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XJ6/XJ12 wheelarch repair panels - progress?

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foxy99 Posted a lot Posts: 1,391	XJ6/XJ12 wheelarch repair panels - progress?foxy99 @foxy99
	Sept 1, 2011 1:52:11 GMT Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top
	Anyone restoring a classic XJ6/XJ12 will probably appreciate that there are good quality repair panels available for practically every part of the body (from dealers like Martin Robey/David Manners etc). I have purchased: inner & outer sills; sill end caps; rear wheel arch inners/outers; radius arm box section; front jacking points & front wing nose-cones. All but one panels have been from one of the many established dealers and are as true to the originals as you could expect. I was a bit miffed however that after spending weeks measuring and trimming then welding on the inner arch repair section that there was a gap of about 1cm between it and the lip on the outer panel when that is offered up. I've not thought of a solution yet so the job remains unfinished a year or so after the inner went on...... I have now moved to the other side of the car, where nothing has been touched, and made several comparisons and there is definitely a problem. When the rot is cut away and the new sections welded in you won't be able to spot/plug weld the lips together because of the gap. It seems to me that the outer panel would fit perfectly if it was welded on top of the old rusted bodywork but not if you cut the rot out. Anyone got any thoughts on this? LHS inner and outer arch repair sections. outer panel is more brown than black and this may make gap between lips more visible RHS panels show same problem. outer panel here was bought years before the other three and has different labelling yet same gap exists prior to fitting gaps could be closed up with clamps. I assumed gap was deliberate in to allow for heat etc when panels welded in inner arch repair panel well shaped and blends in very well with original bodywork
	Last Edit: Dec 9, 2011 2:42:16 GMT by foxy99 1974 Daimler Double-Six VDP 1965/67 Hillman Imp pick-up 1984 VW Polo breadvan 1970s Yamaha Twins (4) 1976 Honda SS50ZK1

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richw82 Part of things Posts: 716	XJ6/XJ12 wheelarch repair panels - progress?richw82 @richw82
	Sept 1, 2011 9:30:23 GMT Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top
	You're not the first to notice this! Lately they've been a bit poor, and several of the Jaguar forums have posters reporting the same issue. They appear to almost be a cover panel rather than a cut out and replace. I've got one to do on my series 1, so I think I'm going to go for a full wing and inner, rather than repair. Best of luck, Rich
	"You're about as likely to come across a fully functioning old Jag, as you are a taxicab that smells agreeable." - James May

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richw82 Part of things Posts: 716	XJ6/XJ12 wheelarch repair panels - progress?richw82 @richw82
	Sept 1, 2011 9:33:09 GMT Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top
	To add to this... the last one I did used a repair cut to size from a genuine Jaguar full inner panel, which meant I could cut it to suit. The outer repair was a pressing by a German company and was first class in fit and shape.
	"You're about as likely to come across a fully functioning old Jag, as you are a taxicab that smells agreeable." - James May

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foxy99 Posted a lot Posts: 1,391	XJ6/XJ12 wheelarch repair panels - progress?foxy99 @foxy99
	Sept 1, 2011 23:29:02 GMT Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top
	Thanks very much for the reply Rich. Its great to know I'm not imagining it! I've held off from putting the outer panels on but the inner is on on one side and I'm very happy with the fit but was worried it was to 'short'. The panels are not too expensive so I might buy another couple of the outers in the hope they are a better fit. My panels were made in Denmark incidentally Graham
	1974 Daimler Double-Six VDP 1965/67 Hillman Imp pick-up 1984 VW Polo breadvan 1970s Yamaha Twins (4) 1976 Honda SS50ZK1

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tonybmw Posted a lot Posts: 1,367	XJ6/XJ12 wheelarch repair panels - progress?tonybmw @tonybmw
	Sept 4, 2011 10:39:48 GMT Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top
	If the new panel turns out to be the same, I would be tempted to flatten out the inner arch and reform the lip to suit the new outer arch, hopefully there will be enough material on it to do it without adding any metal, but if not you could always weld on a new inner lip in its entirety once the inner arch is cut to the right shape, as you would be doing this without the outer arch being fitted, it should be easy enough to make a good job
	. Victor Rebuild Gold BMW E12 M535i Silver BMW E12 M535i Making Panels TonyBMW website

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foxy99 Posted a lot Posts: 1,391	XJ6/XJ12 wheelarch repair panels - progress?foxy99 @foxy99
	Sept 4, 2011 16:42:04 GMT Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top
	Thanks for the suggestion Tony. This could work well as the inner won't be visible so better to adapt that than mess with the outer which will be on show The outer is quite generously made so there is a lot of it I won't need and, since I will be trimming a lot off the top of it, I can maybe push it up further to meet the inner. *outer panel is bold enough to fit over* original body at dog leg and wheelarch. cover panel? not all of original outer arch needs cut away at door so shape of repair panel here is not an issue inner arch repair panel trimmed and almost ready to weld in**
	Last Edit: Sept 6, 2011 2:15:25 GMT by foxy99 1974 Daimler Double-Six VDP 1965/67 Hillman Imp pick-up 1984 VW Polo breadvan 1970s Yamaha Twins (4) 1976 Honda SS50ZK1

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foxy99 Posted a lot Posts: 1,391	XJ6/XJ12 wheelarch repair panels - progress?foxy99 @foxy99
	Sept 6, 2011 2:41:19 GMT Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top
	job done looks pretty good from underneath too
	1974 Daimler Double-Six VDP 1965/67 Hillman Imp pick-up 1984 VW Polo breadvan 1970s Yamaha Twins (4) 1976 Honda SS50ZK1

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foxy99 Posted a lot Posts: 1,391	XJ6/XJ12 wheelarch repair panels - progress?foxy99 @foxy99
	Sept 7, 2011 1:55:08 GMT Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top
	Now that the inner is on I am making the best I can of the slightly outsize outer repair panel. Its still much better than having to form something from scratch. That must be a nightmare job! I've trimmed a lot of it away and clamped it loosely in place ready to start welding but you can see from the second shot there is a bit of a flange gap . Not the end of the world tho. There is also a bit of a problem at the front where, I think, I should have positioned the inner panel a couple of mm's further inboard outer panel trimmed and almost ready for welding in (brown) outer panel against (black) inner panel shows unfortunate gap between lips which are supposed to be close enough to spot weld together front of outer panel sitting a little out of line as inner panel under it should have been positioned slightly further in
	Last Edit: Sept 7, 2011 1:58:33 GMT by foxy99 1974 Daimler Double-Six VDP 1965/67 Hillman Imp pick-up 1984 VW Polo breadvan 1970s Yamaha Twins (4) 1976 Honda SS50ZK1

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foxy99 Posted a lot Posts: 1,391	XJ6/XJ12 wheelarch repair panels - progress?foxy99 @foxy99
	Sept 8, 2011 0:12:48 GMT Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top
	done
	1974 Daimler Double-Six VDP 1965/67 Hillman Imp pick-up 1984 VW Polo breadvan 1970s Yamaha Twins (4) 1976 Honda SS50ZK1

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foxy99 Posted a lot Posts: 1,391	XJ6/XJ12 wheelarch repair panels - progress?foxy99 @foxy99
	Dec 9, 2011 2:58:22 GMT Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top
	As mentioned a while back I was thinking about trying a different repair section for the other (driver's) side of the car and got on on Ebay for £10 (plus £9 postage). I deliberately went for an older one working on the logic that 'its apparently the new ones that are badly pressed' so might get lucky with an old one from the days when they fitted properly Anyway it arrived bent although it didn't look bent in the Ebay listing. Difficult part to package in fairness and probably got bent in transit. I have straightened it out tho and compared it against the other one I have and it definitely seems a bit higher so I'm gonna use this one. Or maybe I should buy a few more
	Last Edit: Dec 9, 2011 3:34:35 GMT by foxy99 1974 Daimler Double-Six VDP 1965/67 Hillman Imp pick-up 1984 VW Polo breadvan 1970s Yamaha Twins (4) 1976 Honda SS50ZK1

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robg2 Part of things Posts: 815	XJ6/XJ12 wheelarch repair panels - progress?robg2 @robg2
	Dec 14, 2011 21:50:11 GMT Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top
	Some good quality welding there...!


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10mpg Club Retro Rides Member Posts: 4,253 Club RR Member Number: 204	XJ6/XJ12 wheelarch repair panels - progress?10mpg @10mpg Club Retro Rides Member 204
	Dec 15, 2011 18:25:27 GMT Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top
	I cant see the problem...? The outer is visible so has to be welded on where it looks right, the inner isnt visible so just dress this back so it lines up with the outer, if you are any good at panel beating you'll never notice the panel has been altered.. Then just drill and plug weld them together or spot weld if you have the gear... simples..
	The Internet, like all tools, if used improperly, can make a complete bo**cks of even the simplest jobs...

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daddygiraffe Part of things Posts: 19	XJ6/XJ12 wheelarch repair panels - progress?daddygiraffe @daddygiraffe
	Jan 14, 2012 20:45:05 GMT Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top
	Whooooaa, looks like a nightmare! Glad I spotted this thread, I have to do some repairs to the back end of the arches on my '75 XJ12L, I bought an arch off ebay to cut up for the repairs, I wonder if its one of the 'cover' type.. Luckily I don't think I need to replace the entire arch, just the back corners, but we all know what happens when you start taking the paint off! Nice to see a VDP getting some love by the way.
	71 Gilbern Invader II 72 Gilbern Invader II 71 Lancia Fulvia Cp 72 Lancia Fulvia Cp 76 Lancia Fulvia Cp 75 Jaguar XJ12L 77 Lancia Beta Coupe 87 VW T25TD Reimo 89 Alfa 75 T.Spark 89 Lancia Y10LXie 90 Lancia Delta HF Martini 91 Alfa 75 3.0 Clov 93 BMW 525iX 94 Ford Transit 95 Alfa 155 2.0SP 97 Alfa 164 3.0 Super 99 Alfa 156 V6 00 Peugeot 106 Sport 02 Audi A6 Avant 04 Alfa GTV jts 05 Citroen C4 2.0HDI 06 Alfa 156 V6

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foxy99 Posted a lot Posts: 1,391	XJ6/XJ12 wheelarch repair panels - progress?foxy99 @foxy99
	Nov 27, 2012 1:01:56 GMT Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top
	Hi daddygiraffe. Sorry I didn't reply to your post back in January. I only re-visited this thread today as it was time to slot the arch repairs into my main resto thread. I get the feeling they might all be the cover type asI have bought 3 different ones and they are all much the same. Not sure why this is the case unless it is somehow easier for the makers to produce then like this or perhaps the vogue with bodyshops at some time was to use them like they would use cover sills. Who knows but I wish I had know about it before. Any chance of some pics of your XJ12L?
	1974 Daimler Double-Six VDP 1965/67 Hillman Imp pick-up 1984 VW Polo breadvan 1970s Yamaha Twins (4) 1976 Honda SS50ZK1

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foxy99 Posted a lot Posts: 1,391	XJ6/XJ12 wheelarch repair panels - progress?foxy99 @foxy99
	Apr 20, 2013 18:21:02 GMT Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top
	Well. That's the rear arch lips on both sides of the car finally welded together. As 10mpg suggested some time ago it was a case of drill and plug weld. I did one side on Thursday night and one on Friday and there were roughly 48 plug welds on each side. I know there has been a ridiculous time lapse in doing this job but I was sorta leaving it to last and I'm now running short of jobs to do on the car so finally dealt with it. I had an idea to cut out a sort of crescent shaped piece of steel and weld it vertically between the gaps or just hammer them up together and seam weld them. The profile would be like a bird's beak. However I did a better job and basically started at the bottom where the gaps were good and taking advantage of the heat as each plug was done stretched the metal upwards on the next one and so on. At the Apex it was getting a bit ridiculous as I was needing to stretch the bottom flange up by about a cm but it has worked and except for a few poor plug welds is pretty neat. The strange thing is the process has produced a sort of wired edge (like you'd get on a mudguard) and it's not visible from outside to job done basically. passenger side arch lips. big gap can be pinched together but only at edges 1st thing to do is drill holes for the 40+ plug welds required then start filling in the ones at the outer ends of the arch some good plugs. some not so good as each one is done you then need to deal with the bulge next to it before making the next plug use of screwdriver to drive in flange/stretch and the job works it's way round leaving quite a neat 'wired edge' effect job done. looks fine moving onto driver's side we see again that outer ends of arches are ok so good place to start. yellow marks are locations of spots taken from original rusted arch lip again we see large gap at apex despite this 3rd purchase repair panel looking like the best of the bunch this shot gives good idea of the amount of puckering up required still a long way to go last 8 to do gratuitous shot of VDP in mid air
	Last Edit: Apr 22, 2013 3:30:47 GMT by foxy99 1974 Daimler Double-Six VDP 1965/67 Hillman Imp pick-up 1984 VW Polo breadvan 1970s Yamaha Twins (4) 1976 Honda SS50ZK1

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