sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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May 26, 2014 10:54:20 GMT
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I'm in the process of fitting a Scimitar 4HA live axle into the back of my Rover P6 replacing the original independent DeDion suspension. I'm now looking at where I can get a suitable donor propshaft from that will require minimal hassle to fit and be upto the job for a possible 300-400bhp power target. I'm no stranger to two-piece props as on my other Rover P6 I used one from a Rover P5, but the centre bearing mounting is too big and softly mounted for this application. I've had a quick look on Ebay and LDV Pilot's appear to have something suitable with a separate articulating section to the main fixed length and the correct 4 bolt flange with an easily mountable bearing. Are there any others out there that I should look at that would share the standard British 4 bolt prop flange and have a separate rear section that can be quickly substituted for a custom one of the required length?
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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May 24, 2014 21:54:40 GMT
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I've got the driveshafts off the axle, very difficult as I can't shift the hubs off the shafts yet. I cut the bearing off one to get it in my 12 ton pipe bender, ended up bending the frame! With the brake backplates out of the way I could look at the mounting of the axle better, and compare it to the standard DeDion mounting points. Taking some rough measurements using the Scimitar lower suspension arm mount holes the axle would sit about 1.5inches lower, so would push the back of the car up. Factoring in the driveline not being body mounted I estimate a potential rise of 2" in ride height at the rear. So far on the axle mounts the lower bracket has been widened by cutting the inner face off and welded back on further in to retain the existing holes, and the upper mounts have been extended upwards. They still need drilling, and I also want to have the axle case grit blasted then the suspension mounts can be boxed in and some extra reinforcing plates welded on top to finish. The axle ready for trial fitting The new axle mounts The axle temporarily bolted in place except for the upper mounts at full suspension drop
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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My first thought was for a T or M16 and maybe LT77 box to keep it in the family. Then I thought about a blown red block or T5 Volvo lump with 960 box? Then there's the Saab options. My reasoning being that the 4/5 pot engines being lighter would handle better All that said I'd rather like to see a tweaked OM606 MB diesel in one knocking out 300+ bhp and clouds of black smoke to really p1ss off the flat cap brigade! OM602/OM605 is similar in length to the Rover V8 and often comes with a manual box on the back, fairly easy to make fully mechanical, and has the potential to be epically powerful Downsides are weight and front bowl sump if that's of any concern
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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May 21, 2014 21:19:11 GMT
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Jensen Interceptors use a 4HA axle with a 5x5" PCD. Personally, I'd have gone for a narrowed SD1 axle, which has a pretty neat Watts linkage built into the diff cover. As for the engine, I'd go supercharger every time, if only for the whine.... Keep up the good work, I do like a P6 I spent some time umming and erring over what axle I wanted to use, obviously there is no single perfect axle, so the end choice would always be a compromise. Jensen axles I'd assume are pretty thin on the ground, and would be likely to be expensive as and when they pop up. The SD1 axle is an obvious choice being off the next Rover model and also the correct pcd, but it is completely unsuitable for what I have in mind. It has a long pinion extension which is incompatible with my plan to retain as much of the stock P6 suspension as possible. The hubs and driveshafts I believe are one piece units which again would be more time and expense to shorten. My shortlist was down to MGB or Scimitar depending on availability, and being that a mate was after some Scimitar parts and it seemed like the best compromise at the time, that was it! The Scimitar Watts linkage is easily adaptable, or I'll end up copying it and making my own completely from scratch. I have been considering having the single central mount attached to the bodyshell and the two arms reaching out towards the hub ends? Now I've got the axle, it appears it only requires simple modifications to the suspension mounts, and modifying the hubs for the different pcd to get it fitted to take the weight The more I look at the supercharger the more I want to use it, though what is also on my mind is ditching the Rover V8 entirely and searching for a Ford or Chevy small block to use in the future...
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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May 21, 2014 11:55:43 GMT
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Apparently the Rover T16 can be bolted to the MGB gearbox, but I doubt the gearbox would be man enough to cope and I think there are clearance issues with the oil filter. It's been done with a Sherpa gearbox, keeping most of it British Leyland/Rover too.
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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May 20, 2014 21:55:18 GMT
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With a burst of enthusiasm I've removed the DeDion back axle from the P6 and rolled the Scimitar axle in underneath Plenty of room between the axle case and the boot cavity to mount the Watts linkage The top links line up with the outer face of the upper arm mounting on the Scimitar axle, couldn't have asked for it to sit any closer and better if I wanted! The lower arms are the same, the outer face of the axle lower arm bracket lines up as near as perfect as could be possible too! What I'm thinking is moving the inner faces of the upper and lower mounting brackets to suit the P6 suspension arm bush widths. Using the existing axle suspension mounting holes I plan to use them as the datum points to overlay new plates to locate the axle in the correct orientation. Measuring the P6 axle once removed it appears to have shrunk again to near 55.75" max width against the Scimitar axle at 56.5" wide. Now the Scimitar axle is in the workshop I'm in a better position to strip the hubs down to measure them up, and get on the the adaptation work I need to do to fit the 5x5" pcd wheels.
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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May 19, 2014 21:23:07 GMT
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I pulled the rear cover off the diff to see what I've got, and for an old axle it appears quite clean inside and still full of axle juice! Looking at the Watts linkage off the Scimitar, it looks like a nice neat and narrow unit that will fit in the space which is presently occupied by the DeDion tube. I think a frame could hang off the old differential mounts at the top, then braced against the chassis rails and lower boot floor would be sufficient. With a little help I've re-measured the Scimitar axle width and the P6 axle width. The Scimitar is about 56.5" hub face to face, and the P6 approx. 56.25" hub face to face. Those measurements are suspiciously close so I need to check again, but if they are anywhere near that close then obviously there's no need for narrowing the axle, just adapting the different pcd's which I'm beginning to formulate a possible plan for...
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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May 19, 2014 11:56:15 GMT
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I had a trip with a mate to my local scrappy Smiths of Bloxham, and we gutted the suspension off an old Scimitar. My mate wanted the front hubs and I had the back axle for the P6. The Salisbury 4A is a heavy old beast, has the Watts linkage I wanted, and the brakes and handbrake look to only require minor work to make good again and join into the P6. It's 57" wide face to face, and I think the optimum P6 width is somewhere around 51"-52", so I've begun researching narrowing, and what ways I can convert the 4x4.5" pcd to 5x5" to suit my wheels and keep a relatively stock appearance. I'm sure there are better more suitable axles nearer the width I want, but the Scimitar has the suspension mounts I can use as datum points to make the P6 suspension arms fit. I'm now in the process of stripping it down to assess it's condition, and see what work is required to bring it up to standard
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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Ignition questionsowen
@sowen
Club Retro Rides Member 24
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May 16, 2014 11:44:43 GMT
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Is there any 'free' play in the advance mechanism, before the vacuum and centrifugal weights give resistance?
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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Ignition questionsowen
@sowen
Club Retro Rides Member 24
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May 15, 2014 21:24:16 GMT
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Sloppy cam chain letting the dizzy wander? Worn distributor shaft? Loose vacuum advance?
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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May 13, 2014 17:09:25 GMT
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I remember seeing that one, the supercharger is sunk very low into a custom baffled inlet manifold which is entirely possible with the lack of distributer on the front of the V8. I have enough spares that I could do something similar, will have to start messing about trying some odd spares again With a diesel being more thermally efficient that a petrol, will the Disco rad be up to the job of cooling a breathed upon V8? There's only one way to find out and that's to try it! The core is significantly deeper, similar height but not quite as wide. I've justified buying it as I have other vehicles it would fit if it proves to be inadequately too small. Great to see the progress/ideas developing & some of the earlier/alternative ideas from your other P6 being renewed. The blue P6 evolved in a certain way, it had to be more of a driven car rather than a special occasion toy which meant I had to refrain from going all out on it. This time it's just another project/toy, so anything goes (within reason!) I'm now thinking, what would I have to do to a Rover V8 to get it to handle respectable boost levels, and how budget/diy could it be?
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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May 13, 2014 11:48:37 GMT
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What a cool sleeper this will be Have you looked into usng TVR manifolds to mount the Turbo infront of the engine? That's not a bad shout, for ease of installation and to get it running in one form or another it needs the radiator up front so no room there at this moment in time. I did look into mounting it at the back behind the engine, but routing the exhaust looked a bit too complex, although if it ends up evolving mounting the radiator elsewhere could always be an option
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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May 12, 2014 22:12:02 GMT
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You're saying supercharger or turbocharger... Why not both? I think the old V8 will struggle with just the one, running both really wouldn't last long but then I wouldn't know for sure if I didn't try
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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May 12, 2014 21:43:13 GMT
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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May 12, 2014 19:56:21 GMT
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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May 11, 2014 21:10:26 GMT
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Last Edit: Aug 19, 2014 15:57:06 GMT by sowen
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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May 10, 2014 21:40:46 GMT
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I don't live anywhere near there. He lives there. The police already have interviewed me about it all and I've met all the neighbours and discussed it. And the council! I can't touch his car! Just wondering what others think I read that as you'd vandalise the supposed culprits car if the opportunity came along? To be honest, you've done wrong by confronting the other guy, leave it and move on before you do something else stupid and end up serving time. Did you report the incident to the police first?
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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Youtube/video forum?sowen
@sowen
Club Retro Rides Member 24
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May 10, 2014 14:50:59 GMT
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A brief description in the thread title, or do as some of the photographers do with putting "[pics]" in the title indicating whats on the inside, different categories as Grumpy says
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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Youtube/video forum?sowen
@sowen
Club Retro Rides Member 24
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May 10, 2014 14:24:18 GMT
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Could be a good idea, let us discuss the video's and post up similar ones under the same thread, and not have to scroll through just video links. My internet connection is rubbish and hates loading up multiple Youtube clicky linkies so I rarely click into the Youtube thread.
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sowen
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,245
Club RR Member Number: 24
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Cheers for that, completely lost track of what was where and when! Will add some of those to the diary and see when I'm available
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