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I think Aero and Griffin are rarest of the 9000s? Do some aero have velour recaroes- and i think recaroes are optional on early cars and standard on later ones? There is a nice original black P reg Aero local to me
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Hi, no all leather with the Aero mate. But some Anniversary models came with leather & suede inserts (could be alcantara though?) I think the velour ones came on the older CS and CD models but cant be sure there? Yeah the Griffin's are getting rare now, still plenty of Aero's to pick up for a good price and loads of CSE's around which you can just as easily get silly power out of... but a nice low milage standard Aero will still fetch good money.
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My Dad was considering getting rid of his for a 9-5 too, meanwhile I'm still getting closer to taking his old CSE. Quite looking forward to tidying it up, needs a bit of work having been laid up outside for 3 years. Will have to go back to standard to start with though so no 230bhp for me, girlfriend says I can't play with it either Keep going with yours, looks great!
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Project Diary1975 Viva / 1988 T25 Camper / 1989 Mini / 1991 MX5 / 1992 Mini / 1994 Saab 9000 / 1997 Saab 9000 / 2008 Saab 9-5
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3" downpipe & cheeky remap..... and she'll never know your at stage 3 mate I kept the standard cat back system on mine for a good 8 months and took it to stage 4 so the missis didn't know I was tuning it for ages!! She twigged when the Abbott Exhaust System turned up a day early though and I was still in work Ran out of hiding places now so I'm screwed Back on the rollers this Saturday, hopefully we'll find this missing 0.3 Bar boost
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Hi, no all leather with the Aero mate. But some Anniversary models came with leather & suede inserts (could be alcantara though?) I think the velour ones came on the older CS and CD models but cant be sure there? Yeah the Griffin's are getting rare now, still plenty of Aero's to pick up for a good price and loads of CSE's around which you can just as easily get silly power out of... but a nice low milage standard Aero will still fetch good money. Just thought Aeros all hatch no saloon ? whereas Carlsson was both
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Yep that's right mate, you can also get Aero interior in the saloon but it's very rare option (and a nightmare to get it to fit in the hatch as it's a solid seat instead of 60/40 split) I tried and failed!! The carlsson's are getting very rare these days and finding a mint one is almost impossible unless your extremely lucky! A friend of mine has a gorgeous black one....and a stripped out track 9000....and a 480 odd bhp one!!! I'm not jealous...honest
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Cars back OTR now and mot'd. Just scrapped through in time for the dyno day a fortnight ago. So its got new pads all round and had the actuator wound up a little more to get it closer to 1.9 bar. Picked it up and after a couple of adaption runs up a huge Welsh mountain it was going pretty well! The boost needle was off the gauge at around 2.2 bar but that gauge isn't very accurate...so pinch of salt on that one! The next day I took it back to Powerstation for a Saab dyno day and on the way up there it felt a fair bit quicker than it did before. But the dyno results were a bit lower than I hoped for. It made 421 bhp & 415 ft/lb torque so a fair drop from the last time but I think this was down to it not having a full run up to 7k like last time as he backed off just after 6k. Was definitely quicker on the road...so I'll scratch that one off as a day out instead with the guys and a nice pub lunch afterwards! Also went out in a mates Saab 9-3 with a TD04-19t which was proper rapid Dyno Result: Luckily the guy thats been mapping my car for the last 2 and a bit years was up there so I also quickly had the car data logged and the map slightly adjusted ready for a fresh remap next month...going by what T5 Suite said (the free Saab mapping software) the car was boosting to 1.7 bar so still 0.2 bar short of the 1.9 boost request. Not sure why but I think this actuator has to be wound right up to get the best out of this turbo! I've got to get my head into this T5 Suite as its such a excellent program and looks so simple when you see it done! The drive home was fun though A few days later I added around 5% thinners to the tank as the Saab guys have been having great fun with this stuff!! I couldn't do a proper ECU reset here as I'd loose the new tweaks to the map so I just canned it through a tank of V-power on the way back up to Hereford, was a bit quicker but I think 5% isn't enough, refilled and added around 7/8% thinners again and took it back out the following day with the boost turned up a little more again...2 & 1/2 more turns on the actuator. That's made one hell of a difference!! Not sure if its the extra %age thinners or extra boost or both but it made a decent increase in performance. My 60-100 has been around 4.3 /4.4 secs in 3rd gear since I've fitted the bigger turbo and I've been struggling to beat it, but now its dropped down to 3.9 secs and I'm still probably not getting that 1.9 bar as requested! Really surprised by that 3.9 secs as it did feel a little quicker but I didn't expect that! 3rd is now nice & quick...but W.O.T in 4th is just bonkers scary! Not tried W.O.T in 5th yet...got to get used to it again!!! Vid: (turn the volume down though...curse word quality) So its going well now but still under boosting!! I've got my spare ECU getting mapped and modified to use a T7 APC instead of the standard T5 one as this is supposed to give much better boost control, plus they're only a few quid for a new one where the older T5 one is pretty expensive new...and I've gone through 3 already. I think this might also get me to 1.9 bar from what I've been told so we'll see! This Abbott Racing Intercooler is starting to struggle big time now though and the drop in performance after one or two W.O.T runs is very noticeable....so its got to go! Was/has been brilliant at stage 4 & 5 but for stage 6 its just not up to it and will be useless at stage 7 later this year. Bit gutted as I wanted the tubular manifold fitted over summer but pretty pointless doing that if I'm getting loads of IC heat soak now! 2 hard six or seven second 3rd gear pulls and thats your lot...thats no good! Gearbox is whining like a good 'un now though! I'll stick some fresh Amsoil in there next week and hopefully it'll last a bit longer but its definitely about to go bang as most Saab 9000 boxes do above 300 bhp! Not a massive drama as I want another 4.45 box anyway...just cant afford to swap them at the moment! Loads more to come
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Jun 26, 2011 16:45:14 GMT
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Lovely motor this buddy. Proper street sleeper. What sort of money is it to get a standard up to ? 300bhp +? Threads like this make me want one but budget would be a factor and without 300bhp+ would be pointless for me to purchase. As I already have a Rangerover p38, merc clk kompressor, Audi A4 and a 21 turbo lol. Always been on my wishlist one of these.
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Jun 26, 2011 19:06:17 GMT
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Cheers....21 Turbo is that the Quadra or 2wd? I wanted one of these a while back and was close to getting one but got laid off in work and couldnt go for it! You just don't see them these days...one day!! Have you done much to it? Pics!!! 280/290bhp on these is pretty easily achievable with a good 3" DP and remap! Job done!! Still a nice fast car then but won't set your pants on fire tbh. I've seen a few of them with close to and just over 300bhp at stage 3 but not sure what else was don't to them? Decat, exhaust & filter? Not sure. Above 300 (stage 4) it gets a bit more expensive with bigger injectors, 3 bar map sensor, bigger intercooler, uprated fuel pump & another remap. Costs a fair bit this and for the money your better off spending a little more and go straight to stage 5. But with some ebaying and nosing through the forums you can still do it pretty cheaply. Remap can be done at home for free if you know what your doing (I don't so it's done by sending the spare ecu off to a friend!!) Up again to stage 5, 350bhp (ish) and it's a bigger turbo, uprated clutch, bigger injectors...and probably worth getting a spare gearbox or two to tuck away!! Stage 6 (400+bhp) - Bigger turbo (Gt30 size) cams, air filter (standard is supposedly good to 350) And goes up again to stage 7+!!but can cost a couple of thousand here with another bigger turbo if you wanted, tubular manifold, gasflowed head and bigger injectors again! Most of the tunes above stage 4 are custom to what ever you want though...that's just a rough idea above. I guess it depends on what you want out if it really, for me and a lot of the guys stage 5 was the best all rounder for fun & fast road performance. The bigger turbos taken a while to get used to as it's proper laggy below 50/60 but a lunatic above 70/80! Ill keep on at this and see how it goes with the tubular, but next car will have a TD04 Hybrid, solid 350 bhp and no more messing!! A good guide to go off is the Maptun site...but it's cheaper to shop around for the shiny bits!! www.maptun.com/tuningGuide.php?kategori=670&model=2323&listorder=37
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Little update... I've now got a Tubular Manifold coming this week from a Nissan Pulsar, I'm hoping this will match up ok with a little modifying as its the same engine as the newer shape 200sx (SR20DET) but I might still need one off the earlier 200sx with pop up lights (CA18DET) So I've got my eye on another cheap ebay special just in case! They've had mixed reviews these cheapo tubulars but for £60 its got to be worth a punt! Here's the same one but off google images: The other one is a slightly different design with longer runners. Just hope they can modify my existing 3" Downpipe now or its more £££ for a new one Next on the shopping list is a bigger Intercooler! Probably one of these: www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FMIC-FFRONT-MOUNT-TURBO-INTERCOOLER-TYPE-B-600x300x76MM-/200484166200?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item2eadc99a38
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Aug 25, 2011 22:45:43 GMT
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Monthly update!! The cars now running with a new map that's been slightly tweaked and I've swapped the T5 APC for a T7 one off a Saab 9-5, ecu was also modified for this and it's a popular mod for the 9000/ng900/og9-3...well worth it. But for the first 30 odd miles I didn't notice much of a difference tbh as the old map was very smooth anyway. But after disconnecting the battery for an hour to reset the ecu again the difference is night & day More noticeable when your W.O.T in 2nd than the other gears although there's a more controlled boost delivery in all gears (4th is simply bonkers now ) before 2nd would just spin @ 4k & try it's hardest to swap lanes and kill you! But now it's much more controlled, seems to come in a lot harder but smoother which is nice and has just transformed the sub 60 mph performance in 2nd...its much much quicker. 2nd still limited to base boost @ 1 Bar though so I'd like to up that slightly and see how it goes. Peak boost is still under 1.9 bar so that needs looking at. Anyway...pics; T7 APC Valve curse word picture but here's the old T5 valve All wired up and buzzing away like a good 'un It's just been plastic tied onto where the old valve lived, been on a month now with no probs! Next....thicker Intercooler
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Aug 25, 2011 23:11:38 GMT
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This is where the car gets let down at this stage, my Abbott Racing IC has been great through stages 3-5 but at stage 6 it's struggling...and at stage 7 where I want to be by Xmas it'll have no chance! Can't really complain as I don't think it's designed to take double the standard cars bhp!! You get one or two decent W.O.T runs out of it then it gets heat soaked and the performance drops right off. We first noticed it on the dyno back in Dec, first run was 416bhp and that then dropped to around 380odd. Was fine on the road, had no problems whatsoever but as the powers been gradually upped to 450+ it's much more noticeable now. Still pulls well but loses it's sparkle a bit. So ive bought one of the eBay Chinese specials!! £70 posted for a 630x300x76mm size with a 450x300x76 core. The Abbott is 40mm thick iirc? Abbotts also £500+ new I was going to go a size bigger but as I'm not going to track the car this should be fine for road use. Also sticking with the red hoses!! Cost a small fortune these hoses when you add it all up, right PITA I'm taking it to a friends garage on Sunday to get fitted, hopefully we can get it so it's a bit more on show by pushing it more forward as the Abbott ones hidden. Might cut the bumper for this (scoobie style )....we'll see!
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woodenspatulas
Part of things
Retro in ways you can't imagine
Posts: 448
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Aug 26, 2011 12:14:03 GMT
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wow nice power output! Ive got the lead for my upgrade to T7 APC but the map ive got was setup with the t5 so until ive got that all running I wont swap it just yet. But then I'm hoping for a modest 300bhp
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1999 Vectra Estate + 1995 Saab Engine = Good Times
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Aug 26, 2011 16:16:35 GMT
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Thanks Still a fair bit to go, I'm hoping the tubular will help it crack 500 and I'll see how far I can take it. The turbos meant to be good for 550 but I might need some head work done to jack the power up even more...only one way to find out!! Also hoping it reduces the lag by around 500rpm as 3rd gear is proper laggy below 60 so you need to work 2nd a bit harder. Defo worth doing the T7 mod, I put it off for years but it's one of the best mods I've done.
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Aug 26, 2011 20:30:56 GMT
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Nice work as always. What work is involved in the T7 APC conversion. I've read it's a great mod to do so it's on my list. Isn't there some changing of wires and modification of the ECU needed? Within the next two years I'm hoping to gradually up my 9k to Stage 2/3 + T7 APC and whatever else as money, insurance and family allows. I haven't looked into it too much as it's come to a bit of a standstill; ready for an MOT but no one will temporarily insure me and I don't want to spend a years insurance in case it doesn't pass. Plus I need to wait for my paycheck
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Project Diary1975 Viva / 1988 T25 Camper / 1989 Mini / 1991 MX5 / 1992 Mini / 1994 Saab 9000 / 1997 Saab 9000 / 2008 Saab 9-5
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Aug 26, 2011 21:06:35 GMT
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Hiya budd, the ECU & T7 valve were bought off one of the guys earlier this year, ECU was already modded for it but needed resoldering as one connector was broken, also it was on a stage 1 map so needed re-mapping for mine. My ECU guru sorted that for me as normal (defo use him when you get yours done...he's very good at the mapping/tuning side) I think there's a bit of soldering needed inside the ECU and then the 2 APC wires just need adapting to fit the apc connector on the car as the T7 is 2 wires and the T5 has 3. Stage 1 is a decent jump in power/torque form standard and well worth it (takes it from 150 to 220 bhp iirc?? So basically from CSE to Aero power for a few quid!!!) but I'd leave stage 2 and go straight to 3 mate tbh. Not much difference in 1 & 2....but 1 to 3 is a decent hike with a good 3" DP. If/when you do remap just get the T7 mod done same time...I should have done this years ago
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Aug 26, 2011 23:32:35 GMT
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Thanks for the info this car was a stage 1, now back to standard for insurance. I'm sure it won't be too long before the stage 1 ECU goes back on. I'm not sure but I think it already has a 3" downpipe, it used to have a performance system, and according to my dad it has an uprated IC of some kind as well. Maybe. So hopefully a lot of the hard work has already been done.
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Project Diary1975 Viva / 1988 T25 Camper / 1989 Mini / 1991 MX5 / 1992 Mini / 1994 Saab 9000 / 1997 Saab 9000 / 2008 Saab 9-5
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I'm the same money wise mate....nightmare But it will be good to know what's already on there, biggest expense before fitting larger turbos, uprated clutches etc is the 3"DP. If that's already fitted you just need a cheeky remap and there's stage 3! I ran with a standard cat back system for a good 6 months even at stage 4, the essential bit is the downpipe...rest is just noise I forgot to ask is yours a T25 or TD04 turbo? Best ask your father as a lot of guys have swapped the turbos to a TD04 as it's a simple upgrade to more power. T25 maxes out around 270 iirc and TD04-15g around 310/315. What's good here though is if your Intercoolers been uprated (another expensive bit...unless you do the Chinese thing ) and you've got the downpipe, you only need a few more bits and your at stage 4!! Injectors- I found it ran much nicer on Green Giants but they max out around 350bhp so I needed Siemmens Deka 630's instead (blacks), mines got a terrible lumpy idle since fitting the 630's but could also be the cams? Cold starts are a right PITA Fuel pump- Walbro 255 or similar (there's a cheaper version on eBay some guys are using which is just as good) 3 Bar map sensor- I'm 99% sure the GM one will work so you'll save a few quid there but best check which you need. Remap- really cheap these days...you can DIY...if you can work out T5 Suite!! And there's Stage 4!! Just need a spare gearbox or two!!! I killed 2 within 9/10 months! but the 3rd is a lot happier with the bigger turbo!
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Aug 27, 2011 12:00:48 GMT
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It's a standard T25, and not sure what the intercooler is, but I expect it's a cheap copy, as long as it works though. Unless the aero IC is an upgrade over the CSE IC? In which case it could be that. The gearbox issue will worry me a bit, only because my girlfriend will also be using it and advice can go in one ear and out the other ;D I just hope it lasts.
I really can't wait to get it on the road and driving. The only downside is my Viva felt painfully slow after getting used to a misfiring 1.2 16v Corsa. The standard 150bhp the 2.0t has is probably 3x the horses the Viva has left and is going to make it feel like it's going backwards when I put my foot down.
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Project Diary1975 Viva / 1988 T25 Camper / 1989 Mini / 1991 MX5 / 1992 Mini / 1994 Saab 9000 / 1997 Saab 9000 / 2008 Saab 9-5
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