past rover concept car fuel experiment

You'd be better off putting a modern twist on the old rover gas turbine idea, the current "new" idea is to use a gas turbine to power a generator (like some big ships) this kinda makes sense as turbines are only economical over a small rev range and very uneconomical every where else, if hooked up to a genni the turbine can be kept at the most Eco revs and the power (elec) can be used to power in-wheel motors, small turbines are very light (5kg) and very reliable due to only having one moving part.

You could set the drive train out with 4 elec motors (1 per wheel) and have three drive settings, front wheel drive for normal, rear wheel drive for sport and 4 wheel drive for snow and rain.

Ford built a focus powered turbine/elec concept last year but I've been thinking about the above drive train layout for a couple of years now, the unused motors in 2wd setting could be used as genni's for extra power and all motors could be used as brakes therefore saving weight.

Your welcome too use this idea, I'll do nowt with it.

I remember reading about a concept which used a flywheel spun up to some insane rpm as a stored energy device. It wasn't that long ago really, 90's perhaps. Having seen the damage exploding engine flywheels can do when they let go at 8-9000rpm, I'd hate to imagine what would happen if those big ones let go at much higher speeds...

Just like this:

www.parkers.co.uk/News/Paris-Motor-Show-2010/Paris-Motor-Show-2010-Jaguar/

www.carmagazine.co.uk/News/Search-Results/First-Official-Pictures/Jaguar-C-X75-concept-car-2010-first-official-pictures/

that jag's lovely!!! That's the idea, my idea was the switchable drivetrain, because the wheels are nolonger connected by drive shafts and diffs you can do what you want, like an Eco/cruse mode which just used one motor and hence one wheel drive, sounds odd but most cars with an open diff are one wheel drive most of the time with power only going to both wheels when grip is equal.
You could also incorporate the motors into a stability control system, powering up or powering down individual motors to affect the attitude of the car, inducing toque steer to help the car corner and adjusting the power output of each motor to help it remain stable under heavy braking or high load situations.

porsche has built and raced a gt3 rsr hybrid that uses a flywheel like you described above, spins at somthing like 40,000 rpm and is mounted where the pasenger seat used to be!!

I'll try and find a pic

This may also be of interest to you

www.theengineer.co.uk/news/engineers-showcase-prototype-flywheel-hybrid-for-jaguar-xf/1004910.article

The Jag Green Limo project is also interesting, uses a lotus 3 cylinder motor for range extension duties. It is widely belived that this will then be replaced with micro-turbines as in the CX-75 concept. Its rumored there's already a mule vehicle about testing it out.

For me range extension is the likely route in the next 5-10 years, as it allows for some "zero" emission running (i.e. at tailpipe) whilst also meaning the you can still us your personal transport, as personal transport should you want to drive more than 100miles.

Hydrogen is a beautiful idea, fill the desserts with solar panels and the seas with wind/wave turbines and then make hydrogen. But if it ever happens its over 10 years away. By the time we get there Methane Hydrates might well have taken over as the new idea. Look them up, there are a few people in the fuels industy that think these are the future for 20-30 years if they can get them out of the seas without releasing methane gas and causing global warming that we'll actually believe in. They are still a fossil fuel, think of it like the next oil if things go the way some people plan.

Essencially the methane hydrate can be turned to methan gas, and burned, or it can be broken into component parts for Hydrogen. Either way it has a lot of nice possibilities either for use in fuel cell or micro turbine cars.

If I were you I'd do a nice background study of the fuel of the future (electric 1 year-> forever?, hydrogen 15years->forever, oil based 1->25years, Methan hydrates 10->50years) , and then from that choose a powerplant.

Whichever route you think will happen you're likely to have electric motors for drive. This offer advantages with styling (this was highlighted by Jag's Ian Cullam with the CX-75), so very different ideas of what a car is can be thought out, so its worth using it to think outside the box.

With electric drive, you'll need a battery of some sort. In an Alvis you need range, if it is to follow the old brand then it'll be a car for gentelmen, luxury sport, like a british Masarati. So it'll need either a huge battery (not great, due to cost and weight) or range extension - there is a reason Jag (a would-be competitor) are looking big time into this A Flybrid system with this might work, but since you already have electric motors and battery, it makes no sense - so electric brake energy recovery would be a better idea.

As weight will be an issue too have a look at this idea that Volvo are working on - www.autocar.co.uk/News/NewsArticle/AllCars/253010/ lightweight panels that work as batteries, very neat solution

Finally don't forget all this nanny state stuff that's going on, is "Auto-pilot" coming? Cars that drive themselves and all that jazz, its not as unlikely as you might think........

Can you tell I'd rather be doing your project than my job?! Much more interesting, have fun with it ;D

solution - pay someone a fiver and give them a foot pump

This is very true, but there is the element of practicality to consider. With hydrogen you can just fill up like a current car. Easy to transport, national grids don't need major overhauls. The fuel cell can last a lifetime, batteries only a few years. Plus the stuff needed to make a worlds supply of good enough batteries means the cost of the minerals will rocket even more, making them very expensive - and then there's where all those minerals are, and who "owns" them..... whereas all you need for hydrogen is water and electricity - so each country can go about it's own way of getting the fuel, without having to go to someone elses country to get the stuff they need - this hasn't gone too well since Otto made his 1st IC engine!

You can counter most of those things with battery packs used like you do in a remote control car of course. So you pay a yearly rent, plus top up charge (like gas bottles from BOC) Drive into the refill station, over a little automatic machine. Insert a card, press a button and the machine removes your old pack and pops in a new one in seconds. And you carry on like you would in a petrol car.

This is the way I'd love to see it done, but there are big issues in getting people to agree on universal things, god they can't even decide on a universal charge socket for the current crop of electric cars. Germans want one, the US another, China yet another......where as hydrogen is hydrogen, fuel cells and cars can be totally different, but you only need one type of fueling station.