ChrisT
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 1,670
Club RR Member Number: 225
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Jun 27, 2019 19:39:33 GMT
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......thinking getting subframe back in place may be more of a game... I was right  Subframe wouldn't go back in place, mainly because of the axis it swings round the rear bolts, which are rusted into the chassis so I daren't try and remove them. Instead had to remove the lower wishbones and rear link arms so the chassis can be dropped straight onto the crossmember.....   If I'd have known all this was going to have to come off I would have approached the job from a slightly different angle. Crossmember/suspension now back together and a lot of the front of the engine in place, slight mishap with one of the front cover standoff bolts - managed to shear it off  |
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ChrisT
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 1,670
Club RR Member Number: 225
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Mar 14, 2020 15:24:59 GMT
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Wow, it's been almost 9 months since I updated this, anyone following it would guess it's one of two reasons, either I've sorted the low oil pressure and just been out enjoying it all this time or replacing the oil pump made absolutely no difference and I've had to walk away from it for a while.... Unsurprisingly it's the latter After getting it all back together and finding the problem still the same I tried making an adjustable oil pressure relief valve - basically a fine thread m10 bolt tapped into an old pressure relief valve bolt - which didn't solve it either. Reading online about XE low oil pressure there was mention of the oilway across the head fracturing because of it's proximity to the head bolts (they go through it). A way to fix this is inserting a tube in the oilway to sleeve it and looked quite an easy job so thought I'd give it a go.... The oilway goes across the head in the middle with a grub screw each end, here's one side between the exhaust manifold...  Obviously being a small hex head grub screw it wasn't going to come out easily, tried a 5mm allen socket on it but it only started to chew it up so stopped, online method mentions hammering a T40 torx bit in there, I'd also heard about using a dab of coarse grinding paste to give it a bit more bite. So, a combination of being soaked in WD40 for a while, Torx bit and grinding paste, it came out with minimal effort....  Removed the cam cover and head stud that goes through the oilway, B&Q provided me with 1metre of 8mm aluminium round tube - only needed 87mm of it....  This went into the oilway, the head stud the other side stops it going anywhere. Instead of reusing the damaged grub screw I found one on an old head that came out without a fight....  With everything back together has it made any difference - after a bit of a drive about getting the engine to temperature I can say no, doesn't appear to have made any difference Not sure where to go with this now.... |
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stealthstylz
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 14,960
Club RR Member Number: 174
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Mar 14, 2020 15:56:35 GMT
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What are the exact symptoms?
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Mar 14, 2020 16:28:41 GMT
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I think you need a decent capillary pressure gauge to prove the pressure, those mechanical to electronic sender units aren't great especially some of the aftermarket ones, once you've proved that and with the work that's been done to the bottom end I think you have to assume that the main bearing clearances are wrong
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ChrisT
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 1,670
Club RR Member Number: 225
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Mar 15, 2020 12:50:18 GMT
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What are the exact symptoms? Basically I've got good oil pressure on start up and as the oil warms up (not sure what temp, can't get sensor to work) the pressure at idle starts dropping, eventually down to about 20Psi, it rises when engine is revved. People say that's about normal but it's not been that low before and I'm a bit wary that if pressure from the pump is that low what is it top end. I have put thicker oil in and it raised pressures a bit, not sure what that proves or disproves but 20/50 is too thick to be running permanently. I think you need a decent capillary pressure gauge to prove the pressure, those mechanical to electronic sender units aren't great especially some of the aftermarket ones, once you've proved that and with the work that's been done to the bottom end I think you have to assume that the main bearing clearances are wrong Might be worth investing in one, I have got the original instrument one and an aftermarket TIM one both senders in similar positions at the back of the pump, both showing much the same results. Really hope it's not bottom end |
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Last Edit: Mar 15, 2020 13:02:57 GMT by ChrisT
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stealthstylz
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 14,960
Club RR Member Number: 174
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Mar 15, 2020 19:18:35 GMT
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Who built the bottom end? That's the symptoms you get when the crank journals are a right on the minimum limits or slightly below. We're the bearing clearances checked?
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Mar 15, 2020 19:27:16 GMT
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I have seen and experienced the symptoms you have described unfortunately it was a worse case as the cause and it was on a 16V Vauxhall engine it turned out the crank had snapped on the middle bearing it still drove and not bad too but no power performance, luckily the thrust bearings held it together and stopped it exploding.
I hope not for you but it's possible.
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shoey
Part of things
Posts: 320 
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Mar 15, 2020 19:52:22 GMT
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Hi Chris have you tried changing the oil filter?,I was watching a you tube vid on dyno tuning and the oil pressure started dropping off , it turn out to be the filter breaking down ,worth a try.
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Mar 17, 2020 14:07:15 GMT
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i know you told us AFTER you had already done the work, but when your aforementioned oil gallery fails, it fails into the adjacent coolant jacket giving you headgasket style oil/water mayo mix. you don't have that issue so would probably have advised not to bother.
agree on the advice about a second opinion on the oil pressure, definitely not saying ignore it as i agree that 20psi is low (but not life threatening at idle) these engines would have been 30-45psi at idle (as standard)
massive edit as i realised i am repeating my own advice from last year and youve fitted another pump !
stupid question, the senders are single wire, which means they must earth through the block and or be resistance driven. not doing anything homer simpson like running 2 gauges from 1 sender? same question are engine earths ok?
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Last Edit: Mar 17, 2020 14:22:37 GMT by darrenh
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ChrisT
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 1,670
Club RR Member Number: 225
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Mar 22, 2020 21:58:35 GMT
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Who built the bottom end? That's the symptoms you get when the crank journals are a right on the minimum limits or slightly below. We're the bearing clearances checked? I rebuilt and no, didn't check clearance, all looked good, always had good pressure so didn't even think about it. |
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ChrisT
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 1,670
Club RR Member Number: 225
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Mar 22, 2020 21:59:46 GMT
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Hi Chris have you tried changing the oil filter?,I was watching a you tube vid on dyno tuning and the oil pressure started dropping off , it turn out to be the filter breaking down ,worth a try. Brand new filter, not to say it's not breaking down though.... |
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ChrisT
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 1,670
Club RR Member Number: 225
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Mar 22, 2020 22:01:30 GMT
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I have seen and experienced the symptoms you have described unfortunately it was a worse case as the cause and it was on a 16V Vauxhall engine it turned out the crank had snapped on the middle bearing it still drove and not bad too but no power performance, luckily the thrust bearings held it together and stopped it exploding. I hope not for you but it's possible. Fairly sure the crank's in one piece, power-wise it's fine. |
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ChrisT
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 1,670
Club RR Member Number: 225
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Mar 22, 2020 22:08:29 GMT
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i know you told us AFTER you had already done the work, but when your aforementioned oil gallery fails, it fails into the adjacent coolant jacket giving you headgasket style oil/water mayo mix. you don't have that issue so would probably have advised not to bother. agree on the advice about a second opinion on the oil pressure, definitely not saying ignore it as i agree that 20psi is low (but not life threatening at idle) these engines would have been 30-45psi at idle (as standard) massive edit as i realised i am repeating my own advice from last year and youve fitted another pump ! stupid question, the senders are single wire, which means they must earth through the block and or be resistance driven. not doing anything homer simpson like running 2 gauges from 1 sender? same question are engine earths ok? Thought the oilway fix was for different symptoms but thought what if it was slightly cracked and leaking into the head rather than waterway, might give low pressure and it's fairly easy job. Got a couple of decent engine earths and the senders are separate, one in the pump and one near it in the block, I think. |
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carmad
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,002
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is the pick up pipe damaged ?
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mat88
Yorkshire and The Humber
Posts: 1,542
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Mar 28, 2020 13:45:33 GMT
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Just read this from start to finish.. pics don't seem to work at the begining. But it could be my Chinese phone haha I absolutely love this. It's pretty much how I'd have done a manta (well I may have gone 20let but I think everything should be turbo ) Can't help with the oil pressure issues but with how far it's come I'm sure youl sort it. Bookmarked |
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ChrisT
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 1,670
Club RR Member Number: 225
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Mar 28, 2020 14:59:33 GMT
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is the pick up pipe damaged ? Don't thinks so, certainly not obviously as I would have seen it when changing the oil pump. Just read this from start to finish.. pics don't seem to work at the begining. But it could be my Chinese phone haha I absolutely love this. It's pretty much how I'd have done a manta (well I may have gone 20let but I think everything should be turbo ) Can't help with the oil pressure issues but with how far it's come I'm sure youl sort it. Bookmarked Thanks, not sure why the photos aren't working, I swapped them over to forum hosting when photobucket went tits up  Did think about going turbo but I've got my 200SX for boosted fun  Edit - Just looked and a lot of photos not working for me either, thanks for persevering and reading it all, it's not the same without photos.... |
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Last Edit: Mar 28, 2020 15:04:49 GMT by ChrisT
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Apr 24, 2020 17:46:03 GMT
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mat88 ChrisT the earlier images are hosted on a different server to the later images. recently pro-boards (the people who supply the forum software) made an update which has forced all hotlinked images to be secure version (https prefix, via SSL certificate) the server for the earlier hosted images does not have an SSL certificate, it wont supply secure version of the hotlinked images. short version its blanket changed all the urls from http to https, if the host can only supply http version, and the forum has changed the url to https, they appear as deadlinks (even though the actual images are still there on the server)
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ChrisT
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 1,670
Club RR Member Number: 225
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Apr 25, 2020 12:14:23 GMT
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Thanks, didn't really understand much of that though.
Have been back to edit the first post and found I can cut and paste the photo address to a new tab, where it appears, then drag and drop it back into the post, but it goes to the bottom of it so I've then got to move it up the original position, a bit of a long winded process especially as I've already had to go through rehosting them when Photobucket started charging - think I'll wait until a better fix comes up.....
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Last Edit: Apr 25, 2020 12:16:25 GMT by ChrisT
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ChrisT
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 1,670
Club RR Member Number: 225
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Jun 20, 2020 21:05:24 GMT
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Bearing tolerances seem to be a possible cause so lets have a look then. Think I've been here before..  Opted for ratchet winch thing suspended from roof beam to lift it out this time..  A little wiggling later it's free from the gearbox.  Just need to lift it out with fork truck and figure out how to upend it without damaging anything.... |
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Last Edit: Jun 20, 2020 21:06:32 GMT by ChrisT
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ChrisT
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 1,670
Club RR Member Number: 225
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Jun 24, 2020 21:25:46 GMT
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That's the engine lifted out...   Made some brackets which attach to the lifting points on the head that with the engine upside down act as feet...  Didn't take too much heaving to upend it, laid it down on exhaust side then lifted from the sump.  Now the fun starts. |
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