95 audi 80 avant and a new born baby

the audi will be fine wont it? ive got an old 1987 e28 bmw that I use everyday with a 4 month girl and a 6 year old boy... when I was growing up I was always in my dads capris and cortinas

congratulations by the way!

I'm all for retro ownership, but to me safety comes first for my kid.

I take it you've seen the fifth gear staged crash between and old Volvo 940 and a modern Renault Modus?

Interesting video, I would have chosen wrong!

According to the comments on that the engine and gearbox has been removed in the volvo.

I'm with sonus all the way, I have repaired hundreds of crashed cars in my time, and it's modern all the way for me, the way modern cars act in a crash is just totally removed from those even just a few years older, when my first was born I went out and spent a huge amount of money on a 3 year old Honda Accord tourer, we didn’t really get on with it and when nipper had got a bit bigger we traded it for a 2000 plate 5 series estate .. We now have twins on the way and I am wondering what to do again, my wife now drives an W210 E class estate, both the BMW and E class are just about acceptably safe in my mind, through being HUGE and modern'ish' high end cars, but I still know in my heart of hearts how much safer my family would be back in the Honda or something else much more modern....

You have to draw a line where you are happy to compromise,, and I think a lot depends on what driving you do and how much, I will still put my daughter in my MX-5 for a blat into town on a good day, but I would be terrified using it as a daily with her, in bad conditions/long distances/driving tired etc etc...

Those who say 'i was perfectly safe in the boot of my dads Metro' etc etc are talking runny dung I'm afraid, at the end of the day I know of one family (a whole family adults and kids) that was killed at less than 50 mph when their BL metro left the road, back in the day, if you look at how modern cars respond to crashes, that same accident would have been bumps and bruises now....

I assume you've all seen this too? As a trainee Physics teacher you have to bore people to death with energy and where it goes etc etc, the simple fact is, the energy of a crash does not go down in a safer car, basically as other cars get safer your old car gets more dangerous, that energy has to go somewhere.....

Congrats BTW, for me it's the best thing I've ever done or experienced, life changing...

I don't disagree with modern vs retro safety, just saying the first example wasn't very fair. The Espace vs Espace vid on the other hand is a real eye opener.

many thanks to everyone thats commented so far, some interesting reading.

I'm looking at sticking with the vag group and a4/a6/passats are the motors ive been looking at.
as its going to be my daily driver I'm not bothered about how fast it goes, the polo is stage 2 anyway kicking out 200bhp+ so comfort/safety for my upcoming family is the priority.

after looking at the videos posted above I'm leaning more to the modern just to even out the chances if in the unfortunate happens i do have an accident.

keep the posts coming its good to hear opinions good or bad

thanks

vwmorty

Controlled crash results are all very fine but how well they represent real world accident results is open to question. See this japanese paper for example: www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/pdf/Esv/esv16/98S1O08.PDF

Also, a 5-Star NCAP rating sounds great, but if you look at how it is calculated it quickly becomes apparent that determining the safety of one car in relation to another isn't clear cut as they'd like you to think.

The NCAP rating has four component parts.

1. The adult occupant safety rating which is derived from three different collision tests - frontal impact, side impact, and side pole impact and a whiplash prevention test. The first three seems relatively straight forward, although in the real world accidents come in many more shapes and sizes than the standardised conditions under which NCAP performs its tests. On the other hand this is what NCAP has to say about the Whiplash test:

"While the mechanisms by which the injuries are caused are not fully understood, it is known that seat and head restraint design can influence the risk of injury. The test procedure applied by Euro NCAP therefore promotes the best practice in seat design, in particular good head restraint geometry, its ease of use as far as adjustment, the locking of the head restraint and the overall seat integrity.

The Whiplash score is based on both the geometrical aspects of the (driver/passenger) seat, the size and shape of the head restraint and its proximity to the occupant, as well as the seat and head restraint dynamic performance during an actual crash test. This dynamic performance is assessed using a seat mounted on a sled test, subjected to low, moderate and higher test severities representing a range of crash forces believed to cause injury."

So this latter test is based upon theories and suppositions and tests using a limited range of adult dummies, yet it affects the rating awarded to a car.

2. The Child occupant safety rating has the following test parameters: "In the frontal and side impact barrier tests, dummies representing 1½ and 3 year old children are placed in the rear of the car in the type of child restraint, recommended by the car manufacturer. The score depends on the child seat dynamic performance in front and side impact tests but also on the fitting instructions for the child restraints, airbag warning labels, and the car’s ability to accommodate the child restraints safely." The basic test may have merit, but there are so many variables - ie is the child seat recommended by the car manufacturer actually the best that could be used? How much safer does having child restraints and airbag warning labels actually make the car? How well the car accomodates child restraint systems surely depends on the particular child restraint system being used.

3. Pedestrian Protection. While none of us wants to unecessarily maim or kill pedestrians, unless you're intending on running down your sprogs on a regular basis this is entirely irrelevant to the safety of you and your family.

4. The last category is called Safety Assist. Says NCAP: "Euro NCAP rewards manufacturers for the fitment of electronic stability control, in addition to points given for the presence of a speed limitation device and intelligent seat belt reminders." I can see that ESC may have a part to play in making cars safer, although it would depend to a large degree on the handling dynamics of the car itself as to whether it is really required. But assuming you are a law abiding citizen who drives within the speed limit, and always uses your seat belt, then the other two criteria are meaningless.

As someone mentioned above, there are passive safety factors such as lack of blind spots, or the ease of driving that should be taken into account as well. My w124 estate wins big on both these factors - my ability to see where my car is in relation to other traffic is better than any other I have ever driven, and it is very comfortable, stable car which lessens the likelihood of driver fatigue reduces the likelihood that I will lose control of it. Its size is also reassuring - even if a brand-new Fiesta has a better safety rating, I would still much rather hit it in my Mercedes than hit it in another Fiesta.

I think that a lot of early to mid-nineties vehicle designs are perfectly safe to use on a day-to-day basis. Are they as safe as something built in the past couple of years? Probably not, but I'm not sure the difference is as great as you might expect. So I wouldn't be too quick to throw away your beloved Audi without further investigation into how safe or unsafe it is.