Potter
Part of things
'E who dares wins,eh Rodders??!
Posts: 304
|
|
|
Fellas, I'm going to need to build me a car trailer soon to tow the Escort to the drags and back,but I'm not too sure how to go about it. I have Degrees in Average Fabbing and Average Arc Welding so building it should be quite easy if I take my time. However I'm not too sure what sort of style to go for.
Firstly I want it to be able to carry most cars,so none of that shorty-car-overhanging-trailer type business. It has to be reasonably high off the ground and no wider than the Land Rover as the garage where I keep the Escort has a very steep,narrow ramp.Has to have some sort of suspension as well and I absolutely must be able to un/load it without unhitching it from the tow car .
I was thinking about using a car axle complete with leaf springs and making a beavertail style deck at the back so I can use short ramps and still get relatively low cars onto it. I know of either a Transit Mk1 rear axle or the English out of a Mk2 Cortina for sale.Would they be any use?
Any suggestions/drawings/pics/do-don'ts/links very welcome as I'm rather at a loss.
Cheers
Tom
|
|
More cars than sense or money!🙄
|
|
|
|
|
|
I'm on my second transporter now, so I'm no expert but I learnt some stuff...
1: a good jockey wheel is essential. ESSENTIAL. make this, and the bolting of it onto the frame, one of the highest priorities.
2: A sold base trailer will be very heavy. A trailer with bars across (like they way ramps are) is much lighter. however the full base can carry narrow cars, like vintage ones, which is biggest problem i have now with mine.
3: A twin axle is much better and more stable for carrying big cars, anything over a ton really. under that a single will do well. get good tyres for it, rated for the load they'll be under.
4: Use fold-up ramps. stow-away ones will annoy you'r head.
5: make everything that can be moved on the trailer (like lock-pins for the ramps) connected to the unit. You don't want to drop one of them in the rain at 1am with a flat tyre.
6: Spend a lot of time balancing the trailer. Either nose-heavy or tail-heavy will pose serious problems. Easier to do with a twin-axle.
7: Mudguards are essential by law, make provision and budget for them. Fixed lights on them are better than a lightboard, and also make provision for a licence plate. a square one on the underside of a folding ramp is perfect.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I have been out of the industry for several years now, so have forgotten most of the dates and numbers but the points are still relevant. First is a legal problem. It is generaly illegal to build a new trailer using a car or van axle. This is because since the mid 90`s iirc, all new build braked trailers have to have brakes that meet a minimum efficiency standard. The drum brakes from the back of a car or van do not come close. The most common "workaround" for this problem is if ever asked....you didnt just build the trailer, infact you have had it for years and it was already second hand when you bought it. Trailers built before the introduction of this rule do not need to comply to the newer standard. Secondly, the brakes themselves - you couple up the handbrake cable to the hitch over-run unit and voila (or plumb in the wheel cylinders to a hydraulic over-run unit - whatever you fancy) so when you are driving along and brake, the hitch compresses, pulls the handbrake cable which pulls on the trailer brakes. All fine and rosy. Except when you try to reverse the trailer, the hitch still compresses and pulls on the trailer brakes, making revesing impossible. Most trailers and caravans since the 80`s have auto-reverse brakes, which slip when the trailer is backed up. There is no reasonable way to retrofit auto-reverse shoes to a normal axle backplate. Older trailers have a wee latch on the hitch which you get out and flip into place to prevent the hitch compessing while reversing. By law, this has to automatically disengage when you move forwards again. This makes a tight turning maneuver a pain in the chuff as every time you go into reverse, you have to get out and flip the latch back into place. Not so handy when you are on your own, its peeing down and you are tryng to do a 17-point turn in a narrow road. Most of these latches mysteriously loose their return springs so they stay locked in place till manually disengaged. If stopped at a VOSA inspection, they wont like that, but its not a hanging offence. IMO find a dead caravan with an ALKO galvanised chassis and ALKO axle. Single or twin axle, whatever you prefer. (double axle is by far the best imo - more stable and much, much safer in the event of a tyre blowout. The downside is its longer and heavier) Hunting around a bit will turn up a leaky, rotten old caravan from the 90`s which will make an ideal base. Hack the body off and scrap it - thats the hard part - finding somewhere to take the body. most scrappies don't like taking them. Burning it would be naughty. Sell the interior furniture and appliances to someone doing a camper conversion or building a horse van. This leaves you with a very simple, lightweght chassis, and axle with auto-reverse brakes and it also provides you with all the other usefull stuff you would have to buy otherwise...hitch unit, brake rods and cables, wheels n tyres, and a jockey wheel. Thing is....caravans are quite narrow between the wheels - too narrow to fit most cars, so you will either need to build the bed up higher so the wheels sit under, or cut the axles in the middle and extend them with steel tubing. - this is perfectly feasable. Knock up a frame from box secton and parts of the original ALKO chassis and make a bed from heavy steel mesh. This is lighter and stronger then ply, and much lighter than solid steel. It allows you to fit allsorts on the trailer, as opposed to just a pair of ramps as SurprisingSkoda metioned above, which are fine for your own car but useless the day you want to shift something else ith a different width. It also allows the trailer to shift furniture, boxes blah blah blah... Think carefully about the loading ramps, their contruction and how they will stow. Having them hinged as SS talks about is a great idea, but make some provision for them to be able to slide along to accomodate wider or narrower track widths. Fix the lights solidly. trailerboards hanging on the back are a faff and never last long. Make up brackets so they are slightly recessed and protected from knocks. Fit triangular rear reflectors and front position marker lights. Make sure it has a breakaway cable. Try to build it so nothing rattles - ie everything is fixed down tightly. Nothing worse than leaving for an early morning start and your empty trailer bouncing and rattling behind you loud enough to wake the whole street. A beavertail design is good, but can cause problems with very low (or damaged suspension) cars grounding as they are loaded. With a flat deck, you can always mess about with winding the front right up with the jockey wheel to give a slope to get a low/damaged car on.
|
|
Last Edit: Jun 5, 2009 7:18:45 GMT by dave21478
1986 Panda 4x4. 1990 Metro Sport. 1999 Ford Escort estate.
|
|
|
|
|
He's in Malta i think so i dunno what regs apply, personally i think its gonna be very difficult to determine the age of a home built trailer, was it built 20 years ago, or yesterday?
|
|
Volvo back as my main squeeze, more boost and some interior goodies on the way.
|
|
|
|
|
yeah, I just clocked his location now, so no idea if those regs apply or not.
Thats what most folk in the UK do if they build a traler with car axles - just say its an old trailer and nobody can proove otherwise.
|
|
1986 Panda 4x4. 1990 Metro Sport. 1999 Ford Escort estate.
|
|
|
|
|
The new IVA has a section coming in for new trailers.. but not sure how/if it will effect old ones. Sorry for the thread jack but whats the law on towing these days.. do you need an additional bit on your licence?
|
|
Daily: Spazda Mx5
'A52's Fastest steak eater 2010'
|
|
|
|
|
Hi Tom, a few years ago i built a trailer for a mate of mine and after buying all the proper trailer bits, buying the metal, getting it galvanised etc etc it would have been better to just go out and buy a decent second hand one. ....after nearly twenty years of dragging old tat around half of Europe there are one or two things you should be aware of. I´m not sure how the regulations are in your country and i´m sure you´ve got that covered but don´t build a trailer for your Escort with one axle. By the time you´ve finished welding it up it´ll weigh somewhere between 400 & 500 kgs, lets say for arguments sake your Escort weighs 700 kgs - that´s 1200kgs and too much for one axle only. Based on past experience i´d advise you against getting a caravan frame too, as already said you´d have to build the plattform over the wheels as they are not wide enough and those type of trailers are a pain to load and very "top heavy" Some people get around that by having small diameter wheels but they are very expensive and normally not available at your local tyre fitters- well not over here anyway! Talking of tyres try and fit normal car/van tyres but get a decent load rating with room to spare and don´t buy plastic mudguards as if you do have a blow out the plastic ones will just get ripped to pieces, a metal one can be bent back into shape. As you mentioned low cars you could make a tipper like mine. The construction is a bit more complicated but you´ve got no hassle with ramps and getting lowered cars onto them is a doddle. Mine used to have a numberplate bracket on the back and when loading the front spoilers or sumps always used to catch so i modified the frame and chopped it out and moved the numberplate so that i´ve got plenty of clearance now. Before: After: Good luck with the build ;D
|
|
|
|
filmidget
East Midlands
Mostly Lurking
Posts: 1,652
|
|
|
As there seems to be some trailer expertise, I have a question if I may (might also be useful to the OP): I bought my little trailer from a local Scout group - it was made for them, professionally I believe, to raffle cars off around local shows/fetes/etc. As you can see it has a very long wheelbase... perhaps unusually long? I have found it to be extremely stable, and have never had a waggle from it even with some very optimistic load/tow car combinations. The obvious disadvantage is the trailer really punishing it's tyres making tight turns, but are there any others? 'Cos the stability gains (and less sensitivity to nose weight) seem to far outweigh a bit of tyre scrubbing IMO, yet most trailers and caravans seem to have their axles as close as possible... why is that? Edit for spelling, and to point out that the pictured towing combination is just for illustration purposed and I hadn't just been to collect the Scirocco from West London. And that that tyre has been replaced.
|
|
Last Edit: Jun 5, 2009 11:37:09 GMT by filmidget
'79 MG Midget 1500 - Still patiently awaiting attention '02 Vauxhall Astra 1.8 Elegance(!) - Better than you might think '03 Mazda MX5 - All new and shiny looking (thanks to Antony at Rust Republic) '09 Renault Clio - Needs to go.
|
|
|
|
|
Your trailer looks like it would be really stable with such a long wheelbase, less chance of "see-sawing" as theres much less overhang on the back.
I guess the wheels on twin/triple axle trailers are close together to try and minimise tyre scrubbing, although a certain amount is always going to be enevitable. I can "screw" my twin axle car transporter round in a "jack knife" fairly easily, but the tyres really don't like it. I would imagine on your trailer theres a real risk of dragging a tyre off a rim and causing a blow out. It helps if the tyres are blown up nice and hard.
Tyre scrubbing isnt really a problem, most truck trailers have to do it when manouvering in tight places. Besides, car transporter tyres usually get punctured or kerbed to death before they have chance to wear out!
|
|
1987 Maestro 1.6 HL perkins diesel conversion 1986 Audi 100 Avant 1800cc on LPG 1979 Allegro Series 2 special 4 door 1500cc with vynil roof. IN BITS. HERITAGE ISSUES.
|
|
|
|
|
Its a scrub issue. As said above, the longer the wheelbase, the more risk of pushing a tyre bead off the rim whilst turning sharply. Most others are close together to minimise tyre wear and to make them easier to maneuvre, both by car and by hand. I have a plant trailer with a slightly odd layout, and plan on someday cutting it up and making a transporter. If I do so, its likely to have a longer wheelbase like yours. Not something to worry about really, but just something to bear in mind when reversing it round a tight corner whilst loaded.
|
|
1986 Panda 4x4. 1990 Metro Sport. 1999 Ford Escort estate.
|
|
|
Potter
Part of things
'E who dares wins,eh Rodders??!
Posts: 304
|
|
|
Man I love this site!!!!
Never realized it's all so complicated!Thanks for the great responses guys. As far as I'm aware there don't seem to be any regs regarding trailers as long as it not obviously unsafe,but I'll ask around. Did think about making it a twin axle but I'm worried that it'll making tight maneuvering difficult,seeing as my garage has a narrow entrance ramp on a narrow road. Also how high is too high? I borrowed a mate's trailer recently and while towing it out of my chuffin basement garage it scraped a lot when empty. Let alone when loaded. Which is why I originally planned on putting the axle underneath the load bed. Something like OldBus's trailer is therefore outta the question as it would definitely scrape.
Again thanks a lot lads.I'll let you know how I get on.
|
|
More cars than sense or money!🙄
|
|
kenb
Part of things
Posts: 604
|
|
|
Re the trailer with long wheel base, many many years ago there used to be a construction and use reg which stated that if the two axles were more than 33" apart, you could legally tow at 70mph(if it had brakes). I too many years ago had a trailer built like this, and was hte best trailer i ever owned. The reg has, of course long since dissapeared.
As for new regs, as I understand it there are, as someone mentioned a whole new set of regs coming aimed at home build trailers. Quite how they will be or can be enforced is open to speculation. I do know the intention is braked trailers/caravans etc to be tested on a yearly basis(like Mot) by i think VOSA has stated 2018. I suspect this will be subject to the computer system working in the first place, and being able to enforce it!!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyone know what the deal is with towing a draw bar trailer like this behind a car, is it legal? (obviously on a smaller scale)
|
|
Volvo back as my main squeeze, more boost and some interior goodies on the way.
|
|
|
|
|
Don´t see why not, especially with a RR up front! ;D
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I was thinking that although it would be much harder to manouvre by hand it would be a nicer thing to tow as well as being usefull, set of ramps and its a car trailer, maybe even a demountable camper body is possible? I'm sure other ides would present themselves over time.
i dunno, just pondering really as i have room to park a big trailer but a purely car one seems like a wasted opportunity.
|
|
Volvo back as my main squeeze, more boost and some interior goodies on the way.
|
|
|
|
|
Yes, perfectly legal so long as its within the usual trailer size limts. Many exhibition trailers are built like that, and more and more burger vans are going to that style of chassis. They tow beautifully, but reversing takes a bit of getting used to as its nothing like reversing a conventional thing. Another benefit is they have vitually no nose-weight, so are great for cars with either a very low noseweignt limit, or cars that are lowered a lot.
|
|
1986 Panda 4x4. 1990 Metro Sport. 1999 Ford Escort estate.
|
|
filmidget
East Midlands
Mostly Lurking
Posts: 1,652
|
|
|
Please forgive my ingorance... forgot to say thanks for the advice on my semi-lwb trailer I have only managed to rip a tyre off once and that was 'cos I didn't pump it up when getting the (empty) trailer out of storage. If I were to build a trailer, I would certainly consider the scrubbing worth the extra stability. Though I like the idea of the draw bar style even more...
|
|
'79 MG Midget 1500 - Still patiently awaiting attention '02 Vauxhall Astra 1.8 Elegance(!) - Better than you might think '03 Mazda MX5 - All new and shiny looking (thanks to Antony at Rust Republic) '09 Renault Clio - Needs to go.
|
|
|
|
|
Yeah drawbar trailers look great. You don't see them much but I would imagine theyd be very stable, plus it would be easy to load one when not connected to the tow car. Pain in the to reverse though!
|
|
1987 Maestro 1.6 HL perkins diesel conversion 1986 Audi 100 Avant 1800cc on LPG 1979 Allegro Series 2 special 4 door 1500cc with vynil roof. IN BITS. HERITAGE ISSUES.
|
|
93fxdl
Posted a lot
Enter your message here...
Posts: 2,000
|
|
Jun 10, 2009 11:49:59 GMT
|
|
|
|
|
Potter
Part of things
'E who dares wins,eh Rodders??!
Posts: 304
|
|
Jun 11, 2009 21:22:20 GMT
|
Stuff of legends guys!! Thanks
|
|
More cars than sense or money!🙄
|
|
|