon
1990 BMW E30 V8 M60 powered!
1999 BMW E46 323ci project car
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Apr 21, 2012 18:47:43 GMT
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if you want to gain more feel for racing, how about shortening the steering arms, thus giving a higher ratio?
would also give it more lock. assuming wheels/arches didn't rub.
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squonk
Part of things
Posts: 858
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Apr 21, 2012 19:45:55 GMT
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Just take the belt off when your on the track, put it back on the rest of the time!! (unless its a serpentine belt which might make things a bit tricky!)
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2004 Chevrolet Avalanche Z71
2005 Mercedes CLK320 Cabriolet
1996 Mercedes C180 Elegance Auto Saloon
1996 Rover 620Ti (Dead fuel pump)
1992 Toyota HiLux Surf
1987 Range Rover Vogue (Rusty)
1992 Range Rover Vogue SE (More Rusty)
2006 Chrysler Grand Voyager
2008 Corsa 1.4 Design
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Apr 21, 2012 20:09:55 GMT
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a power steering set up would be massivly heavy when not running thou.
they normally run a much higher ratio then a non assited set up.
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Apr 21, 2012 20:50:04 GMT
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Switch to pas pump to a variable assistance 'leggy one from an A class Merc?
That way all the badges will still match :-)
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Koos
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What about an electric PAS pump that you can then switch on and off or maybe somehow get to run at slower speed so adjustable assistance ?
Search for electric PAS pump on eBay.
paul h
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Apr 23, 2012 19:01:25 GMT
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Thanks again for the responses. An electric one would be a neat solution, but I think weighing up how much work it is against what I'd gain, I think I'm better off putting my efforts into other parts of the project. The steering isn't too over-assisted, and with a smaller steering wheel it should feel pretty "sporty" I hope. I just thought there might be a simple fix like looping the two connections, but it looks like it'll cause more bother than it's worth. |
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My W115 is non-PAS and is pretty heavy even with the big bus steering wheel! ;D
