Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,883
Club RR Member Number: 39
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If you are getting the fill for £60 and only using 2 fills with free delivery then it stacks up in your favour to use Hobbyweld deal. Looking locally to me the 20L bottles are £80 I am surprised that you use so little gas - must be a Northerner thing using as little as he can get away with  |
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 All the component parts that had come off the car plus several boxes of spares that Bill had brought over were just piled in the corner of the workshop - its not how I work - I like things out the way but where I can put my hands on them at any one time - I sorted through everything - condensed the boxes - separated the parts that I will need from the ones I don't - down to parts that are ready to refit / parts that require cleaning / painting to parts that require refurb work - I would normally have a couple of shelves available upstairs in the stores but to say I'm currently at maximum capacity up there is a total understatement - so with a tidy workshop I could crack on with the profiling of the bodywork  Its boring beyond comprehension  But no one else is going get it done so I had better just dig in  Prepped the sill / door apertures for profiling on the nearside  All the panels that I'm currently working on are all now reskimmed with the second application   On the spanner front the new rear handbrake cable was fitted - there is also a handbrake cable at the front which has already been replaced  The two cables are linked by a rod which has just gone into paint  Various smaller components / parts were painted satin black & left to cure overnight - In other things the NSF door was stripped o its fittings and is ready for paint prep More tomorrow |
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Last Edit: Dec 6, 2019 21:42:38 GMT by Deleted
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If you are getting the fill for £60 and only using 2 fills with free delivery then it stacks up in your favour to use Hobbyweld deal. Looking locally to me the 20L bottles are £80 I am surprised that you use so little gas - must be a Northerner thing using as little as he can get away with I get a bit of trade discount with my welding supplier - I only use him for my gas / wire / welding bits but I also purchased my MIG through him (which is now back with him for repair) - he tends to look after his clients and is very fair |
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Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,883
Club RR Member Number: 39
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If you are getting the fill for £60 and only using 2 fills with free delivery then it stacks up in your favour to use Hobbyweld deal. Looking locally to me the 20L bottles are £80 I am surprised that you use so little gas - must be a Northerner thing using as little as he can get away with I get a bit of trade discount with my welding supplier - I only use him for my gas / wire / welding bits but I also purchased my MIG through him (which is now back with him for repair) - he tends to look after his clients and is very fair Sounds like he has similar ethic to you then. And I will also make a small revision - "using only as much as he needs to" Keep the updates coming |
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Last Edit: Dec 6, 2019 22:25:59 GMT by Darkspeed
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A little more research into the welding gas market reveals the following The 9 litre Hobbyweld bottle is filled to 137 Bar pressure - The equalelvent BOC bottle is filled to 230 Bar pressure hence returns a better value for money option but once you have taken the BOC bottle rental cost into account probably not - Hobbyweld advise that the 9 litre bottle should on average cover around 100 minutes of MIG welding - sounds ok but that's less than 2 hours and anyone with anything like a serious project can easily get through 2 hours of welding in a weekend - the other angle to look at is anyone that is using the small disposable gas cartridge type bottles - a 9 litre bottle is equalelvent to 23 of the small disposable bottles @ circa £10 + each = £230 vs £40 for a 9 litre Hobbyweld bottle (there is an initial one off bottle deposit of circa £100 which is refundable) The other interesting fact comes with 20 litre bottles - BOC fill their bottles to 230 Bar whereas Hobbyweld fill theirs to 300 Bar therefore giving a far better value for money option over BOC - and that's why I only get through a couple of the Hobbyweld bottles per annum  |
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Last Edit: Dec 7, 2019 7:59:19 GMT by Deleted
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Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,883
Club RR Member Number: 39
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The 20L HP Hobby weld are filled to the same 230Bar - hobbyweld.co.uk/home/hobbyweld-plus-range/ - If you get through a couple of bottles a year there is nothing much in it price wise and if you use more then BOC Volkzone is a better way. Gauges pressures on fills are often much higher. The Hobby weld 9L are good value if you do not do much welding, the odd sill or patch in a year. You are very unlikely to get through 1233 litres of gas in 2 hours in a weekend as that's trigger time and the 2 hours is 10L flow. I generally use 7-8 l/m which makes it 2.75 hours. If I guess that I weld at 250mm / min that's 40m of welding per bottle. TIG and Argon though is another matter entirely you shift a lot of gas - and I would not fancy Hobbyweld for TIG as that would really work out expensive. |
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The 20L HP Hobby weld are filled to the same 230Bar - hobbyweld.co.uk/home/hobbyweld-plus-range/ - If you get through a couple of bottles a year there is nothing much in it price wise and if you use more then BOC Volkzone is a better way. Gauges pressures on fills are often much higher. The Hobby weld 9L are good value if you do not do much welding, the odd sill or patch in a year. You are very unlikely to get through 1233 litres of gas in 2 hours in a weekend as that's trigger time and the 2 hours is 10L flow. I generally use 7-8 l/m which makes it 2.75 hours. If I guess that I weld at 250mm / min that's 40m of welding per bottle. TIG and Argon though is another matter entirely you shift a lot of gas - and I would not fancy Hobbyweld for TIG as that would really work out expensive. I use the Hobbyweld Ultra bottle range - filled to 300 Bar: hobbyweld.co.uk/home/hobbyweld-ultra-range/The Hobbyweld plus range bottles are filled to 230 Bar - its confusing because the 20 litre Plus bottles & 20 Litre Ultra bottles are the same size |
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Hmm mm. ... if they have changed thier gas content to match BOC then I might have to rethink when my bottle runs out.
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Hmm mm. ... if they have changed thier gas content to match BOC then I might have to rethink when my bottle runs out. Mark - For both suppliers its the same breakdown in content - Argon 93% / Co2 5% / Oxygen 2% - if you are obtaining better results with the BOC product it would suggest that BOC are supplying a better / higher quality gas - unless it was the Hobbyweld 15 you tried which is intended for the more industrial market 7mm + welding thickness and would yield a harder weld bead - Hobbyweld 5 is produced for the light fabrication / vehicle repair market of sub 7mm thickness welding |
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Chris, No, I last looked into it about 2 years ago when I got a new contract with BOC. I looked at the local supplier and the gas levels were different - research on forums confirmed the harder welds etc. Also the numbers short term did not stack up. In the past I used to have a spare Y bottle from BOC so took it back after a month so got my rent free  but my new bottle will last me 10 years so I might need to send it back full  as over £500 rent for £40 gas is not a viable option. I'd really like a much smaller bottle because of size/weight so if the gas is the same the hobbyweld will be better for the future. |
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Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,883
Club RR Member Number: 39
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Those Ultra cylinder fills are much more interesting and could be a bit of a game changer - especially as complete with reg - If you are getting a 20L at 300bar for £60 its an utter no brainer that's 1p a litre which is the same as a BOC cylinder excluding the rental! - I cannot find the Ultra local to me but as the Plus was £80 - I doubt if I could get an Ultra for £60 and then the downside is that local Hobbyweld stockists are few and far between around here. I will be looking into it though.
Looking on line the Ultra is £80 exc. but has a hefty £205 deposit so for me that first bottle would be £280 - and if I have two bottle a year that's a first year of £360 - it now does not look so sharp especially as I have Argon and Argoshield - so the first year 4 bottle would be £410 deposit + £160 5% and then another probably £200+ for the Argon - £770 + VAT Would not work for me as I cannot get the prices you have access to.
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Last Edit: Dec 7, 2019 18:30:45 GMT by Darkspeed
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A few bits of progress today  Most of which was progressing the profiling  Some of which is complete  Other areas are on the third skimming  The areas that are skimmed with a mustard colour is a glaze (a very fine detail filler / self levelling)  Meanwhile I need to strip the lamps & brightwork from the front of the car  I had to drill some of the screws out due to them being seized  Some small areas of perforation to attend to   The side lamp / indictor units are non genuine - but they are shot the backings are rusting out and the seals US - turns out that they are early MG Midget / Sprite units - £60 each but a little more research and it looks the MGB chrome bumper front lamps would suffice and they are available at little over £20 each |
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Last Edit: Dec 7, 2019 19:53:27 GMT by Deleted
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Those Ultra cylinder fills are much more interesting and could be a bit of a game changer - especially as complete with reg - If you are getting a 20L at 300bar for £60 its an utter no brainer that's 1p a litre which is the same as a BOC cylinder excluding the rental! - I cannot find the Ultra local to me but as the Plus was £80 - I doubt if I could get an Ultra for £60 and then the downside is that local Hobbyweld stockists are few and far between around here. I will be looking into it though. Looking on line the Ultra is £80 exc. but has a hefty £205 deposit so for me that first bottle would be £280 - and if I have two bottle a year that's a first year of £360 - it now does not look so sharp especially as I have Argon and Argoshield - so the first year 4 bottle would be £410 deposit + £160 5% and then another probably £200+ for the Argon - £770 + VAT Would not work for me as I cannot get the prices you have access to. I think its all a bit academic, as if we cannot get the prices that Chris has quoted then it clearly doesn't make it as attractive as the deal that he says he gets. I, like you Darkspeed use argon as well as argoshield.. Obviously if I can get it cheaper then great. I will have a phone call to the area hobbyweld stockists and see what prices are quoted and see how keen they really are for more business. Fingers crossed they want the business.
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Last Edit: Dec 7, 2019 21:48:47 GMT by Deleted
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glenanderson
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,361
Club RR Member Number: 64
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I also have a Y size bottle on the Volkzone deal. I find it lasts me 2-3 years, unless I embark on a particularly major project. It still works out significantly cheaper, in my experience, to pay the annual rental than to pay for disposable bottles. I don’t have a handy Hobbyweld outlet, and the BOC one isn’t far away, so that factors into things too. I also used to play the “save the rental” game by using off-ticket bottles, but that all came to an end when they started bar-coding the bottles a few years ago. I miss the convenience of having oxy-acetylene on site, but not enough to pay what it costs. A decent propane torch can get stuff cherry red, and that’s enough for my purposes these days.
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My worst worry about dying is my wife selling my stuff for what I told her it cost...
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Some small areas of perforation to attend to It never ends ! 😂 |
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Tempted to throw in with bottle sizes ranging from A-F and $AU just to make things more confusing!  Most places here have a one off refundable deposit rather than a yearly rental fee.. The mm/min maths is interesting, though. Might have to re-evaluate the bottle size I go for.. |
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I like the statement from you Grumpy, "but no one else is going to do it, so I might as well get started" or something to that effect...
aint it the truth!
great work on the skim coats...
JP
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I know its spelled Norman Luxury Yacht, but its pronounced Throat Wobbler Mangrove!
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I also have a Y size bottle on the Volkzone deal. I find it lasts me 2-3 years, unless I embark on a particularly major project. It still works out significantly cheaper, in my experience, to pay the annual rental than to pay for disposable bottles. I don’t have a handy Hobbyweld outlet, and the BOC one isn’t far away, so that factors into things too. I also used to play the “save the rental” game by using off-ticket bottles, but that all came to an end when they started bar-coding the bottles a few years ago. I miss the convenience of having oxy-acetylene on site, but not enough to pay what it costs. A decent propane torch can get stuff cherry red, and that’s enough for my purposes these days. They only seem to barcode the plastic collar on the top, which is removable............... |
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glenanderson
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,361
Club RR Member Number: 64
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They only seem to barcode the plastic collar on the top, which is removable............... My dealer is quite hot on physically checking the bottles as they come in. I have seen him refuse ones that he considers tampered with. No idea if he just checks the code, or if there’s other telltales he picks up on. Maybe it’s just a hunch, or a customer that he thinks is dodgy. I was quite happy to make use of the loophole while it lasted, but I can’t be fox-pictured these days to be honest. 🤣 |
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My worst worry about dying is my wife selling my stuff for what I told her it cost...
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A few back burner bits done - the car is a week or so away from receiving fresh paint and in my book there is nothing worse than having fresh paint on car and then having to go about de-rusting / abrading / preparing other smaller parts in the same workshop - Ideally I always plan it so that any work of this nature is done before the paint goes on the car - it also makes the fitting up process much easier - rather than being held up waiting for paint to dry on parts that could be bolted on  The draught proofing to the steering column & column gear shift was fitted along with the repainted retaining shroud - leave the draught proofing out and it makes for a very uncomfortable journey has the draught goes straight up your trouser leg  New blanking plates required to cover the factory body mounting which is welded to the chassis - the old plates were full of rust perforation - note that I applied cavity wax to the void before closing it off with the plates - body caulking also applied - the new plates have been primed & painted on the underside - I will apply etching primer to the entire floor area now before it receives a coat of satin black  Original headlining from which I removed the retaining hoops  Care is required at this point - they vary in shape & size from front to back  Hence my tagged numbering system  Critically with steel headlining hoops is that they get de-rusted - the headlining in the Javelin is wool - its pointless installing a new headlining then with the slightest whiff of condensation the hoops rusting and staining the headlining - they were rubbed back & Hydrate 80 applied  Once cured etching primer was applied  Stripped the front bumper of its brackets / irons  These will get prepped and go into colour with the rest of the smaller parts  More tomorrow |
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Last Edit: Dec 8, 2019 18:47:48 GMT by Deleted
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but my new bottle will last me 10 years so I might need to send it back full 
as over £500 rent for £40 gas is not a viable option.
