khaOs
Part of things
Posts: 115
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I always wanted to build a cage for my 86 Kadett and now i really need one for my 77 Opel City so i decided it's time to try and build it.
Now i have a few doubts with taking measurements so i can tell the place that makes the bends. What measurements should i take? And any other pointers on building the cage would be nice too. Thanks!
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Jan 28, 2010 11:27:59 GMT
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How much work and research have you got so far? Have a think about how many points you want, how you want it to fit, and have a good look at other cars. Its taken me a while with mine, and I started modifying an existing cage. Could be challenging starting from nothing...  |
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 it doesn't matter if it's a Morris Marina or a Toyota Celica - it's what you do with it that counts  |
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Jan 28, 2010 11:34:24 GMT
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Make sure that you know what the cage is for. Even if it's just for road use, it makes sense to build it to comply with racing regulations for a category which the car may be eligible for or likely to be used in, like tarmac rallying or circuit racing. If you're not going to make a race-legal cage then I wouldn't bother, as it will detract from the car's value rather than add to it.
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khaOs
Part of things
Posts: 115
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Jan 28, 2010 11:38:27 GMT
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i've seen lots of builds of rollcages and i was thinking 6 points with door bars would do the trick for the Opel City. Cages are pretty expensive here so i would rather build one.
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khaOs
Part of things
Posts: 115
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Jan 28, 2010 11:51:44 GMT
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Make sure that you know what the cage is for. Even if it's just for road use, it makes sense to build it to comply with racing regulations for a category which the car may be eligible for or likely to be used in, like tarmac rallying or circuit racing. If you're not going to make a race-legal cage then I wouldn't bother, as it will detract from the car's value rather than add to it. Seeing i'll probably will run a few track and drift days what do you recomment in terms of regulations? i can't find any here in Portugal although i know FPAK has. |
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Jan 28, 2010 13:20:37 GMT
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How good are you at welding and fabrication? You could try build a rough version out of old exhaust tubes etc, make bends or something, or accurately size up a pre caged car, or size up available indoor space in your car, work out a design and make it smaller than the inside.
The main hoop would be your starting point I expect, then tubes holding that up against the rear wheel inner wing, two bends going from hoop to dash-floor A pillar, then windscreen joins. if you measure plenty and are good at weld (TIG ideally) and fabrication and use decent materials the it should be easy to build-as-you-go.
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it doesn't matter if it's a Morris Marina or a Toyota Celica - it's what you do with it that counts |
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Jan 28, 2010 13:43:39 GMT
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I think first off you need to work out exactly what events you'll be doing, conrtact the organisers for a rule book, it can make a lot of difference as to what cage you'll need to build (if your allowed to build your own) and even what tube you can make it out of.
If its just for non official events where cages are not mandatory i'd think carefully about having a cage at all, they can do more harm than good if your not using proper harnesses and a helmet.
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Volvo back as my main squeeze, more boost and some interior goodies on the way.
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Jan 28, 2010 13:49:05 GMT
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Search for MSA Blue Book, it's a downloadable PDF, has rules etc regarding tube type, size, bends, all that good stuff.
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'66 Amazon <-> '94 LS400 <-> '86 Suzuki 1135 EFE
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Dez
Club Retro Rides Member
And I won't sit down. And I won't shut up. And most of all I will not grow up.
Posts: 11,714
Club RR Member Number: 34
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Help building a cageDez
@dez
Club Retro Rides Member 34
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Jan 28, 2010 14:11:50 GMT
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from memory most regs require 1.5"(38mm) 3mm wall CDS.
theres also regs regarding the size/location of the box feet, usually need to be 4" square minimum.
as said above, try to get regs for whatever body you want to race with.
id say build a 4-point rear cage with diagonals first, then if it goes well add the front half to make it a 6-er. the front section is much harder to do and make look good/fit right than the rear.
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khaOs
Part of things
Posts: 115
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Jan 28, 2010 19:33:04 GMT
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I was going to try and make some drift events but there's nothing set in Portugal yet and from what i know our drif championship is beeing made with the help of BDC wich probably means that regulations will be the same. I'll try to get the MSA Blue Book because i've seen a few people in oficial events of rallycross and rally with badly made rollcages and even some made with exhaust pipe. The only thing i know is that it has to be minimum 38mm and have to be extruded tubing. Anyway i'll probably try to make a 4 point rear cage first like dez said.
Thanks for the help everyone.
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Jan 28, 2010 23:19:53 GMT
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1989 Peugeot 205. You know, the one that was parked in a ditch on the campsite at RRG'17... the glass is always full. but the ratio of air to water may vary. |
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khaOs
Part of things
Posts: 115
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Jan 29, 2010 11:08:52 GMT
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robg2
Part of things
Posts: 815
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Jan 30, 2010 10:17:43 GMT
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Before you start, what's an Opel City?
If it's a Kadett or something then you might be better off buying an off the shelf cage if there is one available. I know that means you won't get the challenge of making your own, but it will probably end up comparable on cost grounds. In particular you might need to get yours certified if you wanted to compete in bona fide motorsport, and the cost of getting it examined and a certificate issued is normally high (three figures in £s).
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Jan 30, 2010 14:44:50 GMT
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The mother of all cage design and construction threads can be found here: www.corner-carvers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27556A bit yank-centric but easily the most informative cage construction thread I've ever seen. And some serious cage-porn in there as well |
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Jan 30, 2010 22:03:30 GMT
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I looked into this a while ago. Seems the biggest problem is bending the pipework!
Its all very well welding everything up but a pipe with a bend in it is stronger than 2 pipes welded together at an angle.
The secret seemed to be to build it with more bent pipes than welded ones.
There is also the danger of making your home cage too heavy! Easy to get carried away. If your car needs a cage you are not going to want it to be any heavier than it has to be.
What about getting a cage for a similar sized car and modifying it to suit rather than start from scratch?
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tomm
Part of things
Posts: 106
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Jan 30, 2010 22:16:56 GMT
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Give Fabricage a call, they offer very very good cages at a very good price and atleast you know what you will have made for you will be only the best!
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Last Edit: Jan 30, 2010 22:30:58 GMT by tomm
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khaOs
Part of things
Posts: 115
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What about getting a cage for a similar sized car and modifying it to suit rather than start from scratch? That would probably be a good solution but since i really want to learn how to make them i guess starting with this one or the next one would pretty much be the same. i know it's a risk but i guess i'll take it. |
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gn3dr
Part of things
Posts: 391
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Firstly have a read of this tube bending guide www.pirate4x4.com/tech/bendin_tube/Are you planning on getting a tube bender? Get the proper rotary draw type - don't buy one of those machine mart pipe benders. I build my own from a set of plans bought for about $20from Got Trikes in the U.S. The bending dies however are where the expense are - I had to ship 2 Pro-Tools dies to Ireland form the U.S $$$$$  . I since discovered however that dies are available here www.stakesys.co.uk/Then if you are really serious you should checkout Bend Tech tube bending software - it's not expensive and is invaluable for designing roll cages. Have a read of theofn.com or pirate4x4.com forums - U.S. based offroad but some cars stuff and lots of great tech stuff on there. |
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khaOs
Part of things
Posts: 115
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gn3dr thanks for the advice! any pics of your bender?
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gn3dr
Part of things
Posts: 391
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Hi I've no pics to hand and am travelling for work atm so no access to them but it's the same as this one (except I didn't paint mine yet) www.gottrikes.com/Tube_Bender.htm |
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