lightyearman
Part of things
GYJDM - Grimsby based Japanese car club - Find us on Facebook
Posts: 639
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I'll start off by saying that this pipe dream of mine to set up a garage / workshop is something that's been slowly evolving for a while and whilst I don't want to jinx anything (and i'm touching all available wood right now) I'm coming to a position where ill be moving into a premises away from my garden workshop and possibly taking advantage of a grant to get set up with new tooling and equipment. I've got a wishlist I keep altering and tweaking, with a few things i'm certain on and others i'm not so sure about. It occurred to me I should harness the lovely hive-mind of RR and draw from your collective wisdom Inspection ramp / lift I'm only going to have room for one. Would you recommend a 4 poster drive-on affair with a hydraulic lifting bar to bring front or rear wheel off the ground or should I be going for a 2 post lift that leaves the wheels free? Tyre machine & wheel balancer I really have no clue at all here but if i'm going to want one in the future I might as well get one now. Plus i'm always getting asked if I have one now so I imagine it would get fair use. Mig welding setup I'm pretty rusty so i'd like something that will flatter me and be a bit future proof / adaptable. For example, I need to be able to weld thin plate right through to heavy box section (sills to hefty roofracks etc) Pillar drill It will probably get a fair bit if use. With equipment like this am I best off looking for something old and industrial or buying new. Engine crane, engine stand, gearbox stand / lift etc I've historically just gone to machine mart and bought Clarke bits and bobs for these but given a better budget and an expected increase in use, what are folks using? Cordless power tools I've always used Makita stuff and so have most of my friends. Should I stick wwith the devil I know or, as i'm thinking of buying a pack or set should I consider something else? There seems to be a lot of passing fad and fashion with these things, Milwaukee seems to be the hot product the past couple of years. Pros and cons? Wall / bench mounted spring compressor If you aren't scared or at least respectful of spring compressors, you are brave or foolish. Ive only ever used the loos death trap type. Ideas welcome Racking / benches / storage solutions any ideas and examples welcome Band saw I'm thinking of a band saw or something for cutting tube and box section. Like the pillar drill, should I look for something old and industrial? I know this is a strange post and I've probably made it sound like I have no clue what i'm doing but that isn't (entirely) true... I'm in constant flux between being as excited as a kid at Christmas and being bloody anxious, but if I said no to this opportunity i'd always wonder and regret not giving it a go. The mainstay of my work will be on vans - VW Transporter, Vivaro, Traffic sort of size and weight. Absolutely any suggestions, pictures of your workshops, advice, shaming, whatever - I appreciate it Cheers
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'89 Honda CRX siR Glassroof Flint black fully restored track beasty '90 Nissan S13 Pignose - pass the mig wire '86 Mini - matt orange, 13" Wellers, Project 2018 '97 LDV Convoy home built camper/tramper van '04 Saab 9-5 Aero HOT. Anyone want it? '91 Honda VFR400 NC30 17,000 km from new '87 Honda XR80 4 stroke baby crosser '03 Mini Cooper S - honestly, they are fun... '15 VW T5.1 LWB daily brick
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cb11acd
Part of things
Posts: 132
Club RR Member Number: 122
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Oct 15, 2020 10:16:34 GMT
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Most of that I can't help with. Bandsaw though I would look at Femi. Stakesys is the supplier in the UK and I haven't heard a single bad word about them. They do anything from portable ones to industrial. I have used their cheapest one SN105XL and it was pretty good. I would look for one that you can set and forget though. www.stakesys.co.uk/metal-cutting-bandsaws/portable-sawsInfact anything from them is good quality, not the cheapest but you get what you pay for.
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Oct 15, 2020 10:47:12 GMT
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I'd be looking at getting a hydraulic press to help with bearings. Friend of mine has a basic Clarke one and says it has saved him SO much time and faffing. Can't help with industrial make recommendations though.
What about little things such as basic hand tools such as punches hammers etc? Can I presume that you're already well stocked?
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Oct 15, 2020 23:27:41 GMT
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I'll start off by saying that this pipe dream of mine to set up a garage / workshop is something that's been slowly evolving for a while and whilst I don't want to jinx anything (and i'm touching all available wood right now) I'm coming to a position where ill be moving into a premises away from my garden workshop and possibly taking advantage of a grant to get set up with new tooling and equipment. I've got a wishlist I keep altering and tweaking, with a few things i'm certain on and others i'm not so sure about. It occurred to me I should harness the lovely hive-mind of RR and draw from your collective wisdom Inspection ramp / lift I'm only going to have room for one. Would you recommend a 4 poster drive-on affair with a hydraulic lifting bar to bring front or rear wheel off the ground or should I be going for a 2 post lift that leaves the wheels free? Tyre machine & wheel balancer I really have no clue at all here but if i'm going to want one in the future I might as well get one now. Plus i'm always getting asked if I have one now so I imagine it would get fair use. Mig welding setup I'm pretty rusty so i'd like something that will flatter me and be a bit future proof / adaptable. For example, I need to be able to weld thin plate right through to heavy box section (sills to hefty roofracks etc) Pillar drill It will probably get a fair bit if use. With equipment like this am I best off looking for something old and industrial or buying new. Engine crane, engine stand, gearbox stand / lift etc I've historically just gone to machine mart and bought Clarke bits and bobs for these but given a better budget and an expected increase in use, what are folks using? Cordless power tools I've always used Makita stuff and so have most of my friends. Should I stick wwith the devil I know or, as i'm thinking of buying a pack or set should I consider something else? There seems to be a lot of passing fad and fashion with these things, Milwaukee seems to be the hot product the past couple of years. Pros and cons? Wall / bench mounted spring compressor If you aren't scared or at least respectful of spring compressors, you are brave or foolish. Ive only ever used the loos death trap type. Ideas welcome Racking / benches / storage solutions any ideas and examples welcome Band saw I'm thinking of a band saw or something for cutting tube and box section. Like the pillar drill, should I look for something old and industrial? I know this is a strange post and I've probably made it sound like I have no clue what i'm doing but that isn't (entirely) true... I'm in constant flux between being as excited as a kid at Christmas and being bloody anxious, but if I said no to this opportunity i'd always wonder and regret not giving it a go. The mainstay of my work will be on vans - VW Transporter, Vivaro, Traffic sort of size and weight. Absolutely any suggestions, pictures of your workshops, advice, shaming, whatever - I appreciate it Cheers I hope I can help. I run a business that I started 9 years ago breaking cars in a cheap unit on an old farm, now I employ 6 people with 2 premises, one ELV dismantling site and the other restoration and servicing. I always wanted to work for myself but never knew what exactly. I would never go back to employment, and I still love going to work on a Monday morning. This is the answer to the first question - what are you going to be working on? This will determine the answers to many of your questions. Don't get side-tracked by things you don't need to worry about. For example, I STILL don't have a bearing press. I don't need one. We simply just don't get asked to do bearings. You probably will - but you probably won't get asked to do the same kind of bodywork we do, so you won't need all those tools. Just plan for your immediate market - you can buy other tools along the way. Inspection ramp / liftIf you are doing vans, a 4 ton two-poster is what you will need if you can only have one lift. Get one with all the adjusters and raisers so you can get behind the sills to the jacking points. Four poster is a bit of a faff for doing suspension and wheel/brake work which will be a good proportion of your work when doing current-ish vans. Tyre machine & wheel balancerOnly if you expect to do a lot of tyres. Most people just go direct to the tyre retailer. You might like to have a tyre machine for yourself, but a balancer is probably an unnecessary expense. Unless you plan on stocking tyres - at least with vans there is a smaller range you'd have to carry, but getting into tyres properly can be an expensive game. If you do get one, get a used one, one of the known brands like Corghi - so that you can get spares and someone to service it. Cheap machines are useless once they break and there's no parts available. I'm suggesting a used one as you probably wont have the workload to justify the cost of a new machine. Mig welding setupDon't offer too much or the next thing you know you'll be knee deep in Mk5 Transits with no sills. We use a SIP machine that cost £400-odd and has a big Argon/CO2 bottle hanging off the back of it. Does bodywork (1mm) up to 6mm and can do 10mm if needed - great machine. Other brands are out there - as they're really not all that dear relatively, I'd recommend new so that you're not buying into someone else's problems. Pillar drillQuestion is, will it be used? If so, an old industrial one is the ticket. They're just 100 times nicer than anything new. Engine crane, engine stand, gearbox stand / lift etcClarke is fine. There's no reason to overthink any of this stuff, it just needs to function. I couldn't even tell you what brand our stands are, probably a mix of Sealey and Clarke and whatever other brands look like them because they all sell the same stuff in a different box, with their sticker on it. Seriously, it's all the same stuff. Just pick the ones you like the colour of best. If you can find some s/h on gumtree, get those, because your shiny new ones will look the same in 6 months anyhow. Change all the bolts in your engine crane to higher grade ones, just for extra peace of mind, if you feel like you want to be a little bit more precautious. Cordless power toolsMilwaukee, DeWalt and Makita are all ones that people hold to high regard. Not sure there's any definitive "best" one - we got started on Milwaukee and just stuck with as there's a dealer local and we're into the battery swapping cycle now where I can buy a new machine and not need a whole new infrastructure. If you're already on Makita, just stick with. Wall / bench mounted spring compressorDefinitely going to need the biggest you can find when doing van stuff. I just bought a used one off a friend that replaced his in his garage. Don't be afraid to brace and re-weld anything on this that looks suspect as sometimes the welding on them gets weakened / wasn't the best to start with. Don't forget it just needs to be functional, not pretty, and they're all the same bit of metal from the same Chinese factory, in a different colour. Racking / benches / storage solutionsStraight to Gumtree/Facebook, find used stuff. New shelving will bankrupt you before you even open. The nature of your business means they'll be battered within a few months - but also means you can buy the pre-battered stuff that nobody else wants to. Watch out for bargains and jump on them as soon as you spot them. Scour the auctions for used workbenches - they just built them sturdier in the olden days. Or make your own. Nothing you buy new will ever satisfy you, it's all complete flimsy junk. Band sawExtremely expensive. Ponder why you need one at all. Perhaps a decent chop-saw or even a grinder will do? That's a tool for an engineering works and anything other than a saw that weighs as much as the forklift it needs to lift it will just break immediately and be useless for heavy metal. You'll be spending many monies if you don't want junk that you can't buy blades for anyway. Most mechanics I know just gather up tools as they go and have done since starting out. Getting tooled up with the essentials is a great idea but don't over-reach and buy equipment you may never get the use out of. Of course if you are getting a start-up grant, just buy everything you possibly can! but then you'll have to buy new to show receipts so you can't get the better old stuff. I'd advise also looking for a high quality floor jack with a good high reach, a decent box of impact sockets in the big sizes (20-40mm, maybe bigger, for hub nuts and so on) and an injector puller if you're going to work on Renaults. Lots of lighting (head-torches or hand-held, whatever works for you) and a good multimeter for figuring out why the Citroens wipers wont switch off, and plenty of solder joints and replacement electrical connectors for doing the rear lights on the Fords. Don't forget about a container for your old oil (a 1000L IBC is the usual solution) but also something to store your old oil filters if you want to stay within regulations. You'll also need a space to throw your old brake and clutch discs, a nice big metal pile, but it's unsightly if that's at the door so find somewhere tidy and obscured. Well that's half an hour of my time, that'll be £25 please Set your hourly rate and stick to it. Don't work for free or you'll soon not be working at all.
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melle
South West
It'll come out in the wash.
Posts: 1,981
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Oct 16, 2020 21:42:59 GMT
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I can highly recommend Compac jacks. They also do axle stands, bearing presses, engine cranes etc., all top notch quality but not cheap.
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www.saabv4.com'70 Saab 96 V4 "The Devil's Own V4" '77 Saab 95 V4 van conversion project '88 Saab 900i 8V
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Don't forget some kind of heating and decent security/ fire extinguishers. Check you have the length to get the xlwb vans on your ramp and be very very careful where you lift on a laden van with a 2 post ramp.
Get used to doing wheel bearings and gearboxes.
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stealthstylz
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 14,812
Club RR Member Number: 174
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First things first if you're working on vans - is the ceiling high enough to actually get them on a ramp? Seen more than a few people fall foul of this.
Unless there's a time limit on when you can spend the money I'd just buy stuff as the job comes along so it pays for itself. Delivery is so quick now it's not a massive issue.
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slater
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 6,390
Club RR Member Number: 78
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Oct 19, 2020 18:13:11 GMT
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I've spent the last 5 or so years furnishing my workshop. Really it's a mixture of ebay buys, auction buys and a very small amount of new stuff. Some stuff you want quality old british made stuff. Other times the cheapest Chinese stuff is best.
As mentioned a 2 post 4 tonner is the ultimate. Hydraulic with the floor clear of obstacles to get in the way of low cars (or just moving stuff around! don't underestimate how annoying lifts with chains and curse word running between the two posts get.) Biggest issue with these is the condition off the floor. You need 160mm of decent concrete slab or you will have to dig foundations. Obviously height could be an issue with van's too but most Bradbury style hydraulic lifts can have the top bar raised if needs be. Just the roof to worry about.
Engine cranes and stuff, generally just buy a chinese one. Theres nothing too them! Just get one that folds away neatly. Same for Jack's and trans Jack's and stuff. Be careful of companies pricing up stuff. You can usually buy the same Chinese jack for anywhere from 100 to 500 quid. Always hunt out the cheapest seller and check what items are basically all the same regardless of price. It's hardly worth buying second hand.
Deffo budget for a floor standing press. If you get one with an integral ram and pump they are alot more compact than ones with separate pump. A air over oil press is probably a bit of a luxury but great if you use it regularly..
I like the Chinese bandsaws peddled by SIP and the like. The ones with coolant etc. They are nice and compact and take up little space. Can be rolled out when you need it rather than being a permanent fixture. You may not have the capacity to cut massive billets but sounds like your not going to be a machine shop so that probably doesnt matter. Otherwise they do most jobs well. Also you can use them as a vertical bandsaw if you make a plate up.
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slater
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 6,390
Club RR Member Number: 78
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Oct 19, 2020 18:23:05 GMT
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Pillar drill you want an old school machine. Fobco 7/8ths, Pollard or Herbert. don't waste your time with modern stuff unless it's a top of the range gear head thing but really you don't need it. 100quid will buy you what you need.
Tyre machines pay for themselves very quickly if you do alot of wheel and tyre stuff.
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slater
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 6,390
Club RR Member Number: 78
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Oct 19, 2020 18:34:07 GMT
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R-tech will sort you out with a decent welder.
As for storage don't underestimate how much you need. Biggest issue I always have is space. Secound hand dexion and stuff can be picked up for good money. Look for clean stuff rather then rusty old junk. Modern stuff is clip together which sounds good but I'm not sure it actually saves much time. Its not like it gets changed every day. I'd reccomend finding a decent lot of big euro boxes at an auction. Then get some dexion and set it up appropriately. Cheap simple and neat solution. Once you start messing about with odd boxes and even the dreaded cardboard box it's time to have a rethink lol.. oh and if you don't want to pay for euro boxes the supermarkets do a good line in stackable crates. Separate your storage from your work area. Only tools and consumables should be stored in the workshop. Once you start piling up car bits in there you're in trouble
To be fair I could talk for days about what to do but really alot of it depends what you want/know how to do and what space you have and all that kind of thing. If you have to ask if you need somthing or not I think you need more experience before you think about half this stuff. Biggest thing I've learnt is not to jump in and buy a load of stuff in the first few weeks. Get a premises. Fix the roof. Decorate it. Make a plan. Get the basics and see how you go. You will soon see what you actually need. Some workshops I go in they don't even have a pillar drill but then they probably don't know how to use one!
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skinnylew
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 5,546
Club RR Member Number: 11
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Oct 23, 2020 23:11:14 GMT
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Second that on the racking and boxes. I managed to get some racking from a Renault/Honda/Subaru dealership that was closing down beneath my Dad's office. Cleared out 4 bays of heavy duty pallet racking and 6 bays of dexion racking the day before it started to be demolished! (My mate had a bigger garage so had the blue stuff) Also I work for the council and the recycling boxes are a good alternative and hold a fair amount (not weight wise) and stack ok. I probably have....actually best not to share that methinks (they also make great loft boxes!!)
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Last Edit: Oct 23, 2020 23:18:21 GMT by skinnylew
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I’m absolutely not a professional mechanic, but fwiw here’s my two penny worth...
You’re going to be spending 40+ hours every week at your workshop, so make it a nice place to be. Don’t underestimate the positive/negative effect of your working environment. Also a clean, bright, tidy workshop creates a good first impression with customers and let’s you charge a bit more...think of your expectations of a grubby ‘back street’ garage compared with a main dealer workshop. I’d suggest this extends to things like clean overalls. Doesn’t have to be spotless fresh laundered whites, but how will you feel just being able to pull on something clean each morning that doesn’t reek of yesterday’s brake fluid and anti freeze!
A tidy workshop also means you can work faster. Shaving 5 mins off each working hour because your tools are to hand and you can find everything is almost a 10% pay rise!
What about a seat/stool to sit on while working? No one said work has to be uncomfortable. Companies pay £000s to do ‘display screen evaluations’ for their office workers to make sure the ergonomics are right. Just cos you’re doing mechanicing doesn’t mean you shouldn’t apply some ‘human factors’.
Good luck with the new enterprise!
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Welder. Get an R-Tech. I've tried a few and owned 3. The R-Tech is complimentary and makes me look better than I am. Great for spares availability. You can even ring up for a set of guideline setting to get you started on unfamiliar work, free.
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lightyearman
Part of things
GYJDM - Grimsby based Japanese car club - Find us on Facebook
Posts: 639
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To everyone that has taken the time to reply - massive and humble thanks. It's given me a lot to think about and reminded me of a few basics I've overlooked (one of which being work seats! A vinyl wheelie office chair is invaluable.)
I'm really pleased that feedback tends to be favouring older, secondhand machinery. I wanted to go down that route because of my belief that things did tend to be made better back in the day and that usually a secondhand industrial bit of kit will outlast a new 'hobby' item. It didn't even cross my mind that these older bits will be easier to get parts for and have professionally serviced so that's a double virtue. What's the going rate for a decent old 4 ton 2 poster?
In a good news / bad news kind of situation - I've been accepted for a unit, but thanks to lockdown it looks like I wont get the lease and keys till December. I know I just need to be patient but I'm chomping at the bit.
The unit is freshly refurbished so its water tight, with a new consumer unit and LED lighting so with all my torches / wands and work lights I should be alright. It has a new roller shutter and pedestrian access door and the compound it is on is currently being fitted with an electric gate and a new CCTV system so it's about as safe as I can hope for.
Speaking of safe, I have no reason to stick with Makita for cordless power tools now as someone kindly relieved me of the ones I had from my garage at home...
I'm planning on painting the floor with a decent garage paint before I get in, maybe a light blue or grey to make it easier to find things that drop and in keeping with the broken window theory it keeps the mojo for maintaining it to a tidy state. I'm going to partition a small amount of space off as an office / upholstery room that I can have my sisters sewing machines in. She is a seamstress and wants to sublet a bit of space. It makes sense because we are intending on using her for all the fabric work like we have done so far. I'm also thinking of building a timber mezzanine for storage of consumables and timber.
In a weird stroke of luck, the compound my unit is owned by a chap who specialises in self storage, meaning all the spare land behind the workshops is being filled with ISO containers. I'm hoping to get one of them for storage of useful bits and bobs, maybe breaking Transporters and Traffics as they crop up.
Thanks again for the advice and please keep it coming
Andy
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'89 Honda CRX siR Glassroof Flint black fully restored track beasty '90 Nissan S13 Pignose - pass the mig wire '86 Mini - matt orange, 13" Wellers, Project 2018 '97 LDV Convoy home built camper/tramper van '04 Saab 9-5 Aero HOT. Anyone want it? '91 Honda VFR400 NC30 17,000 km from new '87 Honda XR80 4 stroke baby crosser '03 Mini Cooper S - honestly, they are fun... '15 VW T5.1 LWB daily brick
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i would agree with buying old solid gear, i once bought a shiny new £350 SIP mig welder, it was the worst welder I have ever experienced as it turns out. Replaced it with a 1984 beat-up HOBART which welds like a dream. My pressure washer is from 1985. I bought it 2nd hand 13 years ago ! Get a forklift if you can, they are well handy. Get a Plasma cutter, good one not a horrible one that doesn't cut neatly. Get an oxy-propane set up for the inevitable bolt that won't come undone (Or maybe one of those fancy induction heaters) get an infra red heater for warming of humans rather than trying to heat the whole building. make sure you have lots of racking to put stuff on to get it off the floor. get an air compressor thats the vane or screw type, much quieter.
good luck!
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69 Plymouth Fury Convertible 75 Range Rover 2 door 82 Range Rover 4 door 84 Range Rover 4 door 78 Datsun 120Y 2 door 78 Datsun 120Y Coupe 78 Datsun 620 Pickup 81 Datsun Urvan E23 86 Datsun Vanette van 98 Electric Citroen Berlingo 00 Electric Peugeot Partner 02 Electric Citroen Berlingo 76 Honda C50 04 Berlingo Multispace petrol 07 Land Rover 130 15 Nissan E-NV200 15 Fiat Ducato
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glenanderson
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,072
Club RR Member Number: 64
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Nov 30, 2020 12:14:21 GMT
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Separate your storage from your work area. Only tools and consumables should be stored in the workshop. Once you start piling up car bits in there you're in trouble Lots of really good points/advice in this thread, but this one is the one that I'd echo the loudest. I have spent decades struggling with separate (and distant) storage lockups, with my stuff randomly scattered between them and a huge amount of stuff cluttering the workshop because the lockups weren't easy to access. Over the last five or six years I have slowly built and organised a separate lean-to storage area adjacent to my main workshop and moved everything to one site. I have finally got the actual workspace to the stage where it's (almost) just tools, machinery and the space in which to use them, with the only things on the bench being the stuff that's actually being worked on. I still have to wheel the motorcycles out of the way to work until I have built a separate garage for them to live in, but I'm getting there. Try and keep the workspace clear if you can, because the half-hour getting everything moved out before you can start work, and the half hour at the end of the day cramming everything back in again is an hour you're going to be wasting not working. Good luck!
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My worst worry about dying is my wife selling my stuff for what I told her it cost...
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