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Morning all, talking about MIG here, I haven’t gas welded for years, and never tried TIG Anyone got any good tips for this? My welding isn’t particularly pretty at the best of times, but it’s not letting go. However when I get to the underside of sill repairs, bottom of chassis rails etc it looks like pigeon **** I’m not changing settings, and the welds on horizontal downwards or vertical panels aren’t too bad, but upside down I’m more likely to set fire to myself than anything, and I get ‘blobs’ of weld that are trying to follow gravity So far the best way I’ve found is multiple tacks joined together, but there’s got to be a better way I’ve jot a rotisserie for my mk2 cortina, but turning a six wheel Range Rover upside down whilst it’s complete or otherwise isn’t going to happen TIA
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My top tips are pretty obvious - but get the areas that you are welding has clean as you possibly can - like bright shiny clean - a good earthing point - ensuring that the MIG wire is clean & spooling correctly along with a good gas flow - it's never easy when laid on your back under the car but get has comfortable as possible even to the point of a dry run i.e. ensuring that can freely access the weld areas with the gun rather than pointing in general direction pressing the trigger and ending up with a mess - quite often if you trial a dry run first you can gain what will be the better angle to make the weld from - Finally back lighting - a strong back light will help significantly in you being able see what's happening and what direction you are heading in rather than a 'guess, point & shoot - quite often missing'
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Last Edit: May 18, 2020 9:02:22 GMT by Deleted
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I find that turning the wire speed up helps a bit. I prefer to try to arrange things so I can weld down from above the panel, if I can, but that isn't always possible.
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I find cleanliness is the real problem, you can clean up the surface but generally not the other side or in between seams as soon as it gets hot old wax / underseal etc seems to leech out and get in the weld, A slightly higher current and series of short overlapping bursts (sometimes stopping to clean again) seems to work best for me.
As said above I always try to weld from above, even if it means cutting something out to gain access and welding it back in again.
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lebowski
Part of things
Hillman Avenger, Clan Clover
Posts: 476
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Try and cover your ears. Nothing gets you moving quicker than the sound of a bit of spatter entering your ear canal!
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moglite
Part of things
Posts: 815
Club RR Member Number: 144
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Welding upside down moglite
@moglite
Club Retro Rides Member 144
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May 18, 2020 10:52:54 GMT
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As others have said spotless prep, and get yourself comfortable. I find something to rest my head on helps. Lots of light, and snip off the ball from the MiG wire, so you get a quick clean start to the arc. Portwest Jacket and balaclava or similar are essential IMHO. Welder settings stay the same for me, but I give it a little more gas.
Oh and try and position your repair panels/body/arm so you aren't directly overhead. Welding on your back at 45degrees to everything isn't so bad.
Hope it helps
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1967 Morris Oxford Traveller 1979 Toyota LandCruiser BJ40 1993 Daimler Double Six 2007 Volvo XC70 2.4D
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rbs
Part of things
Posts: 64
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May 18, 2020 12:23:04 GMT
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Try and cover your ears. Nothing gets you moving quicker than the sound of a bit of spatter entering your ear canal! Been there and done that. Makes one hell of a sizzle and then you get a sore head as you jump up so fast you smack your head on something. (Usually dense and sharp)
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May 18, 2020 12:25:28 GMT
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Thanks all, yes I’ve done the blob of weld in your ear/up your sleeve/ melting it’s way through your shoe/hitting an unseen area of contamination and having it explode in a bright firework! It hurts! I’ve always tried to get it as clean as possible, I guess it’s just another area of practice practice practice! I’ll try some of the ideas next time, but the cortina is definitely going on the rotisserie, I’m dead keen on the idea of welding the underside the right way up! 👍
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as soon as it gets hot old wax I'm getting that at the moment. Lots and lots of original wax in box sections. Not enough to have stopped it rusting, but enough to get in the way now I'm trying to repair it. Presumably it rusted from the outside.
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as soon as it gets hot old wax I'm getting that at the moment. Lots and lots of original wax in box sections. Not enough to have stopped it rusting, but enough to get in the way now I'm trying to repair it. Presumably it rusted from the outside. yeah, know that feeling too
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May 19, 2020 10:04:39 GMT
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Yeah I've found a smidge more wire speed makes the difference between actually getting something stuck and just dripping beads of molten metal on you. Never managed to get it to look nice, but it's stuck at least.
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May 19, 2020 12:40:58 GMT
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its good to see how others do a bit of mig welding, I would reccomend the "nitrosilvia" youtube channel, in the uk and he is welding up various rovers explaining the process as he goes, you will learn a lot from it.
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samta22
Club Retro Rides Member
Stuck in once more...
Posts: 1,272
Club RR Member Number: 32
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Welding upside down samta22
@samta22
Club Retro Rides Member 32
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May 19, 2020 13:10:51 GMT
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its good to see how others do a bit of mig welding, I would reccomend the "nitrosilvia" youtube channel, in the uk and he is welding up various rovers explaining the process as he goes, you will learn a lot from it. Oh James... In addition to the channel - jimspolicev8sd1 threads on here are also worth a read... before he got all video obsessed and went quiet on us
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'37 Austin 7 '56 Austin A35 '58 Austin A35 '65 Triumph Herald 12/50 '69 MGB GT '74 MGB GT V8'73 TA22 Toyota Celica restoration'95 Mercedes SL320 '04 MGTF 135 'Cool Blue' (Mrs' Baby) '05 Land Rover Discovery 3 V8 '67 Abarth 595 (Mrs' runabout) '18 Disco V
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slater
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 6,390
Club RR Member Number: 78
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Welding upside down slater
@slater
Club Retro Rides Member 78
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don't try an weld a continuous bead. Use a pulsed technique. Higher current but pulse it on and off. Can be done with your finger or a setting on the welder if you have it.
Infact that's the technique I'd use for all bodywork. You don't want more heat than you need.
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v8ian
Posted a lot
Posts: 3,757
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May 20, 2020 10:09:24 GMT
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I have been welding up dailies for the last 40years, Things have improved over the years, my Dailys are of much better quality now, I taught myself the hard way on my Superspeed Anglia, Mig welders were quite an exotic DIY thing then, and OxyAcetalene was the norm for welding, I borrowed a set of bottles, and proceeded to weld up the swan neck on my anglia, (a well known rot spot under the car), with not a lot of room, a torch with a flame of about 3500degs that will cut thru your body without much bother, a 1 metre length of 3mm filler wire that will catch on everything, remember you don't have a way to instantly turn off the heat either, .... What can go wrong Imagine the car is up on Halfords finest midget sized axle stands, so there's about 12" of air under the car, wiggle under, light and set the gas, weld up the offending piece, discard spent filer rods as they are used, need to change position to get at the next bit, roll over onto one very hot discarded stub, burn straight thru your T shirt, into your fat, which is supposed to be your "Passion Handle" and create a very nice yellow/pink crater in your fat, 12mm deep and wide, with a black crusty edge, no blood as it was nicely quarterized and that wonderful smell...... not helped by having a flame in one hand and having rolled onto this, wedged my hip against the car, Funny thing was, after this incident I went and bought a MiG welder. Ah, Back to the story, gas welding is good for welding upside down and if you are mig welding, pulse the arc...
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Last Edit: May 20, 2020 10:10:46 GMT by v8ian
Atmo V8 Power . No slicks , No gas + No bits missing . Doing it in style. Austin A35van, very different------- but still doing it in style, going to be a funmoble
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May 20, 2020 10:52:36 GMT
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Aaah yes, the smell of burning flesh.... Not something you forget easily 🤬
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May 20, 2020 12:03:54 GMT
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" Smell that son, that...smell of frying fat, I love that smell in the morning, its the smell of ...welding. One day this resto will be over, one day...."
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Needs a bigger hammer mate.......
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May 20, 2020 21:15:51 GMT
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Try and cover your ears. Nothing gets you moving quicker than the sound of a bit of spatter entering your ear canal! And that is the truth.....nasty sizzling noise.... pain. The irresistable urge to batter your head on the floor and bottom of the car. If that's not bad enough, it can also perforate your eardrum - which is really bad...... And I hate the smell of my flesh burning, even if it is a bit like bacon. I agree with Slater. Pulse technique. Or overlapping tacks. Best method for lots of thin metal welding, but especially upside down. Nick
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1967 Triumph Vitesse convertible (old friend) 1996 Audi A6 2.5 TDI Avant (still durability testing) 1972 GT6 Mk3 (Restored after loong rest & getting the hang of being a car again)
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May 20, 2020 21:46:02 GMT
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Personally I don't find welding upside down much harder than the right way up although that might be years of practice welding sills on minis!
As mentioned above cleanliness is the key, it has to be bright shiny metal and even then welding new steel to new steel under a car is alwasy easier than new steel to old steel in my experience.
If the weld is very blobby then drops down then you probably need more wire and less power, I know it seem counter intutive to add more wire but I've found this helps as you are melting the wire too quickly and its dropping off rather than sticking.
Also you have to weld thin steel as a series of tacks, continuous welding on thin steel just causes distortion and eventually you will blow through.
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May 23, 2020 15:35:22 GMT
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, discard spent filer rods as they are used, You had too much money, I was always told to leave the short piece stuck to the weld, weld your next rod to it then carry on as there's no waste that way..... On the subject of burning flesh I cut the nerves in a finger years ago and had very little in the way of sensation in it for years, I once rested it on something hot without realising till it began to smell.
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Last Edit: May 23, 2020 15:40:07 GMT by dodgerover
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