nze12
Part of things
Posts: 193
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Oct 13, 2023 15:34:51 GMT
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Vacuum chambers are used for making sure the air wants to escape the voids. Modest vacuum pumps are fairly cheap and the big tins they use for the task aren't that bad either. Helps for casting even the runny stuff. This works particularly well for moulding/casting compounds that require vigorous mixing that produces a lot of air bubbles.
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1986 BMW E30 refreshed to original spec 1973 BMW E12 520 converting to Motorsport 530 1982 XJS V12 converting to 5 speed manual
Many landscaping projects overriding above!
Cogito cogito ergo cogito sum!
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gazzam
Part of things
Posts: 740
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Oct 13, 2023 18:28:24 GMT
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Thanks Nick, I didn’t know that stuff existed. Of course it’s a real rabbit hole when you start looking for it! I think this stuff might work. (Don’t know how to post a link.) I think I read that it has a hardness of 75 kilotonnes or whatever, but sets too fast to use vacuum. Can be tinted (again - I think) I'll ring them on Monday. Or it might be worth ringing one of the suspension bush mfgers - they might sell me a litre. Or not. Most likely 'nah mate, we don’t do that'
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jimi
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,223
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Oct 13, 2023 22:04:40 GMT
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I think you'll find that stuff is too hard, no "give"/flex. Polyurethane bushes are in the region of 65/70 shore, if you want more "give"/flex look for something around 60 shore ( shore is a hardness measurement, lower = softer) try searching for PU potting kits, RS Components used to stock kits of various hardness. I repotted one of my engine mounts using a silicon compound to stiffen it up IIRC it was around 60 shore, the stuff I used was this
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Last Edit: Oct 13, 2023 22:07:29 GMT by jimi
Black is not a colour ! .... Its the absence of colour
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gazzam
Part of things
Posts: 740
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Hi jimi, duro and shore appear to be the same thing, correct me if that’s wrong. Superpro suspension has a vid on their site talking about hardness of their polyurethane bushes and they start at 70 duro then go to 80 and 90. If duro and shore are the same, surely 75 wouldn’t be too hard for bump stops? I forgot to get the name of the Wurth product I used , but I reckon it’s pretty much the same stuff as that Unibond you used. I’ve yet to look at RS Components. Thanks, Garry
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Oct 15, 2023 17:04:48 GMT
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There are 2 scales widely used for measuring hardness in softer materials, Shore A and Shore D, Shore A is for elastomeric materials and what I imagine all the bush manufacturers quote, Shore D is used for harder plastics. A durometer is the tool used to measure hardness, I'd imagine anyone quoting duro is reading a durometer which would should be the Shore A type for an elastomer.
Metals use different methods too, the most common ones being Brinnel, Vickers, or Rockwell for minerals I think they use Mohs.
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gazzam
Part of things
Posts: 740
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Slow progress on the Triumph over the last couple of days, I’ve been giving the workshop a much needed cleanup. It makes such a difference, just a much nicer place to be. I don’t know why I leave it so long, at my age you'd reckon I’d know better! Anyway the rear axle is just about finished. Had a bit of a faff working out how the pivot bearing for the handbrake went back together. I’m confident it’s correct now, but it’s definitely not the way it was. This brass bit is what I mean. It was assembled with that recess against the backing plate. That didn’t make much sense, and the bolts used were too short. So I trimmed the heads on a couple of longer bolts and that got the threads in contact with the nylon in the locknut. One of the bolts had a split pin hole, so they may have had a thin nut and a split pin to prevent it coming off. Probably more likely than a nyloc in 1948? Very difficult to find info on these cars for details like this. Before and after. The front end is also nearly done. I need bushes for the shock links and dust-covers for the tie rod ball joints. The tie rods etc are just loosely bolted up to keep the front wheels in line when I push it about. Another before and after. Thanks.
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teaboy
Posted a lot
Make tea, not war.
Posts: 2,125
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It’s like brand new, Gazza.
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gazzam
Part of things
Posts: 740
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Thanks Tea. I started looking for a 5 speed gearbox. Found one which I thought might be just the ticket. Fifth gear ratio and price wise. And found a spec sheet which included this drawing. So I got all excited and pulled the gearbox off the engine. It was next on my to do list anyway. I put it on the bench to take some measurements. That’s when the trouble started… It’s not going to fit without major mods. The yellow circle in this shot shows where the crossmember sits. And the distance from the front of the box to the mount bolts. The input shafts are almost the same distance from the bottom on both boxes. Because the proposed box is pretty much flat on the bottom and the mounts are almost 200mm further towards the back, that crossmember either has to go down a bit over 100mm (not an option - it'd be too low due to its thickness) or it has to go back about 200mm. Which would be ok body wise ( I’m pretty sure ) but a big job. And obvs it’s all just been painted. I knew I'd have to mod the gearbox mount, but I never considered moving the crossmember. All the other boxes I’ve been able to find so far seen to have much the same profile. I suppose it’s down to packaging in a modern vehicle. That space is wasted underneath. Mind you the new ones do seem huge for just one more gear. So I’m not sure which way to go atm. Maybe I’m back to looking at the diff. If anyone knows of a suitable box, let me know. I’ve never done anything like that sort of change and I admit I was looking forward to it. Thanks.
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MX5 box is pretty compact and strong, it will look like you have a big lump on the RHS but that is for mounting frame which goes to the diff on a mx5 and can be cut off.
Theres also suzuki boxes which are tiny not sure how much torque they are capable of vs how much you are making though.
The one which looks closest to the original is the ford type 9 with the short input shaft but they are getting pretty thin on the ground here now.
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Last Edit: Oct 17, 2023 8:32:21 GMT by kevins
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glenanderson
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,353
Club RR Member Number: 64
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Oct 17, 2023 10:28:25 GMT
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I have seen Laycock type overdrive units mounted remotely, between the gearbox and the rear axle. I have no doubt that as a solution it would be expensive, and obviously requires enough space to fit it, but would certainly give the desired effect whilst also retaining the “much modified, but still original” ethos you began by boosting the original engine rather than just replacing it.
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My worst worry about dying is my wife selling my stuff for what I told her it cost...
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nze12
Part of things
Posts: 193
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Oct 17, 2023 23:16:00 GMT
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Have you considered the Borg Warner T5? As is the case with NZ, there are gazillions of them in Oz. They come with a wide variety of tail shaft housings that can accommodate a number of combinations and permutations for mounting. Also it is possible to adapt from electronic speedo output to mechanical and there are a number of variations on gear ratios. I'm stitching one into my '82 XJS, using the Mustang tail housing to align the gearstick nicely within the cabin. I managed to do a minimal mod to the existing Jaguar gearbox crossmember to accommodate the T5 mount. Note too it separates from the bellhousing which may mean you could adapt one to your existing bellhousing. 50% of the internet is articles on the T5! Interesting site... malwoodauto.com.au/t5-extension-housing-kits/HTH K.
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Last Edit: Oct 17, 2023 23:17:41 GMT by nze12
1986 BMW E30 refreshed to original spec 1973 BMW E12 520 converting to Motorsport 530 1982 XJS V12 converting to 5 speed manual
Many landscaping projects overriding above!
Cogito cogito ergo cogito sum!
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gazzam
Part of things
Posts: 740
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Good thinking Glen, I emailed a company in Britain and fully expect I should be seated when I read their reply! But it is a very elegant solution, I agree. You definitely have the advantage on things like this. They are pretty much unknown here. Not sure I’m up for what it will likely cost though.
I started looking into T5s, K. There seems to be potential with the shape, though I haven’t found a dimension drawing yet. And there seems to be a few about, so there’s a bit of hope. Thanks for pointing them out.
I'll start tidying up the engine tomorrow as I look further into the T5.
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glenanderson
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,353
Club RR Member Number: 64
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We might have an advantage when it comes to some things, but I still think your advantage of a climate that means you still have cars to bolt stuff to, rather than piles of festering rust, means that overall you antipodeans are the winners. 🤣
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My worst worry about dying is my wife selling my stuff for what I told her it cost...
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gazzam
Part of things
Posts: 740
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Oct 18, 2023 10:24:17 GMT
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Thanks Westbay. Exactly what I need. I still have my box on the bench, so I’ll compare measurements.
No doubt about it, Glen.
I think I’d cry if the underside of my car looked like some of the pics I’ve seen of some of the ones from there!
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Last Edit: Oct 18, 2023 10:26:26 GMT by gazzam
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jamesd1972
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,921
Club RR Member Number: 40
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Oct 18, 2023 11:06:50 GMT
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Thanks Westbay. Exactly what I need. I still have my box on the bench, so I’ll compare measurements. No doubt about it, Glen. I think I’d cry if the underside of my car looked like some of the pics I’ve seen of some of the ones from there! I think the reverse is equally true when some people over here see how good your stuff is ! Nice thread, thanks for the updates. James
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nze12
Part of things
Posts: 193
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Oct 18, 2023 20:05:59 GMT
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As I mentioned before, there is a wide variance of layouts. Also to note is the 2 mounting face options, "Chevy" and "Ford". Ironically a number of Commodores on our side of the ditch use the Ford mounting but a longer input shaft compared to the Falcon. Cheers Ken.
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Last Edit: Oct 18, 2023 20:08:59 GMT by nze12
1986 BMW E30 refreshed to original spec 1973 BMW E12 520 converting to Motorsport 530 1982 XJS V12 converting to 5 speed manual
Many landscaping projects overriding above!
Cogito cogito ergo cogito sum!
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gazzam
Part of things
Posts: 740
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Cheers James. Thanks Ken, it looks as though it will fit. I can’t be 100% sure as the dimensions on both the above drawings are not complete. The length of the actual gearbox section for instance. And the height of the input shaft. And I’m not finding that they’re that plentiful. Apparently popular with people converting autos in Commodores and Falcons. But they are around. And it might be possible to use the Triumph bellhousing with a plate between it and the box. Started on the engine. While I still had the flywheel on it, I gave it a compression test. So that’s encouraging. Stripped a few of the ancillaries of the motor and got it on the engine stand. Cleaning has commenced. Just for interest, I marked a rear tyre and the yoke on the diff and rolled it one revolution of the tyre. The yoke turned 4.7 times! A real stump puller. Thanks.
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Last Edit: Oct 19, 2023 7:28:41 GMT by gazzam
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Oct 19, 2023 18:51:53 GMT
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T5 is a decent option if you can find one in the right form at a sensible price. If you can adapt the original bell housing to fit on the box that’ll save heap of work.
I think I suggested before that the 4 speed plus overdrive from the Triumph 2000/2500/TR6 might be worth a look purely because there might be enough family resemblance that it would bolt up to your engine? Also it ought to be possible to find one. Possibly the bulk of the OD unit and it’s position creates the same problems as the modern 5 speeds though? Early ones have A type OD which is quite bulky but later J-type a bit less so.
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1967 Triumph Vitesse convertible (old friend) 1996 Audi A6 2.5 TDI Avant (still durability testing) 1972 GT6 Mk3 (Restored after loong rest & getting the hang of being a car again)
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Oct 19, 2023 19:09:37 GMT
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a mgb one might work to, it has a slender bit between the gearbox and overdrive which will be in the area of the crossmember.
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