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Feb 21, 2022 15:56:31 GMT
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First of all I am sorry if this question is for a car that is just a tad new for this forum... I am happy for the post/thread to be removed if necessary...
My daily hack has just died, a 2007 ('07 plate) model E81 BMW 118i SE... It has given sterling service until just a few weeks ago.
It got towed back to BMW who did some outstanding recalls (I've never known a car to have so many recalls!!!) but to look further into the problem I have they wanted a lot of money... I don't have a lot of money!
They suggested that the timing chain might be broken as when I try to start the car there is a really very high pitched mechanical sound emanating from the engine bay region!
Strangely though, as the car was being towed today the engine would start when I selected a gear and released the clutch. The engine ran fine... Strangely though the engine would not rev when I mashed the accelerator.
Any thoughts???!!!
It is all very odd...
No worries if you cannot think what this weirdness could be (I'm just tight and would like to save a few small pennies)...
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Last Edit: Feb 22, 2022 12:23:12 GMT by grifterkid
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Feb 21, 2022 16:07:03 GMT
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never heard of a 119i, guessing its a 118 or 120 ?
if a timing chain issue was suspected I certainly would not have attempted a tow startz thats a sure fire way to render the engine scrap!
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Feb 21, 2022 16:29:14 GMT
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never heard of a 119i, guessing its a 118 or 120 ? if a timing chain issue was suspected I certainly would not have attempted a tow startz thats a sure fire way to render the engine scrap! Sorry about the 119 typo, I blame my fat fingers (it is a 118i)!!! I actually started the car by mistake... I didn't realise it was in gear! But start it did. I couldn't be sure as none of the dials were working (dead battery) but as I changed gear I could hear the engine note change... My only guess is an electrical malady or some such!! I just wish I knew (and wish I knew not to have to spend so much money!) |
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Davey
Posted a lot
Resident Tyre Nerd.
Posts: 2,188
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Feb 21, 2022 16:34:24 GMT
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If it starts then the chain isn't broken.
To be honest this generation isn't bad for chains. its the newer ones that have the issue (Unfortunately I own one...)
Does it turnover on the starter?
If not this might be a good place to start, high pitched noise could very well be a dead starter.
The fact you can bump start it makes me think it is 100% not terminal.
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K11 Micra x3 - Mk3 astra - Seat Marbella - Mk6 Escort estate - B5 Passat - Alfa 156 estate - E36 compact
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Feb 21, 2022 16:49:09 GMT
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If it starts then the chain isn't broken. To be honest this generation isn't bad for chains. its the newer ones that have the issue (Unfortunately I own one...) Does it turnover on the starter? If not this might be a good place to start, high pitched noise could very well be a dead starter. The fact you can bump start it makes me think it is 100% not terminal. It's funny you say that as I thought starter as well as soon as I heard the engine whirring... It is just odd that when it was running no dials were working and the engine would not rev either (the battery is completely dead though after the dash board did a warning light disco)!! I might try and bung a new starter on just to see if that is the problem and if it's not I imagine it's something a little bit deeper! If it's not meant to be it's just not meant to be...!!! It's an old motor that may have just done its last journey... |
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Davey
Posted a lot
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Feb 21, 2022 16:53:51 GMT
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They are a strange thing.
If the battery was dead they limit accessories that turn on until its at a decent level of charge.
Its also going to flag every fault code under the sun, so you will need to clear those before you panic that its something else as well.
As soon as you remove batteries on modernish BMW's they have a hissy fit.
I would get the battery charged, see if the car turns over or not.
If it doesn't and it makes the squealing noise. Sounds like a dead starter.
Whatever BMW dealership told you it was a timing chain need some new technicians...
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K11 Micra x3 - Mk3 astra - Seat Marbella - Mk6 Escort estate - B5 Passat - Alfa 156 estate - E36 compact
Mk2 MR2 T-bar - E46 328i - Skoda Superb - Fiat seicento - 6n2 Polo - 6n polo 1.6 - Mk1 GS300
EU8 civic type S - MG ZT cdti - R56 MINI Cooper S - Audi A3 8p - Jaguar XF (X250) - FN2 Civic Type R - Mk2 2.0i Ford Focus
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Feb 22, 2022 10:10:08 GMT
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They would not even offer me a little tiny bit of knowledge or a possible cause of death/illness without gracing their palms with £125 worth of silver for a stage 1 diagnostic check!!
The timing chain thing came up briefly when I showed them what sound it was making when it would not turn over (I did have a new one fitted about 5 years ago though under the advice of another BMW dealership when they had the engine in pieces to fit yet another new set of injectors!!!!)...
I appreciate that they are true professionals and they are highly skilled at what they do (I certainly couldn't do it!) but all I asked for was a 'possible' or a 'maybe' as to why my car is frapped!
Anyhow, I will get the battery disconnected, fully charged (it is fully dead!) and see what occurs...
Thank you for all your advice so far folks.
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Feb 22, 2022 11:04:31 GMT
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What was the original problem that caused it to go to the garage in the first place?
As an aside, I know it's frustrating when mechanics seemingly don't want to 'just give us a clue', but I think you have to bear in mind the wide variety of people they deal with; some reasonable, some (really, really) not. They don't know you, and whilst you may well take their advice with a pinch of salt, someone else will take it as gospel and cause all sorts of grief if it's not 100% right...which without even a basic diagnostic is just not worth the risk for them.
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Davey
Posted a lot
Resident Tyre Nerd.
Posts: 2,188
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Feb 22, 2022 11:05:23 GMT
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They would not even offer me a little tiny bit of knowledge or a possible cause of death/illness without gracing their palms with £125 worth of silver for a stage 1 diagnostic check!! The timing chain thing came up briefly when I showed them what sound it was making when it would not turn over (I did have a new one fitted about 5 years ago though under the advice of another BMW dealership when they had the engine in pieces to fit yet another new set of injectors!!!!)... I appreciate that they are true professionals and they are highly skilled at what they do (I certainly couldn't do it!) but all I asked for was a 'possible' or a 'maybe' as to why my car is frapped! Anyhow, I will get the battery disconnected, fully charged (it is fully dead!) and see what occurs... Thank you for all your advice so far folks. The fact you've outlined it wont turn over and squeals is shouting starter. Having worked alongside some BMW technicians, there are definitely levels of expertise that vary dramatically. But some are very skilled. Let us know how it goes. Looks like it might be an inlet manifold off job to replace annoyingly. |
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K11 Micra x3 - Mk3 astra - Seat Marbella - Mk6 Escort estate - B5 Passat - Alfa 156 estate - E36 compact
Mk2 MR2 T-bar - E46 328i - Skoda Superb - Fiat seicento - 6n2 Polo - 6n polo 1.6 - Mk1 GS300
EU8 civic type S - MG ZT cdti - R56 MINI Cooper S - Audi A3 8p - Jaguar XF (X250) - FN2 Civic Type R - Mk2 2.0i Ford Focus
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Feb 22, 2022 11:34:07 GMT
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Can I suggest you get link for your phone (iOS and Andriod version available) about £30 and a suitable OBDII adaptor, about £50ish, but, MUST be 'Bimmerlink' compatible ... It will allow you to read / clear your error codes and register your battery with 'the system' plus a boat load of other fetures ... |
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Last Edit: Feb 22, 2022 12:12:21 GMT by westbay
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Feb 22, 2022 12:22:20 GMT
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What was the original problem that caused it to go to the garage in the first place? As an aside, I know it's frustrating when mechanics seemingly don't want to 'just give us a clue', but I think you have to bear in mind the wide variety of people they deal with; some reasonable, some (really, really) not. They don't know you, and whilst you may well take their advice with a pinch of salt, someone else will take it as gospel and cause all sorts of grief if it's not 100% right...which without even a basic diagnostic is just not worth the risk for them. I was driving along the motorway, quite normally and I wasn't even gunning it as I am increasingly gentle to this car as I appreciate it is on its last wheels... Then, I had to answer the call of nature so pulled over in a parking layby at the side of the motorway. I turned the car off (did what I had to do!!!) then when I went to start it again that's when I get this high pitched sounding metallic noise and the car won't start 'on the button' as it were... It was very odd as when I turned the car off the stop/start light flashed up on the middle of the dashboard which is a function of this particular car that has not worked in quite some time! To be honest, the car has become increasingly hard to start over the last 8-10 months (i.e it churns and churns before firing) but this new dimension really is new to the car and its litany of issues (it's old, battered and poorly looked after if I'm honest but it refused to give up and I loved it for that!!) Anyhow, BMW did recover the car and it went to my nearest BMW dealership... They sorted out the outstanding recalls which was good of them and then I hit a brick wall with regards to getting a snippet of advice. That all being said they were very polite and courteous which goes a long way these days!! It was reassuring to hear the engine running again (when I sprang it off the clutch whilst being towed) but it was mighty confusing to note that nothing else was working at all!!!!! |
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Feb 22, 2022 12:31:14 GMT
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Somewhere there is a 'fuseable link' ... should be around the battery somewhere, which may have blown if the starter is/was bu**ered ...
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Last Edit: Feb 22, 2022 13:44:48 GMT by westbay
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rodharris83
Club Retro Rides Member
Day Dreamer...
Posts: 759
Club RR Member Number: 4
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Feb 22, 2022 13:09:17 GMT
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Looks like this is quite a common problem (with various solutions): link |
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Feb 22, 2022 13:39:26 GMT
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Thanks for the link, that made for very interesting reading...
I doubt it is the clutch (or clutch sensor etc...) purely because of how different the engine (or items relating to the engine but not working!!!) sounded after it last carried its own weight!!
My car tries to start (or it did until the battery went completely flat), it just won't!
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Feb 22, 2022 14:02:25 GMT
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I was driving along the motorway, quite normally and I wasn't even gunning it as I am increasingly gentle to this car as I appreciate it is on its last wheels... Then, I had to answer the call of nature so pulled over in a parking layby at the side of the motorway. I turned the car off (did what I had to do!!!) then when I went to start it again that's when I get this high pitched sounding metallic noise and the car won't start 'on the button' as it were... OK so it was running but had become more and more difficult to start, then after a motorway cruise it refused to start and made a high-pitched screeching noise. A tow-start got it going but none of the instruments were working properly. The non-working instruments could well be a flat/malfunctioning battery problem, as most moderns are very, very picky about the battery being in tip-top shape. As to the non-starting...does the 1-series have a DMF by any chance? Has it been replaced on your car? I ask because hard-to-start/noisy starter followed by non-starting are symptoms of a DMF breaking down. It often reveals itself initially by clogging up the starter with little bits of rubber and metal that are shed from the DMF, causing the it to malfunction. Might be worth pulling the starter and examining it for contamination. If it is the DMF, they can be really expensive  |
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Feb 22, 2022 14:16:40 GMT
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I was driving along the motorway, quite normally and I wasn't even gunning it as I am increasingly gentle to this car as I appreciate it is on its last wheels... Then, I had to answer the call of nature so pulled over in a parking layby at the side of the motorway. I turned the car off (did what I had to do!!!) then when I went to start it again that's when I get this high pitched sounding metallic noise and the car won't start 'on the button' as it were... OK so it was running but had become more and more difficult to start, then after a motorway cruise it refused to start and made a high-pitched screeching noise. A tow-start got it going but none of the instruments were working properly. The non-working instruments could well be a flat/malfunctioning battery problem, as most moderns are very, very picky about the battery being in tip-top shape. As to the non-starting...does the 1-series have a DMF by any chance? Has it been replaced on your car? I ask because hard-to-start/noisy starter followed by non-starting are symptoms of a DMF breaking down. It often reveals itself initially by clogging up the starter with little bits of rubber and metal that are shed from the DMF, causing the it to malfunction. Might be worth pulling the starter and examining it for contamination. If it is the DMF, they can be really expensive Thanks for the advice... May I please ask what a DMF is??!! Sorry, I am a bit of a mechanical simpleton to say the very least! |
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Davey
Posted a lot
Resident Tyre Nerd.
Posts: 2,188
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Feb 22, 2022 14:43:00 GMT
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They do have a Dual mass and this had completely slipped my mind as they like to make all kinds of lovely noises...
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K11 Micra x3 - Mk3 astra - Seat Marbella - Mk6 Escort estate - B5 Passat - Alfa 156 estate - E36 compact
Mk2 MR2 T-bar - E46 328i - Skoda Superb - Fiat seicento - 6n2 Polo - 6n polo 1.6 - Mk1 GS300
EU8 civic type S - MG ZT cdti - R56 MINI Cooper S - Audi A3 8p - Jaguar XF (X250) - FN2 Civic Type R - Mk2 2.0i Ford Focus
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Feb 22, 2022 14:47:39 GMT
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DMF = Dual Mass Flywheel. It's a rotary shock absorber consisting of springs and rubber that goes inside the flywheel, rather than just the simple solid metal flywheel of old. They were invented to decrease the harshness of diesels, but have found their way into almost all cars now. They can be a real PITA as they are considered wear items (like brake pads and tyres), that are expected to be replaced at some point. They are rarely covered on warranties and are expensive to buy and expensive to fit (ask me how I know ). |
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Last Edit: Feb 22, 2022 14:49:21 GMT by daklone: spooling mistrikes
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Davey
Posted a lot
Resident Tyre Nerd.
Posts: 2,188
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Feb 22, 2022 14:52:03 GMT
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DMF = Dual Mass Flywheel. It's a rotary shock absorber consisting of springs and rubber that goes inside the flywheel, rather than just the simple solid metal flywheel of old. They were invented to decrease the harshness of diesels, but have found their way into almost all cars now. They can be a real PITA as they are considered wear items (like brake pads and tyres), that are expected to be replaced at some point. They are rarely covered on warranties and are expensive to buy and expensive to fit (ask me how I know ). Solid conversions can be cheaper, but you do hear stories of broken cranks etc due to the lack of shock absorption. |
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K11 Micra x3 - Mk3 astra - Seat Marbella - Mk6 Escort estate - B5 Passat - Alfa 156 estate - E36 compact
Mk2 MR2 T-bar - E46 328i - Skoda Superb - Fiat seicento - 6n2 Polo - 6n polo 1.6 - Mk1 GS300
EU8 civic type S - MG ZT cdti - R56 MINI Cooper S - Audi A3 8p - Jaguar XF (X250) - FN2 Civic Type R - Mk2 2.0i Ford Focus
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Feb 23, 2022 10:36:55 GMT
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Blimey this all sounds very expensive (as I had first thought anyway)...!!
With regards to the DMF will the engine still run if it is completely rolloxed??!!
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