|
|
|
Defo HAS to match, lost count of the number of our drivers (I was a truck fitter for 25 yrs) who have been nicked because they had not swapped the trailer plate over when they picked up a different artic trailer. The other point is, from a point of a small trailer or car trailer etc, the trailer itself isn’t necessarily insured, just covered by virtue of the fact it’s on the back of whatever is pulling it, so what would be the point of putting a plate on that does not match the towing vehicle? www.gov.uk/displaying-number-plates/rules-number-platesDifferent rules for artic trailers fersure! I got it from 2 different policemen of my aquaintance. The rules stated say the plate must match the car, or if you have more than 1 trailer the plate must be on the rearmost one (this latter seems a nonsense, i'm pretty sure more than 1 trailer is illegal anyway) But it doesn't say anything about more than 1 CAR! It's to do with easily identifying the owner by a speed camera or (now) ANPR camera. If the number plate comes back to you regardless, then it's OK, that's how it was explained to me! Steve It’s not illegal to have more than one trailer, but only for certain i.e you have a ‘showmans’ licence ( you know the fun fair dudes) you often see an artic tractor & trailer, then with a large caravan behind it. As for the comment you make about more than one car, not sure what that has to do with anything. The plate on any trailer must match the tow vehicle, end of, its clearly in the gov link
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
You won't be okay on a B licence there as the towing weight is more than the car weight. I tow my Puma behind my E39 528i on a single axle trailer and only just get away with the weights with a B licence. A manual 528i has a MGW of 2050KG, my trailer weighs 350kg, car is 950kg (track car with bits removed), sum of the trailer tyre weight loadings comes to 1380kg (no plate so use the trailer tyre load ratings). SO my MGW of the car is 2050kg + the MGW of the trailer (1380) = 3430kg (so just under 3.5T!). I also satisfy the rule of trailer + load being less than the weight of the car (unloaded the 528i is 1480kg). It's a massive game though, I carry papers in the my glovebox showing the weight of the trailer & weight of the car and have my handbook which shows the weight of the car. Makes no difference the E39 can tow 2200kg braked. I also make sure that the trailer is 100% up to the job, it's it (I've got running lights on mine as seeing a trailer in the dark with no load on it is hard with chromatic side and interior mirrors!), proper registration plate, mudguards etc, load tied down securely on all 4 corners. I plan to do my +E at some point, being employed and self employed it's finding the time! But I've checked all of this out with a traffic copper (friend's wife) and I'm 100% legal there, albeit just! With +E the car can be upto 3500KG MGW and the trailer up to 3500kg MGW (train of 7250kg). -------------------- Be careful, I sent an email off to ask about the weight of the load and whether they would look at actual weight of the loaded car (in my case 980kgs) or the plated weight of the car (1475kgs). This was the response: My Email I sent: I am considering purchasing a Ford Transit Beavertail recovery truck in order to transport my Trackday car from home to circuit and back again and I have a question over weights. I would like to clarify that my thinking is correct as I don’t want to fall foul of being overweight. The load car would be a Ford Escort that has a plated Gross Weight on the VIN tag of 1475kgs but it is stripped and actually weighs 980kgs. Supposing the Recovery truck is 2000kgs with a maximum Gross weight of 3500kgs, using the 1475kg figure, if tested, it would show that I would be very close to the limit and indeed, I would be over the limit as soon as I got in the cab. If it goes by actuals then I would be under by a large margin. When Vosa test, do they go by the plated weight of the car loaded, or actual weight using a weighbridge? Would it help, carrying evidence of the actual weight or is this meaningless due to people miss-representing weight.
Thanks, Matt
The Response: Thank you for your email enquiry dated 29th October 2017, concerning the above.
DVSA Enforcement Officers would use the plated weight of the vehicles concerned to determine any overweight criteria, therefore if, due to modifications, the weight of the carried vehicle has changed you would need to change the weight plate to reflect this.
Any documentation would need to reflect the weight displayed on the vehicle.
|
|
MK4 Ford Escort XR3i - Standard MK6 Ford Escort GTi - Track Car
|
|
|
|
|
There are plenty of home made trailers here too but they all need to pass the test. My main trailer is a home built special over fifty years old with an axle from something pre WW2 but it still gets clean sheet wofs.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 18, 2017 11:17:21 GMT
|
A nice clear answer from DVSA which doesn't contradict anything else they've said at all...
With the number plate thing, it is my understanding that cars, wagons etc need to display the same plate as the towing vehicle, however with Agricultural trailers and impliments it is acceptable to have a differing plate provided the number belongs to a machine registered to the operators farm.
The contractor I work for has the number from an old 70's tractor that hasn't run on the road for 20 years or more (but is still active/registered as an agricultural vehicle with DVLA, whilst all the machines that tow them on the road are less than 10 years old.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 18, 2017 16:12:33 GMT
|
I have seen the same thing around here (Norfolk) one of our local 'Gentleman Farmers' has a very nice private plate. guess what most of the vehicles display?
|
|
|
|
slater
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 6,390
Club RR Member Number: 78
|
Max train weight 3500kg?!?!slater
@slater
Club Retro Rides Member 78
|
Nov 18, 2017 17:09:27 GMT
|
You won't be okay on a B licence there as the towing weight is more than the car weight. I tow my Puma behind my E39 528i on a single axle trailer and only just get away with the weights with a B licence. A manual 528i has a MGW of 2050KG, my trailer weighs 350kg, car is 950kg (track car with bits removed), sum of the trailer tyre weight loadings comes to 1380kg (no plate so use the trailer tyre load ratings). SO my MGW of the car is 2050kg + the MGW of the trailer (1380) = 3430kg (so just under 3.5T!). I also satisfy the rule of trailer + load being less than the weight of the car (unloaded the 528i is 1480kg). It's a massive game though, I carry papers in the my glovebox showing the weight of the trailer & weight of the car and have my handbook which shows the weight of the car. Makes no difference the E39 can tow 2200kg braked. I also make sure that the trailer is 100% up to the job, it's it (I've got running lights on mine as seeing a trailer in the dark with no load on it is hard with chromatic side and interior mirrors!), proper registration plate, mudguards etc, load tied down securely on all 4 corners. I plan to do my +E at some point, being employed and self employed it's finding the time! But I've checked all of this out with a traffic copper (friend's wife) and I'm 100% legal there, albeit just! With +E the car can be upto 3500KG MGW and the trailer up to 3500kg MGW (train of 7250kg). -------------------- Be careful, I sent an email off to ask about the weight of the load and whether they would look at actual weight of the loaded car (in my case 980kgs) or the plated weight of the car (1475kgs). This was the response: My Email I sent: I am considering purchasing a Ford Transit Beavertail recovery truck in order to transport my Trackday car from home to circuit and back again and I have a question over weights. I would like to clarify that my thinking is correct as I don’t want to fall foul of being overweight. The load car would be a Ford Escort that has a plated Gross Weight on the VIN tag of 1475kgs but it is stripped and actually weighs 980kgs. Supposing the Recovery truck is 2000kgs with a maximum Gross weight of 3500kgs, using the 1475kg figure, if tested, it would show that I would be very close to the limit and indeed, I would be over the limit as soon as I got in the cab. If it goes by actuals then I would be under by a large margin. When Vosa test, do they go by the plated weight of the car loaded, or actual weight using a weighbridge? Would it help, carrying evidence of the actual weight or is this meaningless due to people miss-representing weight.
Thanks, Matt
The Response: Thank you for your email enquiry dated 29th October 2017, concerning the above.
DVSA Enforcement Officers would use the plated weight of the vehicles concerned to determine any overweight criteria, therefore if, due to modifications, the weight of the carried vehicle has changed you would need to change the weight plate to reflect this.
Any documentation would need to reflect the weight displayed on the vehicle. lol what a load of horse curse word. I think they are just confused because when it comes to loads it's obviously the actual weight that matters. They couldn't give too hoots if it's a car or an elephant on the back. They just weight you and if your within your gross weight and axle weights your fine.
|
|
Last Edit: Nov 18, 2017 17:12:22 GMT by slater
|
|
|
|
Nov 18, 2017 18:47:54 GMT
|
Where does one find the data plate on an elephant?
And what are it's axle weights?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 18, 2017 19:07:22 GMT
|
If towing an elephant its best to stay on the trunk roads............. Sorry.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 18, 2017 19:24:01 GMT
|
If towing an elephant its best to stay on the trunk roads............. Sorry. Aaww tusk tusk.... I think you’ll find what road you use is irrelephant. I’m also sorry
|
|
|
|
colnerov
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,841
Member is Online
|
|
Nov 18, 2017 20:23:05 GMT
|
-------------------- Be careful, I sent an email off to ask about the weight of the load and whether they would look at actual weight of the loaded car (in my case 980kgs) or the plated weight of the car (1475kgs). This was the response: My Email I sent: I am considering purchasing a Ford Transit Beavertail recovery truck in order to transport my Trackday car from home to circuit and back again and I have a question over weights. I would like to clarify that my thinking is correct as I don’t want to fall foul of being overweight. The load car would be a Ford Escort that has a plated Gross Weight on the VIN tag of 1475kgs but it is stripped and actually weighs 980kgs. Supposing the Recovery truck is 2000kgs with a maximum Gross weight of 3500kgs, using the 1475kg figure, if tested, it would show that I would be very close to the limit and indeed, I would be over the limit as soon as I got in the cab. If it goes by actuals then I would be under by a large margin. When Vosa test, do they go by the plated weight of the car loaded, or actual weight using a weighbridge? Would it help, carrying evidence of the actual weight or is this meaningless due to people miss-representing weight.
Thanks, Matt
The Response: Thank you for your email enquiry dated 29th October 2017, concerning the above.
DVSA Enforcement Officers would use the plated weight of the vehicles concerned to determine any overweight criteria, therefore if, due to modifications, the weight of the carried vehicle has changed you would need to change the weight plate to reflect this.
Any documentation would need to reflect the weight displayed on the vehicle. lol what a load of horse curse word. I think they are just confused because when it comes to loads it's obviously the actual weight that matters. They couldn't give too hoots if it's a car or an elephant on the back. They just weight you and if your within your gross weight and axle weights your fine. Hi, That's right, all that answer shows is they haven't read or understood the question properly. They have put a bit of nonsense in so they can show that they have answered a query. The weight plate on a vehicle only shows maximum weights not minimum. In fact it doesn't tell you the kerbweight at all, you have to go looking for that elsewhere. So you don't know how much load you can put in a car. What model or equipment the car has affects its kerbweight just as much as its gross weight. Colin
|
|
Last Edit: Nov 18, 2017 20:24:20 GMT by colnerov
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 18, 2017 21:18:04 GMT
|
How does vosa decide the plated weight of a track only car. Ic its a single seater it wont have a vin plate. Therefore if the vin plate is removed from the track car then theres no weight data so it would need to be weighed.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I agree, it seems muddled and as you say the plates do not specify actual kerb weight.
could just take the VIN plate off!
|
|
MK4 Ford Escort XR3i - Standard MK6 Ford Escort GTi - Track Car
|
|
wodge
Part of things
Posts: 455
|
|
Nov 19, 2017 10:43:30 GMT
|
I think people get a bit too paranoid about this sort of thing. As long as you are within 10% of all the confusing weight limits (including axle limits) and you're not a complete obnoxious prick when you get stopped the chances of getting prosecuted is slim. You may however be stopped from continuing your journey until you remove the excess weight.
This is a recurring discussion on motorhome forums (most of which have laughable payloads when all births are used) and the above is the general concencous.
I personally have been stopped towing a 1300kg MAM caravan with both a long wheelbase Shogun and a Mitsubishi Outlander both of which have a GVW of about 2500kg and nothing at all has been mentioned about my B only license - my wife who has grandad rights was in the car on both occasions and I had l plates in the car so was going to claim I forgot to stick them on if necessary - it never was! You may ask why I didn't just stick the Ls on anyway - well because everyone disrespects a vehicle with l plates on the road - overtaking unsafely all the time even when the outfit was travelling at a solo cars speed limit. (Something I have found true of all vehicles on L plates, on a motorbike and teaching my daughter to drive - the l is like a magnet to all a holes!!)
I towed the same caravan for many years with a phase 1 Renault Scenic as well, I can tell you that was downright dangerous despite being 100% legal.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 19, 2017 12:40:04 GMT
|
How does vosa decide the plated weight of a track only car. Ic its a single seater it wont have a vin plate. Therefore if the vin plate is removed from the track car then theres no weight data so it would need to be weighed. When in doubt Dvsa always refer to the VIN Plate. They can also bring up details on the vehicle from its reg plate,saying what it left factory as .... If neither are on the vehicle ( and as its not for public roads,it don't need them) then they can only physically weigh the combination.......
|
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 19, 2017 16:17:36 GMT
|
Well judging by the Golf estate I've just seen on the A17, there's no problems with anything Three up, 4 wheel trailer and towing a Ssangyong Musso!
Mind you, he might need a new rear bumper when he gets home, or at least the bottom section
|
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 19, 2017 17:45:20 GMT
|
That's impressive on a few levels.
Mostly grades of stupidity, but impressive nonetheless.
|
|
|
|