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Feb 28, 2023 19:50:55 GMT
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So I have long wanted a Humber Hawk Mark VI. And I spotted a few come up for sale so I guessed it was time to buy. Unfortunately everything I saw was either full of filler or sold before I got to it. So I posted a "wanted" ad and was offered this old beast. The previous owner had bought it to shove a turbo diesel in it and then decided it was way too original a car to mess with so sold it to me. And original it is. Its how I like 'em, with tons of paperwork showing the history of the car right since almost new. We do know the history though. It was bought brand new as a shuttle car for a hotel, to run guests back and forth from the station or whatever. This was then sold in 1960 to a new owner, who kept it (and all the paperwork) until 2017. Yes. 1960 to 2017. it then passed to a member of the Humber club and then onto the chap I bought it from in early 2021. The car is super original, original paint, interior, all that. The doors click shut like they should. The hotel is still in business so at some point I am going to take it "home" which should be a fun road trip as its in Bristol.... So the car has had a small mod, the original final drive in these is super low ratio so a previous owner swapped in the Sunbeam Talbot 90 final drive for better cruising. Damn, I have no idea how it would have been before as its still getting a bit wild at 55 or so. I acquired an overdrive box but I've not got that fitted. I also think it should be achievable to get more power from the OHV 4 banger by taking it to Sunbeam Talbot spec (another 10 or so BHP, factory) and maybe a few tweaks from there and maybe get close to 100 bhp from it! the car is shabby, but solid, straight and original. The plan was to just tidy it up a bit and fix where there was rust in the panels to preserve it. Such are the plans of mice and men...       original log book:   |
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Last Edit: Feb 28, 2023 20:42:32 GMT by akku
1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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Feb 28, 2023 19:54:49 GMT
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1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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Feb 28, 2023 19:57:18 GMT
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 Quirky looking cars, but ive always had a soft spot for them. Hoping to get into this one this year. I did also break a complete one, so if you need the odd bit here and there I may have it. Enjoy! |
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Feb 28, 2023 20:24:24 GMT
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Quirky looking cars, but ive always had a soft spot for them. Hoping to get into this one this year. I did also break a complete one, so if you need the odd bit here and there I may have it. Enjoy! Twins! I've always fancied one. I think I am mostly good for parts. I fancy doing a mildly modified one, using Series Hawk parts to give it disc brakes and so on. Apparently the Mk6 and the Series Hawk will allow for fitment of the parts with some "ease" |
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1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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Nice! Always have a soft spot for a Humber and these are really nicely styled.
Quite some rust in the doors, but now that's dealt with, you can have fun getting more power out of it. Didn't realise these shared a motor with the Alpine. I guess there's some tuning expertise around those cars? They were raced back then, right?
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Lovely old bus. Pictured at the Sondes Arms as well, just around the corner from us.
I wouldn't get too excited about using series Hawk disc brakes. They are nothing special, also the calipers are made of unobtainium. If you use the disc brake uprights from a series the Jag four pot calipers bolt on. Merc vented discs fit with a tiny bit of hole clearancing (they are centre bore registered).
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Proton Jumbuck-deceased :-(
2005 Kia Sorento the parts hauling heap
V8 Humber Hawk
1948 Standard12 pickup SOLD
1953 Pop build (wifey's BIVA build).
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Nice! Always have a soft spot for a Humber and these are really nicely styled. Quite some rust in the doors, but now that's dealt with, you can have fun getting more power out of it. Didn't realise these shared a motor with the Alpine. I guess there's some tuning expertise around those cars? They were raced back then, right? Rootes Group parts interchangability...  The Sunbeam Alpine and Talbot 90 were raced and rallied. The big HUmbers also were used in endurance racing but they used the six cylinder Super Snipe for that. |
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1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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Lovely old bus. Pictured at the Sondes Arms as well, just around the corner from us. I wouldn't get too excited about using series Hawk disc brakes. They are nothing special, also the calipers are made of unobtainium. If you use the disc brake uprights from a series the Jag four pot calipers bolt on. Merc vented discs fit with a tiny bit of hole clearancing (they are centre bore registered). Thats interesting info. That photo was taken when I was bringing the car home. |
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1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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A well designed set of drums is hard to beat.
Because they will have 1 or more ( depending on the design) self energizing shoe.
Discs do not self energize.
Really the main advantage of a disc is that it can dissipate heat a lot better.
If the type of driving this car will see won't push the drum system to overheating & fade, there may not be a lot of advantage to converting to discs...
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A well designed set of drums is hard to beat. I recongise the theory and have quoted it many times myself, but experience suggests stopping a heavy car from speed works way better with discs than drums. Sure I have driven drum brake cars which will stand on thier nose with a jab of the pedal at 20, 30, 40 mph but motorways or fast cross country roads I don't feel so confident with drums to stop the car as quick as the guy in front. And modern motorways, if you leave a long braking gap someone pulls into it.... the brakes on the Hawk are not great. But it wasn't designed to be driven fast or in heavy traffic. |
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1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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Yeah, if they are marginal to begin with they need to be upgraded...
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A well designed set of drums is hard to beat. Because they will have 1 or more ( depending on the design) self energizing shoe. Discs do not self energize. Really the main advantage of a disc is that it can dissipate heat a lot better. If the type of driving this car will see won't push the drum system to overheating & fade, there may not be a lot of advantage to converting to discs... As a friend said of the recently serviced drums on his 57 Chevy: It stops fine. Once |
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Yeah, if they are marginal to begin with they need to be upgraded... I think the expectations on brakes have changed. We drive "on our brakes" as my dad used to say. He was taught to drive by using engine braking and all that. Whenever I drove he was always complaining how much I brake. And I note that since then folks do seem to be braking more than I do... Also I guess the kind of cars I drive were expected to be driven different to how modern traffic uses them. that said I am regularly driving a '71 Ford with a 351 V8, auto, and non-servo drum brakes. its fine so far but I never had to emergency stop it from 75mph behind a BMW! Part of it is the character of an old car. I get that. |
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1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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There's probably something to be said for easily available parts, quite apart form any other arguement.
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I think the expectations on brakes have changed. We drive "on our brakes" as my dad used to say. He was taught to drive by using engine braking and all that. Whenever I drove he was always complaining how much I brake. Using engine goes back to when a most car's brakes were so poor they needed whatever help you could give them. When you were trying to stop 800kg of Morris 8 from a terrifying 40mph the engine braking was doing most of the work. Now brakes are so effective there is no point in changing down through the gearbox as you slow from 70mph to stop at a traffic light. Or for any other reason. I still got over 50,000 miles from a set of pads in an 1800kg automatic estate doing that. |
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Electric vehicles are going back to this, I've got a mach E GT to try for a week, drove 15 miles with it in 1 pedal high regen mode yesterday and never touched the brakes.
My experience (mostly from series Landrovers) is discs are more reliable, don't stop working when you drive through deepish water and don't fade as badly.
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A well designed set of drums is hard to beat. Because they will have 1 or more ( depending on the design) self energizing shoe. Discs do not self energize. Really the main advantage of a disc is that it can dissipate heat a lot better. If the type of driving this car will see won't push the drum system to overheating & fade, there may not be a lot of advantage to converting to discs... As a friend said of the recently serviced drums on his 57 Chevy: It stops fine. OnceIf you don't like them, don't use them. Not looking for an argument here... Its very possible a stock '57 Chevy drum system is not up to the job, and if so they'd need to be upgraded with something that is. ( just like I had to do with the tiny discs on my '72 Capri ) Building a good drum system can be a lot harder these days ( parts availability, etc ), so going with discs may be a a better use of your time and effort ( specially if you cant see them ), it sounds like akku has a plan and I'm not trying to steer him away from that. But inherently, if designed and proportioned right for the car and the type of driving it will see, drums are ( still) a viable option... ( I've got some experience with a 4 wheel drum car on a race track, racing against an identical car with a drum /disc setup , and I've built a setup using early finned aluminum Alfa Romeo drums with the backing plates/ shoes/ etc from a '70s one ton truck for my '28 which had the front drums off a mid '50s 1/2 ton truck before that, etc... But also, I've pushed 4 wheel disc setups to the absolute limit and beyond with fade and total brake failure...) |
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Indeed there's drums and there's drums... Stuff like the Buick filled alloy drums being at the fancy end, the Humber ones probably being toward the other end...
Honestly, a servo would improve the Humber brakes the most notably in daily use, but sometimes we do things because we can... Or to test the "they bolt right on" theory. Although I've less time these days to do things for the heck of it all....
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1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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The Sunbeam Alpine and Talbot 90 were raced and rallied. The big HUmbers also were used in endurance racing but they used the six cylinder Super Snipe for that. 
