v8ian
Posted a lot
Posts: 3,763
|
|
Aug 25, 2018 13:23:06 GMT
|
Heard of 2 more circuits having problems, The first is unfortunately confirmed its shutting its doors for 2019, is the newest big circuit in the country and its ROCKINGHAM, you won't find it on any 2019 programmes The other that is under threat is a short oval, Arlington, near Eastbourne, The Elderly owner passed recently and there is doubt as to his siblings wanting to continue running the circuit, WTF is going on with our motorsport.....
|
|
Atmo V8 Power . No slicks , No gas + No bits missing . Doing it in style. Austin A35van, very different------- but still doing it in style, going to be a funmoble
|
|
|
|
|
Aug 25, 2018 13:39:27 GMT
|
I think Rockingham tried to be too many things and just didn't attract big enough regular events and found that a difficult skill set to make cost effective. But generally with other tracks its simple economics, run a race venue which can operate a set number of times a year with insurance, running costs, environmental constraints or sell to developers for a big fat wedge which likely will be far more profitable even compared to running a race venue over a long period.
|
|
Needs a bigger hammer mate.......
|
|
|
|
Aug 25, 2018 15:09:10 GMT
|
Not Eastbourne, please. Theres too much love for that place.
|
|
|
|
kenb
Part of things
Posts: 604
|
|
Aug 25, 2018 16:27:31 GMT
|
Not entirely surprised at Rockingham. I can remember doing a photoshoot at Rocky just before it opened and thought to myself then these stands are going to take some filling. Without bums on seats its doomed.
Same for the oval world too really. Too many saloon formulas that all look alike, I cant tell some of them apart anyway. Now we've got so many other little formulas creeping in, there must be more drivers than spectators. The only tracks that will survive are those actually owned by the promotors rather than rented or leased. So I reckon in 15 years time, or possibly less the rate we're losing them currently, we'll only have about 3 maybe 4 proper stadiums left, plus loads of mud tracks in fields. We need to see formulas unite and stop splinter groups of the same thing. Plus it needs to attract new audiences you cannot keep relying on the old die hard spectators because they simply not there anymore. Sorry no I don't have the answers either unfortunately.
|
|
|
|
skinnylew
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 5,546
Club RR Member Number: 11
|
|
Aug 25, 2018 17:16:26 GMT
|
Motorsport is all in a bit of limbo as it is anyway. With the ending of petrol car production/sales in 2024 or thereabouts everything is going to be up in the air. Do people watch motorsport live for the racing itself or is it the 4 dimensional aspect of sight, smell, noise and taste (mmmm burnt rubber). The major downside of electric motorsport as i see it is that it loses the aspects that make a complete package, hence it's trying to attract a different crowd to the normal motorsport crowd. For me part of the appeal of watching it live is the noise of the engines, the feel in your chest as a V8 DTM car punches past you, the smell of the brakes/tyres/exhaust/fuel, this makes it a visceral experience. I just don't see that can happen with a glorified scalextric car......
|
|
|
|
|
|
Aug 25, 2018 18:21:35 GMT
|
From my point of view club racing has also contributed to the lack of interest in Motorsport now. Although really the root cause of that is the venues taking the gate money so the club's have little need/interest in attracting regular punters to events. Seeing photos of Paddock Hill bend from club meetings in the late 80's vs. now and it is a total ghost town.
|
|
|
|
steveg
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,565
|
|
Aug 25, 2018 18:42:59 GMT
|
Is Historic motor sport going to be the way forward ? It's growing in every form not just cars. There are lot's of race series for Historic karts now and that is just one example.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Aug 25, 2018 19:02:21 GMT
|
I'm not surprised about rockingham it was built for a race series that never really worked out It all comes down to one thing "money" Any motor racing venue will cover a large amount of real-estate and that equates to a lot of houses And if you believe all the politicians we need more houses ?
So if you owned a race track that wasn't making a massive profit each year and you had a developer knocking on your door offering you suit cases full of money "what would you do"
Personally I would much sooner see the country side full of race tracks than houses But I'm sure this won't be the last
|
|
1992 240 Volvo T8 1955 Cadillac 1994 BMW E34 M5 (now sold ) 1999 BMW E36 sport touring x2 1967 Hillman imp Californian "rally spec" 1971 VW bay window (work in progress) 1999 Mazda 323F 1987 Jaguar XJ12 All current
|
|
|
|
Aug 25, 2018 19:02:30 GMT
|
I rhink its because motorsport was also more affordable 20 years ago . You could buy fun exciting cars for a fee grand and compete in them . Everythng is more expensive and with younger people not necessary being able to afford a 3 bed house with garage/garden to work on or rent workshops etc .
I can't remember the last time i watched any motorsport that was not historic . I have tried watching touring cars but its just boring . Boring arrogant drivers , boring generic cars , boring noise even ! Formula 1 is the same but worse with the whole celebrity hanger on thing and people being obssessed with it .
The cars have no soul and neither do the drivers .
|
|
|
|
|
|
Aug 25, 2018 19:51:01 GMT
|
Maybe it says something about the economy. Younger people can't afford to buy their own houses so readily these days, so it stands to reason, that they would have less money to persue a hobby such as motorsport, whether as a spectator or as a participant.
Maybe people are getting less creative these days too, with more crippling insurance demands. In an ideal world, every weekend would be booked up with 'Extreme car roof Ironing Championships', race your car against a greyhound events, blind driving tournaments, toddler class racing, V8 Sofa racing, semi aquatic naked relay sprinting, to name just a few.
Think DiscoStew may be onto something too. Developers love big chunks of land. They've got a practically inexhaustable supply of money and friends in high places.
Sad state of affairs though really.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Aug 25, 2018 20:00:35 GMT
|
Yeah the whole housing industry is as bent as a £13 note . I live in Oxfordshire and apparently we need to basically build on about 50% of all the land within 6- 10 miles around Oxford and around the surrounding towns as well . We have been told we need 10,000 homes here , then 8000 4 miles down the road etc with already crumbling infastructure and traffic jams . Funnily enough all theses houses are 4-5 bed or more so no-one can afford them unless they are from london . Or the only way is to part rent part buy where they can milk you further and charge you for other stuff as well ! They also get out of the affordable housing they promise to provide by just not building it and paying a paltry fine .
I do wonder what will happen in 10- 15 years where all the wartime baby boomers die and leave all these old fashioned big houses that no one will have the money or desire to do up . Thats if they have not sold them off to equtity cashback companies that you see advertising constantly on tv -sod the kids , get cash from your home for another month on the costa del sol .
Developers are in my need to be reigned in category along with supermarkets .
|
|
|
|
|
|
Aug 26, 2018 14:30:57 GMT
|
Rockingham doesn't surprise me sadly,even the recent BTCC event didn't appear well attended. Sadly it was cursed from the outset, problems with the surface 'sweating' in the debut IndyCar race, the curfew restrictions. ASCAR could have succeeded but again not racing in Europe when it's wet would always present a challenge(perhaps European bodies and reverting to road course for wet races might have helped)
Eastbourne more curious,stock cars operated by Spedeworth and the owners passing is one thing but given one son(Martin Dugard) rode speedway to high level it's odd he wouldn't support it's continued future at the venue.
Property development will always appeal to local councils as it invites investment to a region and tracks represent a less attractive proposition than 200/300 houses.
|
|
2014 - Audi A6 Avant 3.0Tdi Quattro 1958 - Chevrolet Apache Panel Truck 1959 - Plymouth Custom Suburban 1952 - Chevrolet 2dr Hardtop 1985 - Ford Econoline E350 Quadravan 2009 - Ovlov V70 2.5T 1970 - Cortina Mk2 Estate 2007 - Fiat Ducato LWB 120Multijet 2014 - Honda Civic 2.2 CTDi ES
|
|
|
|
Aug 26, 2018 14:46:18 GMT
|
Not even mud tracks in a field available in Northumberland. Be a 200mile round trip for me to compete at a circuit now. A lot further for the nomadic off road events.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Aug 28, 2018 15:51:23 GMT
|
Being quite local, that would be a real shame to lose Arlington
|
|
|
|
|
|
Aug 29, 2018 11:31:44 GMT
|
My neighbour races Lightning Rods at Arena Essex, he tells me it's day's are numbered too. I'm assuming it's proximity to Lakeside and the train line connections means it will become houses and flats.
|
|
|
|
kenb
Part of things
Posts: 604
|
|
Aug 29, 2018 11:46:35 GMT
|
My neighbour races Lightning Rods at Arena Essex, he tells me it's day's are numbered too. I'm assuming it's proximity to Lakeside and the train line connections means it will become houses and flats. Yes it closes at the end of the season. The main reason being is lack of turnover- decreasing crowds, bad unpredictable weather, spectators stay at home etc, increasing costs ie insurance and all the other overheads. It really comes down to what I said in my earlier post on this thread.
|
|
|
|
ChasR
RR Helper
motivation
Posts: 10,194
Club RR Member Number: 170
|
|
|
Motorsport is all in a bit of limbo as it is anyway. With the ending of petrol car production/sales in 2024 or thereabouts everything is going to be up in the air. Do people watch motorsport live for the racing itself or is it the 4 dimensional aspect of sight, smell, noise and taste (mmmm burnt rubber). The major downside of electric motorsport as i see it is that it loses the aspects that make a complete package, hence it's trying to attract a different crowd to the normal motorsport crowd. For me part of the appeal of watching it live is the noise of the engines, the feel in your chest as a V8 DTM car punches past you, the smell of the brakes/tyres/exhaust/fuel, this makes it a visceral experience. I just don't see that can happen with a glorified scalextric car...... It sounds like you've never been in a hybrid or full on electric car TBH. I've been lucky enough to be a passenger in a Tesla Model S for a couple of hundred miles as well as driving a BMW i3S over various terrain in addition to a Mercedes S205 C350h. With a V6 or something like that, the C350h is the car that stood out as the sweet spot. Electric power when you need it (pulling away in a hurry, gear changes, lack of engine revs etc.) but with the petrol motor to do the fun stuff (i.e what, the noise etc.). It's probably one of the few moderns that had me hunting around the classifieds for a while. If you have, I apologise . The technology isn't that hard to put into a 'normal car'. The Integrated Starter Generator Motors (ISGs) take the place of an alternator. From my point of view club racing has also contributed to the lack of interest in Motorsport now. Although really the root cause of that is the venues taking the gate money so the club's have little need/interest in attracting regular punters to events. Seeing photos of Paddock Hill bend from club meetings in the late 80's vs. now and it is a total ghost town. If you go to Spain it's like what the UK was in the 80s. Last year as a few know here I went to Circuito de Navarra to watch the Superbikes. It was a full on day of racing from various classes. It was awesome! What else did I notice? The event was free. Nada. We just drove up, had a look, had a couple of beers (for the non-drivers obvs.), a nice sandwich and generally had a great day. Almost everyone bought something from the bar; a sandwich, coffee, beer, nuts etc. and it was a great day out Short of a trackday here, I don't remember even practices being free for quite some time now. I know these places need to run, but I'm also sure that some people don't see paying £20 for a non-driver to go on an RWYB day as good value either. The main thing here is the costs are so prohibitive, and thanks to alot of scaremongering about 'safety' and 'people are out there to get you' from the powers that be, it only increases pressure on not holding the events! From I'd say 10 years ago, the game has changed alot in Motorsport. I do wonder what will happen in 10- 15 years where all the wartime baby boomers die and leave all these old fashioned big houses that no one will have the money or desire to do up . Thats if they have not sold them off to equtity cashback companies that you see advertising constantly on tv -sod the kids , get cash from your home for another month on the costa del sol . Developers are in my need to be reigned in category along with supermarkets . Without going too far off track, I've said before that if another recession comes, this will play a massive part. People are having less kids, houses are far more expensive now when compared to average wages (From 1 year salary = a house price to an annual salary = around 10 times that for the same kind of deal) and shopping etc. and the dissappearance of the baby-boomers may well instigate that. But back on positivity, that will make cars and possibly retros cheaper again, right .
|
|
|
|
skinnylew
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 5,546
Club RR Member Number: 11
|
|
|
Motorsport is all in a bit of limbo as it is anyway. With the ending of petrol car production/sales in 2024 or thereabouts everything is going to be up in the air. Do people watch motorsport live for the racing itself or is it the 4 dimensional aspect of sight, smell, noise and taste (mmmm burnt rubber). The major downside of electric motorsport as i see it is that it loses the aspects that make a complete package, hence it's trying to attract a different crowd to the normal motorsport crowd. For me part of the appeal of watching it live is the noise of the engines, the feel in your chest as a V8 DTM car punches past you, the smell of the brakes/tyres/exhaust/fuel, this makes it a visceral experience. I just don't see that can happen with a glorified scalextric car...... It sounds like you've never been in a hybrid or full on electric car TBH. I've been lucky enough to be a passenger in a Tesla Model S for a couple of hundred miles as well as driving a BMW i3S over various terrain in addition to a Mercedes S205 C350h. With a V6 or something like that, the C350h is the car that stood out as the sweet spot. Electric power when you need it (pulling away in a hurry, gear changes, lack of engine revs etc.) but with the petrol motor to do the fun stuff (i.e what, the noise etc.). It's probably one of the few moderns that had me hunting around the classifieds for a while. If you have, I apologise . The technology isn't that hard to put into a 'normal car'. The Integrated Starter Generator Motors (ISGs) take the place of an alternator. Yeah it's not so much the driving of them, i have driven a Prius, it was terrible, but I understand and appreciate a Tesla is rapid quick and better than most petrol equivalents. I think it's too early for a full electric race to work, but i'd be happy to watch an all Tesla touring car style race! The fact that Formula e pit stops are to change cars shows the limitations of the technology. Hybrid on the other hand is workable......to be seen in BTCC soon....
|
|
|
|
slater
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 6,390
Club RR Member Number: 78
|
|
Aug 30, 2018 18:25:41 GMT
|
Can mourn either of those two really. Rockingham was a dud from day 1. Built for racing no one wanted.
|
|
|
|
snoopy
Part of things
Posts: 69
|
|
Aug 30, 2018 19:40:08 GMT
|
The Midlands has lost Brandon stadium to housing and Shakespeare Raceway is closed planning for 2400 houses was in the pipeline but now the local council are on about saving the site because of the activities still there. A shame that circuits are now limited so much on use and noise pollution because houses have been built near them adding to their financial problems. There will be more pressure applied to circuits in the future with going green and pollution so the UK as a world leading country in motor sport and development will probably have only a few circuits.
|
|
|
|
|