BLU
Part of things
Posts: 347
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May 21, 2013 12:47:12 GMT
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.......as in Individual vehicle approval, not the one you need when you can't pay debts!! Right I'm planning on building, what the DVLA describe, as a radically altered vehicle. However I'd like to find out what tests are needed before I go ahead so I can make sure it is road legal. Basically I'll be taking a MK2 Fiesta (26 years old) and removing the floorpan and engine bay (leaving me with the shell inc sills and boot floor, front panel etc) and grafting in another model cars floor, bay and all associated suspension pick up points (I'm keeping quiet about the details for now ) Am I right in assuming it will need to be IVA'd? Looking through the VOSA guide to IVA's I came across this statement; The vehicle supplying the running gear and floor is also over 10 years old........ so I'm a bit baffled if it needs one or not ( can't really see that, which is why I'm baffled about the above statement!)and if not what test is required I'm assuming it will end up on a Q plate as there will (obviously) be evidence that 2 vehicles have been welded together to form one car! Also what other forms or tests on top of IVA would be required as the guides to what is required are somewhat open to interpretation??
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Last Edit: May 21, 2013 12:49:14 GMT by BLU
The future's bright, the future's BLU
Silver 1987 MK2 Fiesta Ghia White 2006 MK6 Fiesta ST150 Yellow 2007 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Anniversary #279 Green 2007 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Celebration #471 (diesel conversion) Red 2008 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Anniversary #893
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VIP
South East
Posts: 8,293
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May 21, 2013 12:55:14 GMT
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Your Fiesta will be eligible for IVA testing, as you won't retain enough points under the DVLA guide for radically altered vehicles. www.gov.uk/vehicle-registration/radically-altered-vehiclesOther than the IVA, you'll also need an MOT, but that should be it. The section about 'older vehicles' you have highlighted refers to the IVA test requirements on unmodified vehicles, particularly at time of import, I.e. if its over 10 years old it doesn't require an IVA test when imported. Your Fiesta will not class as an 'older vehicle' any more, as you've lost too many points to retain the original Registration Number. It is therefore considered a 'new' vehicle, and therefore tested under IVA.
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Last Edit: May 21, 2013 13:01:11 GMT by VIP
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BLU
Part of things
Posts: 347
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May 21, 2013 13:03:59 GMT
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Your Fiesta will be eligible for IVA testing, as you won't retain enough points under the DVLA guide for radically altered vehicles. www.gov.uk/vehicle-registration/radically-altered-vehiclesOther than the IVA, you'll also need an MOT, but that should be it. The section about 'older vehicles' you have highlighted refers to the IVA test requirements on unmodified vehicles, particularly at time of import, I.e. if its over 10 years old it doesn't require an IVA test when imported. Your Fiesta will not class as an 'older vehicle' any more, as you've lost too many points to retain the original Registration Number. It is therefore considered a 'new' vehicle, and therefore tested under IVA. Right, now it makes sense cheers! Am I right in thinking there is no point in keeping the original chassis number intact as the DVLA will issue it with a new one? Will it end up as a Q plate? Where can I get a copy of what will be tested on IVA...
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Last Edit: May 21, 2013 13:06:51 GMT by BLU
The future's bright, the future's BLU
Silver 1987 MK2 Fiesta Ghia White 2006 MK6 Fiesta ST150 Yellow 2007 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Anniversary #279 Green 2007 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Celebration #471 (diesel conversion) Red 2008 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Anniversary #893
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VIP
South East
Posts: 8,293
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May 21, 2013 13:40:37 GMT
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Your Fiesta will be eligible for IVA testing, as you won't retain enough points under the DVLA guide for radically altered vehicles. www.gov.uk/vehicle-registration/radically-altered-vehiclesOther than the IVA, you'll also need an MOT, but that should be it. The section about 'older vehicles' you have highlighted refers to the IVA test requirements on unmodified vehicles, particularly at time of import, I.e. if its over 10 years old it doesn't require an IVA test when imported. Your Fiesta will not class as an 'older vehicle' any more, as you've lost too many points to retain the original Registration Number. It is therefore considered a 'new' vehicle, and therefore tested under IVA. Right, now it makes sense cheers! Am I right in thinking there is no point in keeping the original chassis number intact as the DVLA will issue it with a new one? Will it end up as a Q plate? Where can I get a copy of what will be tested on IVA... The DVLA will issue it with a new Registration Number, not a chassis number. The new V5C will contain whatever chassis number is on the car when presented for test. It WILL be a Q-reg, yes, but it's hardly a moot point for successfully getting your project on the road. As for the Test Manual, here you go. It's not light reading, as you'd expect! www.dft.gov.uk/vosa/repository/M1%20IVA%20Inspection%20Manual.pdf
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May 21, 2013 13:56:08 GMT
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I've been baffled myself by the same guide sheets, I would say you're inevitably going to end up with a Q reg from welding two cars together.
I'm curious to know if you'd still end up with a 'Q' plate if you merely changed all the mechanical components but kept the shell intact?
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"A Pierburg carb? It would be more economical to replace it with a funnel..."
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VIP
South East
Posts: 8,293
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May 21, 2013 14:47:48 GMT
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I've been baffled myself by the same guide sheets, I would say you're inevitably going to end up with a Q reg from welding two cars together. I'm curious to know if you'd still end up with a 'Q' plate if you merely changed all the mechanical components but kept the shell intact? Because not enough of the original vehicle remains under the DVLA points system to retain the original VRM. You CAN get a kit car registered with an age related plate, if using a new monocoque or chassis from a specialist kit manufacturer, along with two major components from a single donor vehicle. The VRM will then be based on the age of the donor vehicle. www.dft.gov.uk/dvla/forms/~/media/pdf/leaflets/inf26.ashx
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BLU
Part of things
Posts: 347
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May 21, 2013 15:14:10 GMT
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VIP, you're a star. You've clarified a lot for me now, makes the process seem less intimidating!
So I can use the Fiestas original VIN number, provided it is stamped on the body, even though it won't hold the same VRM that is attached to the VIN atm?
A Q plate doesn't bother me in the slightest.
Is the process like this then.....
IVA application, IVA test, Apply for new registration Affix new registration plates MOT Go out and enjoy!!
.........am I missing something or is it in the wrong order??
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The future's bright, the future's BLU
Silver 1987 MK2 Fiesta Ghia White 2006 MK6 Fiesta ST150 Yellow 2007 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Anniversary #279 Green 2007 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Celebration #471 (diesel conversion) Red 2008 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Anniversary #893
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May 21, 2013 18:21:39 GMT
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I've registered a few kitcars pre-SVA, so I may be a bit out of date on this sort of thing. As you're doing this the correct way and applying for IVA, chassis numbers and registration numbers won't be the big deal. As suggested, whatever chassis number is presented for testing will probably be OK for testing. When it comes to registration, DVLA *might* flag up a Fiesta chassis number on a not-Fiesta if you see what I mean. If that's the case, they may well issue you with a chassis number of their own choosing. In my experience, they've been inconsistent in their approach. You don't seem hung up on passing this off as some previouly existing vehicle, or what registration or what chassis number, so you shouldn't get stuck in the red tape.
The biggest issue will be building a car that will pass all the IVA requirements. I say good luck to you : I'm impressed that you're prepared to follow the legal way of doing it. There are too many others tring to bluff their way with illegally modified cars. [opens can of worms]
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BLU
Part of things
Posts: 347
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May 21, 2013 20:01:38 GMT
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Thanks, I don't see the problem with getting these checks done (although as its relatively complicated and time consuming I can see why its avoided by a lot of people). Its a pain, granted, but at least I now when its done I'll have a 100% road legal toy to go and play on the lovely welsh B roads Looking through the handbook of requirements I can't see any reason, providing I build it correctly, that it wouldn't pass an IVA. I'm not bothered on what identity it comes out with, just as long as its legal!! Which way round is it done, IVA then MOT? What reg plates will I put on the car for its IVA or will the DVLA let me know when I put the application in.... its just the finer details I need to iron out in my mind!!
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Last Edit: May 21, 2013 20:03:04 GMT by BLU
The future's bright, the future's BLU
Silver 1987 MK2 Fiesta Ghia White 2006 MK6 Fiesta ST150 Yellow 2007 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Anniversary #279 Green 2007 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Celebration #471 (diesel conversion) Red 2008 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Anniversary #893
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froggy
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,099
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May 21, 2013 20:11:37 GMT
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budget between £800-1000 to go through the iva /registration process
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BLU
Part of things
Posts: 347
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May 21, 2013 20:13:05 GMT
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Oh yeah I know its not gonna be cheap ..... but if a jobs gonna be done best to do it right!
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Last Edit: May 21, 2013 20:13:31 GMT by BLU
The future's bright, the future's BLU
Silver 1987 MK2 Fiesta Ghia White 2006 MK6 Fiesta ST150 Yellow 2007 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Anniversary #279 Green 2007 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Celebration #471 (diesel conversion) Red 2008 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Anniversary #893
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stealthstylz
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 14,841
Club RR Member Number: 174
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IVAsstealthstylz
@stealthstylz
Club Retro Rides Member 174
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May 21, 2013 22:31:14 GMT
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It'd be called whatever you want it to be aslong as the name isn't copyright. I want to IVA or rebody something just so I can call it a 100% Clunge Magnet.
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ToolsnTrack
Posted a lot
Homebrew Raconteur
Posts: 4,117
Club RR Member Number: 134
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IVAsToolsnTrack
@overdrive
Club Retro Rides Member 134
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It'd be called whatever you want it to be aslong as the name isn't copyright. I want to IVA or rebody something just so I can call it a 100% Clunge Magnet. No can do, that's my name.
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VIP
South East
Posts: 8,293
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May 22, 2013 10:56:37 GMT
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Which way round is it done, IVA then MOT? What reg plates will I put on the car for its IVA or will the DVLA let me know when I put the application in.... its just the finer details I need to iron out in my mind!! You'll present the car for IVA and MOT without registration plates. It's the same for an imported car, it will be IVA and MOT tested against the chassis number. Once the DVLA has issued you with a V5C, you'll also get your MOT certificate amended to show the new registration.
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VIP
South East
Posts: 8,293
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May 22, 2013 11:00:18 GMT
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When it comes to registration, DVLA *might* flag up a Fiesta chassis number on a not-Fiesta if you see what I mean. If that's the case, they may well issue you with a chassis number of their own choosing. 'In theory', you'd notify the DVLA of the de-registration of the car as soon as you start the project. It no longer conforms to the points system to retain the VRM, so technically that registration, and that car, doesn't exist any more. So you'd hope that by the time the project had reached the IVA testing and Registration stages, that the information on the ex-Fiesta had been removed from the database.
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edwell
Part of things
Posts: 199
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May 22, 2013 11:34:55 GMT
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From the direct.gov site
To keep the original registration number
Your vehicle must have 8 or more points from the table below. 5 of these points must come from having the original or new and unmodified chassis, monocoque bodyshell or frame.
Part Points
Chassis, monocoque bodyshell (body and chassis as one unit) or frame - original or new and unmodified* 5 Suspension (front and back) - original 2 Axles (both) - original 2 Transmission - original 2 Steering assembly - original 2 Engine - original 1
*Direct replacement from the manufacturers
Type approval and ‘Q’ registration numbers
You won’t be able to keep your vehicle’s original registration number if 1 of the following applies: it has fewer than 8 points it has a second-hand or altered chassis, monocoque bodyshell or frame there’s evidence that 2 vehicles have been welded together to form 1 (eg ‘cut and shut’)
In these cases, you’ll have to get type approval for your vehicle. If it passes, you can register it and it will get a ‘Q’ prefix registration number.
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VIP
South East
Posts: 8,293
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May 22, 2013 13:33:13 GMT
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From the direct.gov site To keep the original registration number Your vehicle must have 8 or more points from the table below. 5 of these points must come from having the original or new and unmodified chassis, monocoque bodyshell or frame. Part Points Chassis, monocoque bodyshell (body and chassis as one unit) or frame - original or new and unmodified* 5 Suspension (front and back) - original 2 Axles (both) - original 2 Transmission - original 2 Steering assembly - original 2 Engine - original 1 *Direct replacement from the manufacturers Type approval and ‘Q’ registration numbers You won’t be able to keep your vehicle’s original registration number if 1 of the following applies: it has fewer than 8 points it has a second-hand or altered chassis, monocoque bodyshell or frame there’s evidence that 2 vehicles have been welded together to form 1 (eg ‘cut and shut’) In these cases, you’ll have to get type approval for your vehicle. If it passes, you can register it and it will get a ‘Q’ prefix registration number. Yeah, that's linked in my first post.
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BLU
Part of things
Posts: 347
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May 22, 2013 15:13:39 GMT
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Which way round is it done, IVA then MOT? What reg plates will I put on the car for its IVA or will the DVLA let me know when I put the application in.... its just the finer details I need to iron out in my mind!! You'll present the car for IVA and MOT without registration plates. It's the same for an imported car, it will be IVA and MOT tested against the chassis number. Once the DVLA has issued you with a V5C, you'll also get your MOT certificate amended to show the new registration. Brill that makes sense. I take it you've done this a few times before then When it comes to registration, DVLA *might* flag up a Fiesta chassis number on a not-Fiesta if you see what I mean. If that's the case, they may well issue you with a chassis number of their own choosing. 'In theory', you'd notify the DVLA of the de-registration of the car as soon as you start the project. It no longer conforms to the points system to retain the VRM, so technically that registration, and that car, doesn't exist any more. So you'd hope that by the time the project had reached the IVA testing and Registration stages, that the information on the ex-Fiesta had been removed from the database. I think I'll speak to DVLA when I start the project to confirm if the original chassis number can be re-used or if it needs a new one.
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Last Edit: May 22, 2013 15:13:57 GMT by BLU
The future's bright, the future's BLU
Silver 1987 MK2 Fiesta Ghia White 2006 MK6 Fiesta ST150 Yellow 2007 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Anniversary #279 Green 2007 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Celebration #471 (diesel conversion) Red 2008 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Anniversary #893
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steveg
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,565
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May 22, 2013 18:48:43 GMT
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Where does a car whos outer skin has been removed and substituted with another come into these rules ? I've been reading up about a few cars that have used modern mechanicals, floorpans and bulkheads etc but have older shells mounted on them. I know a few kit cars can be done like this.
Just curious as I have a few ideas.
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BLU
Part of things
Posts: 347
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May 22, 2013 19:32:51 GMT
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Where does a car whos outer skin has been removed and substituted with another come into these rules ? I've been reading up about a few cars that have used modern mechanicals, floorpans and bulkheads etc but have older shells mounted on them. I know a few kit cars can be done like this. Just curious as I have a few ideas. As soon as you modify any part of the shell structurally it becomes a radically altered vehicle according to DVLA literature and as such an IVA and registration is required. Its pretty much what I have planned for my project, except the running gear is only semi-modern!
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Last Edit: May 22, 2013 19:34:24 GMT by BLU
The future's bright, the future's BLU
Silver 1987 MK2 Fiesta Ghia White 2006 MK6 Fiesta ST150 Yellow 2007 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Anniversary #279 Green 2007 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Celebration #471 (diesel conversion) Red 2008 MK6 Fiesta Zetec S Anniversary #893
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