bstardchild
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 14,971
Club RR Member Number: 71
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Nov 12, 2022 10:23:39 GMT
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I love these cars. Like you say- underrated. I know you've made your engine choice already but if I had one I think a Jaguar V6 and manual box would be sweet- like what are now often finding homes in mx5s. Nice and light, efficient and smooth. I spotted this one in Oxford a few years ago. I love the style of repairs     I don't know if I like that or not............ I'm torn between thinking brilliant or bodge........... |
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braaap
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,744
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Nov 12, 2022 10:41:40 GMT
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Brilliant bodge?
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Dez
Club Retro Rides Member
And I won't sit down. And I won't shut up. And most of all I will not grow up.
Posts: 11,790
Club RR Member Number: 34
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Nov 12, 2022 11:28:57 GMT
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Will people please stop trying to talk Dez out of using a Windsor engine! I know, what’s all that about huh? I’ve literally already got a 300+hp v8 to go in and people are trying to get me to fit w4nky v6s and diesels 😂 I do despair for people at times. |
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Dez
Club Retro Rides Member
And I won't sit down. And I won't shut up. And most of all I will not grow up.
Posts: 11,790
Club RR Member Number: 34
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Nov 12, 2022 11:31:11 GMT
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I love these cars. Like you say- underrated. I know you've made your engine choice already but if I had one I think a Jaguar V6 and manual box would be sweet- like what are now often finding homes in mx5s. Nice and light, efficient and smooth. I spotted this one in Oxford a few years ago. I love the style of repairs That car is quite well known in scimitar circles. Apparently he hit a tree with it. I kinda like it, I think if that alloy front corner was better made on the compound curve it would actually be really cool. In quite a fan of the understated colour of it too. |
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Dez
Club Retro Rides Member
And I won't sit down. And I won't shut up. And most of all I will not grow up.
Posts: 11,790
Club RR Member Number: 34
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Nov 12, 2022 11:36:16 GMT
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Can vouch for the M57 being an excellent engine, especially with a hybrid and 535d injectors. Might need a different axle at the back mind, depending on torque rating of the Scimitar one and/or ratio. The BMW gearboxes are pretty short (5th is direct drive) so a low ratio diff is needed. Jag IRS will take 500lb-ft or so with a 2.88 diff if you could wedge it in there. Bet there's plenty of strong, low ratio live axles out there too though which might be a little easier. The axle is essently a live axle version of the jag IRS, and is pretty heavy duty. The diff internals are the same 4HA unit (which I think is related to a Dana 44 iirc) and are interchangeable . The axle tubes are super heavy duty 1/4”+ wall thickness and the shafts are heavy as hell. Jensen interceptors used the same axle behind a mopar v8 without issue, 350hp is well within their capabilities. |
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Nov 12, 2022 15:26:51 GMT
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I think the v8 will be perfect, done nicely it will end up as something akin to a smaller lighter Interceptor (and a much much smaller money pit!).
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Nov 12, 2022 16:13:31 GMT
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Are windsor parts still cheap? I remember a set of pistons being cheaper than a 1380 mini set even with the import tax
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Dez
Club Retro Rides Member
And I won't sit down. And I won't shut up. And most of all I will not grow up.
Posts: 11,790
Club RR Member Number: 34
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Nov 12, 2022 17:36:27 GMT
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The bmw gs6-37dz is also plenty strong.. can easily take 700-800nm. Is the six speed box used from the e46 3 series and also in e39, e87, e90 and e60 with the m47 diesel engine. I use one in my Giulia. Cost me 150 euro. Are plenty available since they hardly ever go bad. The gs5-39dz is also cheap and strong but 1:1 in fifth gear so it needs a long rear end. Are these boxes really that strong? I can buy one for £80. I’m finding the gearbox issue the biggest problem so far. I’ve discounted the 350z box as they’re expensive and there’s tons of 350z guys moaning that they’re rubbish and broken. Bmw ones seem the ticket but the numbers for identification are confusing and conflicting. I can’t actually find a 335d box for sale, very few 330 n57 boxes, but tons of n47 ones for pennies which look about the same externally but have different part numbers. Wether that is down to strength or just ratios, I can’t seem to find out. |
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Dez
Club Retro Rides Member
And I won't sit down. And I won't shut up. And most of all I will not grow up.
Posts: 11,790
Club RR Member Number: 34
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Nov 12, 2022 17:39:02 GMT
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Are windsor parts still cheap? I remember a set of pistons being cheaper than a 1380 mini set even with the import tax Depends what you’re comparing them to. They’re not as cheap as sbc but way cheaper than a rover. When I put one in Tony’s fairlane a year or two back more or less everything we had to buy to do it was cheap, but that was pretty much all stuff that was shared with 289/302. There’s odd bits that can catch you out (cams are a lot more expensive than lowlier sizes iirc) but on the whole they’re very good value. |
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Dez
Club Retro Rides Member
And I won't sit down. And I won't shut up. And most of all I will not grow up.
Posts: 11,790
Club RR Member Number: 34
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Nov 12, 2022 17:46:26 GMT
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For a gearbox what about a modern Jaguar S-Type box, the 3.0 and 2.5 manuals had a 5 speed I think and the diesels had a 6 speed. Not sure on ratios but there are still a few abouts as the diesel S-types tend to break their cranks. Same Getrag/ZF boxes as the 330d gearboxes. GS6-53DZ is the one, and is the big brother of the GS6-37DZ. The ratios are a smidge better in the Jag version though (mainly first which is 4.68 vs 5.08 in the BMW). Plenty of people putting 1000nm through them without too much trouble. Not sure if there was a 5-speed version of the diesel box. If there is it'll probably be the same 5-speed as the E39 530d/pre-facelift E46 330d. The petrol versions will probably be the GS6-37BZ. 'BZ' are the petrol gearboxes and 'DZ' the diesel variants. Petrol version tend to have more sensible ratios (although direct drive does tend to be 5th on all of them). Right, that clarifies things a bit. So may replies it’s hard to keep track! I need the gs6-53dz. It’s hard to make out in pics of it’s physically larger or not. Is it the 3 letter codes after that denotes gear ratios? |
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Nov 12, 2022 17:55:01 GMT
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The bmw gs6-37dz is also plenty strong.. can easily take 700-800nm. Is the six speed box used from the e46 3 series and also in e39, e87, e90 and e60 with the m47 diesel engine. I use one in my Giulia. Cost me 150 euro. Are plenty available since they hardly ever go bad. The gs5-39dz is also cheap and strong but 1:1 in fifth gear so it needs a long rear end. Are these boxes really that strong? I can buy one for £80. I’m finding the gearbox issue the biggest problem so far. I’ve discounted the 350z box as they’re expensive and there’s tons of 350z guys moaning that they’re rubbish and broken. Bmw ones seem the ticket but the numbers for identification are confusing and conflicting. I can’t actually find a 335d box for sale, very few 330 n57 boxes, but tons of n47 ones for pennies which look about the same externally but have different part numbers. Wether that is down to strength or just ratios, I can’t seem to find out. They are tough but depending on the origin the ratios can be a bit odd. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZF_S6-53_transmission |
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Proton Jumbuck-deceased :-(
2005 Kia Sorento the parts hauling heap
V8 Humber Hawk
1948 Standard12 pickup SOLD
1953 Pop build (wifey's BIVA build).
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Nov 12, 2022 20:29:21 GMT
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40lz looks good.
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Dez
Club Retro Rides Member
And I won't sit down. And I won't shut up. And most of all I will not grow up.
Posts: 11,790
Club RR Member Number: 34
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Nov 12, 2022 20:42:39 GMT
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Rare and expensive though as z4 only. No reason I can use the cheaper box and compensate with the rear axle ratio given whats available. |
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Nov 12, 2022 20:52:36 GMT
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good thinking . 53bz or the f type maybe ?
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Last Edit: Nov 12, 2022 20:54:02 GMT by ivanhoew
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Nov 12, 2022 20:58:09 GMT
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tall gears would suit a hugely torquey v8 and a light shell
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Dez
Club Retro Rides Member
And I won't sit down. And I won't shut up. And most of all I will not grow up.
Posts: 11,790
Club RR Member Number: 34
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Nov 12, 2022 21:10:46 GMT
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good thinking . 53bz or the f type maybe ? 53dz is the easiest available. I can go as low as 2.88 gears if necessary, and that would sort out the low 1st. |
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Dez
Club Retro Rides Member
And I won't sit down. And I won't shut up. And most of all I will not grow up.
Posts: 11,790
Club RR Member Number: 34
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Nov 12, 2022 21:14:21 GMT
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tall gears would suit a hugely torquey v8 and a light shell Indeed. Iirc an overdrive rear end should have 3.3 gears which is not exactly short. Non-OD is 3.05 or so, and jags have 2.88 if I need it. |
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Nov 12, 2022 21:18:21 GMT
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Re the DZ, Looking at that 5:1 first I think it would be using 2 nd as first and ignoring first all together ?
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Last Edit: Nov 12, 2022 21:20:11 GMT by ivanhoew
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Dez
Club Retro Rides Member
And I won't sit down. And I won't shut up. And most of all I will not grow up.
Posts: 11,790
Club RR Member Number: 34
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Nov 12, 2022 21:39:53 GMT
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Re the DZ, Looking at that 5:1 first I think it would be using 2 nd as first and ignoring first all together ? Makes no sense to do that if I can use the rear axle ratio to shift each gear along a bit. There’s tyre size to factor in as well, I’ve hopefully bought a ridiculous set of wheels but I want them in hand before I decide they’re for this car. |
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Nov 12, 2022 22:38:13 GMT
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The 335d never came with a manual which is probably why you can't find one. The gearbox itself can take the torque, but they melt the dual mass flywheels so no good for an OEM. There are two different sorts of the GS6-53dz, the small-bellhousing E46 variant (also in some X5s I think), and the big-bellhousing variant which I think came in E60s. Not sure what the E90s got. They both bolt up to the same pattern, but the big bellhousing one is deeper and fits a bigger dual mass. You can get solid flywheels from TTV for the small bellhousing (that's the one I have). Haven't seen one for the big-bellhousing. Although I suppose you might be going for a custom flywheel, or something with the Windsor flywheel. GS6-53dz HGD is the code for the big-bellhousing variant. I've got 2.88 gears in the back of my XJ40 with a GS6-53dz with the 5:1 first gear and 255/45 17s. First is definitely usable but it does run out quickly. Enough to leap out of a junction with, but you do find yourself scrabbling for second a bit quickly to actually make some progress. That is with a 5000rpm redline though, so with a few more revs it should be fine. For me, second needs just slightly too much clutch drag to get moving to make it a convincing first gear, but I am trying to get a 1700kg Jag rolling rather than an 1100kg Scimitar. It's also behind a turbodiesel which don't actually make all that much torque off boost, so a big displacement petrol might start easier (provided you don't have a lumpy cam or a paddle clutch). Cruising rpm at 70mph is 2200rpm-ish which is fine for the M57. Treating it as a dogleg 5-speed with an optional towing crawler-gear would probably be a bit of a nicer way to drive it, providing it'll pull away in second fine. What sort of cruising rpm are Windsors happy at? If it's 2700-3000rpm or so, depending on your tyre size, then a 3.54 would still take you to 150mph-ish and help you start in 2nd easily. Although cruising at 2200 might help with the fuel bills  |
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Last Edit: Nov 12, 2022 22:42:53 GMT by biturbo228
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