Greater London, running a retro will cost from August 2023

I live just outside the m25 and have heared many stories of how this is going to effect people. It's pretty much made going inside the m25 a no go zone for me. Until I get a 40+ year old car and put a stinky diesel in it apparently.

I can see this thread potentially being shut down, for being ranty, so I will add some clarity to this.

Not all retros (bar 40+ year old cars) will be banned. Some of the newer stuff will be allowed in, where the following is compliant:

Petrol: Euro 4 (NOx)
Diesel: Euro 6 (NOx and PM)

The NO limit for the above are the same (0.8), with diesels inherently producing more NOx than an equivalent petrol.

As a result, some Euro 2/3 petrols will be allowed in, as the NOx emissions still fall within the Euro 4 guidelines. The NOx threasholds for the above are roughly the same, since diesels inherently produce more NOx emissions compared to a petrol

As examples of my current and previous cars and friend's cars which are compliant

-E46 M3 is ULEZ compliant and is Euro 3
-Mondeo ST220 is also ULEZ compliant, despite this being a dirtier and 'older tech' engine than the E46 M3, also Euro 3
-Saab 9-3 1.8t is compliant, albeit that is a Euro 4 car
-Mate's E39 Alpina B10 is not compliant, despite being the same age as my M3, as most Alpinas did not have the emissions details in the logbook. However, with a Certificate of Conformity from Alpina, and then a V5 update, that is then compliant.
-Mondeo 2.5T with the Volvo 5 pot is also compliant

That said

-E91 325d is not compliant, being a Euro 4 diesel
-Dad's Mondeo TDCI is not, being a Euro 5 diesel, which isn't low enough on the NOx or PM.
-Mate's Clio V6 is not, since the NOx emissions just pip the 0.08 limit, which is allowed under Euro 3

A handful of Euro 5 diesels are compliant, but they are few and far between.

To be fair, several cities outside of the UK have these zones and have done for years. My mate bought my Mondeo 2.5T off me, partially for this reason. Stuttgart does not allow most diesels, along with Paris, and several other cities. Diesels are also taxed very heavily. My M3 would be around £120 to tax over there and I think the Mondeo 2.5T is that much. My E91 would be closer to £400, if not more.

I feel for some of the businesses, but to be fair, after getting a motorbike, there are cleaner and superior ways to travel in comparison to a car IMHO.

and you are entitled to your opinion , i just don't agree with it !

I only live a couple of miles outside the M25 so just checked my cars - VW T5 van, Mercedes C200, MGB - none are ULEZ compliant so £12.50 every time I drive one of those in the new extended zone.

The only car I own which is ULEZ compliant is this..... :-)

If I go to my parents in Ewell and then go to Surbiton to get the train to town it'll cost me 12.50 in my daily (dirty diesel Range Rover Evoque), but won't cost in the Porsche 996. So guess I'll be using that then. Or the Datsun.

Without derailing too much, frankly I think central London should essentially be pedestrianised. When I went to the office during Covid it was actually a pleasant place to be with almost no cars. The problem is that doesn't bring in the money to pay for the public transport requirements.

Any time I drive in London I think the same thing. I dropped a engine off somewhere near Shoreditch (I think, was near Fenchurch station I recognised the names from Monopoly lol). Setting off at 9.30am it took me 2 hours flat to do 150 miles to South Mimm's, then over 1.5 hours to do the other 17 miles to where I was going and same back. It's barely quicker than walking most of the time and certainly not quicker than cycling/mobility scooter etc. The air is crazy bad too, if I go into Leeds centre it doesn't stink of fumes, London was like doing a bong full of soot.

Who are the TFL? As my 79 falls into this. Cheers

Does this include Heathrow Airport? I am an arch poluter - I drive to Heathrow in a big American car then fly long haul for business...

Weirdly, I was in South Africa again 2 weeks back and they charge higher rates of tax for electric cars to discourage their purchase.... Petrol ones are just fine.

Yes it is, might be worth condidering one of the off site parking places outside heathrow.